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Tuesday, November 19, 2002
EC/Kindergarten/Primary Chat
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Grace/IL - Paulie, what are some of the specific areas of your work?
Paulie - not sure what u mean Grace
Grace/IL - Hi yuchenhsieh. What do you teach?
yuchenhsieh - I am an English teacher in Taiwan.
yuchenhsieh - Hi, Grace, English
Grace/IL - You said you work with special needs little ones. Are they language impaired, sight problems?
yuchenhsieh - And now I have a problem teaching READING
yuchenhsieh - The class's so dull
Grace/IL - y, are you trying to teach reading to older students?
yuchenhsieh - We've got prenguin readers as my teaching materials
yuchenhsieh - kids are around the age of 11
Paulie - who works with special needs little ones?
Grace/IL - Why do you feel the class is dull?
Grace/IL - Why do you feel the class is dull?
yuchenhsieh - Cuz' I am not sure how to make a reading class exciting
Grace/IL - Paulie, I'm sorry, I guess I got you confused with meeha.
Paulie - yup Meeha works with little ones with sp needs
Grace/IL - y, did you mean Penguin readers? Those are what we call trade books, aren't they?
yuchenhsieh - nope
yuchenhsieh - www.penguinreaders.com
Grace/IL - y, do your students have particular problems -- decoding, comprehension?
yuchenhsieh - That's their site
yuchenhsieh - Yup, of course. There're lots of new words for them.
yuchenhsieh - so they have to look up dictionary all the time
yuchenhsieh - How do teachers in the USA teach reading class?
Paulie - yuc . . . what does your name mean?
yuchenhsieh - Yu-Chen is my given name in Chinese
yuchenhsieh - and Hsieh is my family name
Grace/IL - OK, I did a quick check of their website. It doesn't look as though there's a lot of system to the books.
Paulie - what age level u teach there?
Paulie - was a word meaning some kind of teacher
yuchenhsieh - around 10
Grace/IL - Yu-Chen, you have a marvelous command of English.
yuchenhsieh - I am currently teaching Winner and Losers.
Paulie - so your class doesn't speak English either?
Grace/IL - Are you teaching these children the language along with reading?
yuchenhsieh - Grace, are you the webmaster here or?
Paulie - no webmaster in here
Grace/IL - No webmaster, just a retired first grade teacher.
yuchenhsieh - yup, of course. since English is their our native language.
Grace/IL - What do you do to teach them basic vocabulary so they can comprehend the storybooks you use?
yuchenhsieh - paulie, we speak english and chinese in the class
Paulie - don't understand why they have to constantly use dictionary then
yuchenhsieh - i'll teach them some key words in the story first before we start our reading
Grace/IL - Oops, I missed it. You're not in China but I forgot where.
yuchenhsieh - i am in taiwan
Paulie - well they could pair up and re-read the story to each other
Grace/IL - And English is the basic language in Taiwan?
yuchenhsieh - but some of the kids will not participate in the reading
Paulie - Then u could also talk about beginning, middle and end of story Also about the plot
yuchenhsieh - well, we do encourage students to learn english
Paulie - put them in partner groups so that they encourage each other
yuchenhsieh - paulie, that's a great idea
Paulie - best way to read is to write
yuchenhsieh - yup, i do ask them to retell the story
yuchenhsieh - but how to make the reading class exciting?
Paulie - so maybe they should write about the story, evaluate it, make a different ending, change the characters or wput on a Reader's Theater
Grace/IL - OK, one of the things I'd do if I were in your place is to make lots of little vocabulary cards. For my first graders, I cut out pictures from phonics books, mounted them on heavy cardboard, and labeled them.
Paulie - put
yuchenhsieh - grace, that;s very nice of you to offer this great idea
Grace/IL - I work with adult ESL students one night a week and we do a lot of basic vocabulary with them -- money, colors, clothing, etc.
Paulie - But, Grace they are probably 4th graders at 10 yrs of age . . .
yuchenhsieh - reader's theater?
Grace/IL - With your younger students, they could arrange some of the cards to create a story and you could help them fill in the words they need.
yuchenhsieh - grace, yup, english classes are always exciting but a reading class is totaly different
Paulie - I would also have them partner up with a Kindergarten class and have them read to their reading buddies once a week
Grace/IL - Paulie, even I would benefit from those kinds of cards when learning another language. We do with our adult classes.
meeha/ece/tx - I get to be back for a few now!
yuchenhsieh - wow, i do get to learn more today here
Paulie - Reader's theater is kinda liek a little play put those two words in a search engine like google.com and you will find many
Paulie - English already
Grace/IL - Another thing I did for adult learners was to put the pictures in folders, label them, and make flash cards for them.
Paulie - WB meeha ((((((meeha))))))
meeha/ece/tx - Get adult learners to take word cards (from class) and place them on corresponding room parts, objects in the home environment ...
yuchenhsieh - grace and paulie, thanks for your advice. i get to prepare for the class and those vomecabulary class now. time for class in no ti
Grace/IL - An activity to help them with word recognition is to give them a vowel pattern as "ea" and have them find all the words they can with that pattern, then sort them according to sounds.
Paulie - Good luck Yuchen
Grace/IL - Carol, I live near the WI border (8 miles). Are you near or far?
Carol/pre K/WI - Grace I live in Madison
meeha/ece/tx - SO, what are we talking about this evening?
Grace/IL - We go past Madison on a regular basis.
meeha/ece/tx - Anything exciting happening in classes this week? My p.m. class is busy preparing a harvest feaast!
Grace/IL - It's rather nice. Once in a while someone sends an email from here.
Carol/pre K/WI - this week we are doing transportation and next week we will be doing Hmong new year activities
meeha/ece/tx - Hmong -- what activities will that include, Carol?
Grace/IL - Do you have lots of Hmong students in your class?
Grace/IL - Paulie, you're looking in the pink this evening.
meeha/ece/tx - We've been talking "HARVEST" ... my afternoon class (fairly advanced) is making a "full" harvest feast ... today we made cornbread ... tomorrow cranberry sauce, pumpkin pies ... Thursday cornbread stuffing ... Friday we share our feast!
Carol/pre K/WI - The children will make their own story clothes and we will be starting to learn how to count in Hmong
meeha/ece/tx - Next Tuesday evening we'll be talking about December ideas
Paulie - are your conferences/report cards over?
meeha/ece/tx - IEP Progress notes went home this past Friday ... conferences come up as needed in my class. You?
Grace/IL - Oh, ding it! What do you mean by story clothes?
Paulie - yes email addy complete in 2nd box and it doesn't work
Grace/IL - Will they dress in Hmong costume?
Paulie - 'scuse my ignorance what is Hmong?
Carol/pre K/WI - A story cloth is a cloth were the Hmong usually women have sewn that tells a story about there culture
Paulie - no conferences for me! lol
Grace/IL - Looks like Carol is momentarily lost. If I'm correct, Hmong are Vietnamese people.
Paulie - wow and little kids can make them?
Carol/pre K/WI - We have traditional dress clothing available in the house area
Grace/IL - Lots of Hmong people have settled in central and northern Wisconsin.
meeha/ece/tx - Carol, what will the kiddos make their story cloths with? Paper? Unbleached muslin? something else?
Grace/IL - Hi Addie
Addie/mo - hi everyone
Paulie - o
meeha/ece/tx - (((((Addie)))))
Paulie - AOL is laying off people
Carol/pre K/WI - Hmong are not Vietnamese The Hmong are they mountain people of Loas
Addie/mo - (((meeha)))
Paulie - hi Addie
Addie/mo - hi paulie
Grace/IL - Thank you, Carol. I was in the right part of the world LOL.
Paulie - traditional for Hmong?
Carol/pre K/WI - We will use paper and stickers. and different shapes to make a pattern broder
Addie/mo - if you want to incorporate another story about a story cloth, read the black snowman. it is from africa.
Paulie - How many years have u done this Carol? Did you get help from Moms?
meeha/ece/tx - Carol, it sounds like an activity the children will enjoy ... hope you have fun with hit!
meeha/ece/tx - Addie -- what is the "listening level" for the black snowman?
Paulie - the Black Snowman? O I have to get that book
meeha/ece/tx - Hi vic!
vic - hey meeha
Paulie - This is so slow in here again -- hoep it doesn't quit like in the past
Addie/mo - i am not sure. i read it to my kindergartners, but i remember that there were words and things that i had to stop and explain
Carol/pre K/WI - Have done this for the last three years I have had between 8 - 12 Hmong children in my classroom
Paulie - hi Vic
vic - I know that our first grade teachers read the Black Snowman in their rooms.
meeha/ece/tx - Oh, too bad ... I might have tried it ... but with the limited vocabularies and receptive skills most of my kiddos have, I just don't know!
Paulie - Addie do u know the author?
vic - hi Paulie
Grace/IL - what a beautiful way to honor their culture!
meeha/ece/tx - I may look at it and see if there is a way to bring it to the level of my kiddos, though.
Paulie - Carol sounds like a neat learnign experience
Addie/mo - it is about these black boys that live in a slum area basically. one of them is very ungrateful for what they have (which isnt much), they build a snowman out of the slush and the one boy doesnt like it because it is black. they also find this scrap of material, which is an old kente cloth, or story cloth that they put on the snowmand and it comes to life. kind of a frosty the snowman element.
Addie/mo - i cant remember the author, but i can check on amazon. brb
Paulie - This board si not working again
vic - Just a quick update from last week. Remember I whined about a student attacking me? I've been off work ever since. I finally get to go back tomorrow.
Carol/pre K/WI - It is and the more a learn about the culture the more relevant I can make their classroom experiences
meeha/ece/tx - vic -- I don't remember -- but I'm glad you're going back!
vic - Thanks meeha
Paulie - I collect snowmen books I need that one too! lol I never heard of it
meeha/ece/tx - Paulie, it is kind of slow, but seems to be working for me -- sorry it is giving you trouble tonite. (I've missed you!)
Addie/mo - the author is phil mendez and amazon says it is for ages 4 to 8
Paulie - (((((Vic))))) How are u doing?
vic - I guess that my little k-3rd graders (all special needs) have been terrorizing the building. Maybe I'll be a little more appreciated. What do you think?
meeha/ece/tx - Maybe so, vic! LOL!!!
Paulie - I get frustrated when I ahve to wait for it to move
Addie/mo - vic, they will probably be glad to have you back
Paulie - Thanks Addie putting that on my Christmas list
vic - Not well paulie, really messed up my back. The MD put me on horrendous pain meds that knocked me out and then told me to go back to work. OK????? Anyway I called him on it today and again he told me to go back to work today. I didn't but I will tomorrow.
meeha/ece/tx - Does anyone have ANY ideas about how to gently lead my building toward compliance where inclusion of 5 year olds into kindergarten is concerned? I just don't think that TEA or feds will see "the kindergarten classes are all at capacity" will cut it where IDEA enforcement is concerned! (The kiddos ONLY go with an assistant -- we don't just drop them into a classroom and leave!)
Paulie - Good for u making your own decision Vic
vic - meeha, have you tried having them just go into specials first?
vic - thanks Paulie, still in a lot of pain, but I need to work, this laying around sleeping isn't helping at all.
meeha/ece/tx - vic -- they really don't get specials in kinder here. tried library, but the librarian told the assistant to bring them right back to the room, they weren't part of the deal (for kinder) they're good kids, too.
Addie/mo - so they are in self-contained? i am surprised that the school wants to hire the additional teachers
Paulie - maybe Addie has some wise words since she is a principal
Addie/mo - how about having the parents demand their rights?
vic - ughhhhh!!!!! meeha, I think that I would have a discussion with my principal about compliance and then tell him/her about the library experience. I had to do that last year for music and the ____ hit the fan.
Addie/mo - the teachers at my previous and current schools have never had a choice about not keeping inclusion kids at specials or in the classroom. everyone has to do what the iep says.
meeha/ece/tx - Addie --yes, my classroom is self-contained preschool for special needs. Children who are old enough for kinder, but not ready can get full-day service in my classroom. Th ey "include" at lunch and occasionally on the playground (when speech ... music therapy ... physical therapy ... occupational therapy ... etc. are not in the way.
Addie/mo - so, after they finish a kindergarten year with you, do they go into first grade with support or do they go into kindergarten?
vic - meeha, do you have any "friends" currently teaching kinder?
Paulie - Meeha, do these kids u want to go to a regular K class have an aide fo with them?
meeha/ece/tx - Oddly enough, the ass't principal's son is one of my 5-year olds ... SHE won't even fight to get them included! I offer suggestions and they don't meet "law"
vic - is that because they aren't "school age?"
meeha/ece/tx - Paulie, the kiddos would ALWAYS have a T.A. with them ... and the request is simply to include them during group language (not lang. arts! not math!) times ... centers, stories, calendar, etc.
Addie/mo - wow, that is really something! i am surprised that the assist princ doesnt want that for her child, but maybe she is afraid of how things would go in a regular classroom if the teachers are not receptive to having the special needs students
meeha/ece/tx - but they ARE school age ...same age as kinder kiddos! One actually came to me FROM kindergarten!
Paulie - falling asleep because nothing is moving again
Carol/pre K/WI - what does their IEPs say
Paulie - good grief How can those teachers say no? something in their contract?
meeha/ece/tx - I think on this campus there is a LOT of lip-service to "inclusion" and "meeting the needs" of sp. needs kiddos
vic - You would think that the asst. principal would know the "law." HMMMMMM.....Maybe a parent meeting to "teach" the parents their rights? I know that we give them the book about their rights, but maybe educating them might help.
Addie/mo - i am just surprised that the teachers have that much power to not include them. i could see having a deal where the aide has to remove the child if he/she becomes disruptive, but otherwise I cannot imagine them just getting to refuse.
meeha/ece/tx - It has to do with class limits (size) ... and ALL k's on our campus are at it! The adm. keep saying they are out-of-compliance with state law if they include my kiddos even for a small portion of the day ... I really don't know that it has been asked of the teachers.
vic - I've been really fortunate in having a former special needs teacher now teaching kinder. so I have no problem integrating my kiddos. In the other grades, it is still like pulling teeth. You really need to get the administration to "force" the issue.
Addie/mo - but, the fact that the school does not have the resources, or personnel or whatever doesnt excuse them from offering the appropriate services. it sounds like they need to add another teacher, reduce the class size and include the children according to their ieps
meeha/ece/tx - Administration seems to be the "block" at this time ... I'm at a loss as to how to address the issue -- but AM ready to start documenting my attempts at inclusion ... then it becomes "someone else's monkey" when have to say why they're not included!
vic - here, here Addie, can we all come and teach for you?
meeha/ece/tx - Their IEPs just say that they will be included with peers "where appropriate" ... lunch room, playground, cafeteria .....
vic - do you have a director of special needs?
Addie/mo - what are they going to do if more k'rs move there? put up a no vacancy sign?
Paulie - How sad
Addie/mo - sure, vic.... i do have a great school, y'all would love it here.
meeha/ece/tx - vic -- yes ... but, I"m a "trouble-maker" (I think) ... don't know how far I'd get! (even with her)
Paulie - I think I will give up my two little words sat there for so long and just would not move onto the message board sigh
meeha/ece/tx - Addie -- if one more Kinder enrolls, they add another section, then the excuse disappears!
Addie/mo - there you go...recruit another kinder! LOL!
Paulie - I will be there Addie! lol
vic - me too meeha, I don't take no for an answer though when it comes to my kiddos. 1st admin, next suport staff, next director of special needs, next superintendent, finally (and I did this last year) report them being out of compliance to the state dept.
Paulie - and now the first aprt of my message disappeared
Addie/mo - dont their ieps specify a number of minutes in spec. ed and in reg. ed?
Carol/pre K/WI - It sounds like an up hill battle but one worth fighting
meeha/ece/tx - I talked to a past-parent this past Friday evening, told him of my "dream" when I "land a windfall" ... to open a day-care/school for children with special needs. Funny thing was -- he has been talking with someone about that very possibililty ... hmmmmm ... maybe the time is right!
meeha/ece/tx - Sure, Addie -- all I'm allowed to write is 6 hours sped -- no general ed included in IEPs NEVER Would make it through ARD if I tried that!
meeha/ece/tx - I think i just missed a PM.
vic - I don't think that there has been enough publicity about "NO Child" yet, and reg. ed. teachers don't know that soon these students will be theirs.
meeha/ece/tx - In the last three years I have learned SO MUCH about how children learn and how we COULD help them be successful ... but
Paulie - I don't agree with full includion. . .
Addie/mo - our ieps are written in minutes/week and they might say something like 640 special ed minutes and 710 regular ed minutes (or something like that...those number dont add up exactly right)
Paulie - inclusion
meeha/ece/tx - I think many teachers want to keep doing what they've always done ... I keep thinking "If we always do what we've always done, we'll always get what we always got!"\
vic - you are right Paulie, if they could handle full inclusion, they wouldn't be special needs.
Addie/mo - paulie, i dont agree with full inclusion either, because there are some children who have such severe problems that they really are not getting much out of regular ed or they create so much of a disruption. but there are lots of options besides just full inclusion
meeha/ece/tx - Paulie, I think my kiddos need the role-models of age-appropriate peers in "social situations" ... we do the language building, the math, the science, etc. They just need to be with peers part of the day to build their social skills and comprehend life in a big class!
Addie/mo - meeha, continuing to do the same thing over and over and expecting different results is one definition of insanity
meeha/ece/tx - nevertheless, Addie, I can't think of a group of people more willing to do it than teachers (based on what I've seen!)
vic - I think that Iowa is going to lose a bunch of teachers next year. New teachers this year have to meet 84 requirements just to get a license. Then they are allowed 1 year to get "up to snuff". If they don't, no Iowa license. Then next year, the rest of us get to do the same. With so many teachers wanting to do what they've always done, I think that they'll be without jobs/teachers by next year.
meeha/ece/tx - ... down to the point of using the same lesson plan book year-after-year ... bringing curriculum down from grade two to kinder ...
Addie/mo - absolutely, meeha, and the "regular" kids need to have the opportunity to interact with the "special needs" kids to learn patience and compassion and many times they learn that kids are kids are kids! it can be a really good experience if enough support is provided to the classroom teacher and appropriate modifications are made
vic - my students have really benefited this year from being included during specials and then for the hour to 2 hours after specials. It is really working well and it has helped my little kinders.
Addie/mo - laminated lesson plans????
meeha/ece/tx - Addie -- based on what I've learned, "general ed" teachers who employ some of the strategies I've learned with their "typical" classes would probably have an easier time trying to reach some of their children, as well!
meeha/ece/tx - nope, just copies, white-out on the dates (or -- now -- "cut and paste") ...
vic - boy have you got that right meeha! Who do they come to for help? It is usually a special needs teacher.
Addie/mo - meeha, that is what the research says...because the teachers will begin looking to meet individual needs in the classroom for other students as they make the modifications for the special needs kids. they learn new strategies instead of the "one size fits all" idea of teaching
meeha/ece/tx - vic -- they come to me -- but they don't implement ANY of the recommendations made
vic - meeha, we have a teacher like that in our building. She really hates integration, but with my administrator, I just fully integrated one of my 2nd graders. She isn't happy about it, but it is what we wrote his IEP up for at his annual review last week.
vic - meeha, I hate that when that happens .
Paulie - tying my other computer
meeha/ece/tx - vic -- I just feel bad for the kids who must struggle with it.
vic - Why ask if they really don't want the help? Appearances?
meeha/ece/tx - working better, Paulie?
Paulie - so far . . .
meeha/ece/tx - vic, I figure eventually someon will try it and see that it works ... even if it IS eighteen weeks later ...
Addie/mo - vic, i second that because sometimes that happens when you are in admin....but mostly people who do that just want to gripe, they dont really want solutions. they say, i already tried that once or that wont work or last year so and so did it, etc. the excuses go on and on. pretty soon i just say, well, good luck, i dont know what else to tell you!
meeha/ece/tx - Glad you're back, Paulie!
Paulie - what I ahte about pullout kids is that the sped teacher gives them candy for doing their work and they bring it to my class and eat it
vic - I have one 1st gr. teacher who is willing to try anything for any of her students. She just came to me last week for materials for 2 little kinders (nieces) who she will begin tutoring. It really validates me when that happens.
Paulie - In 4th gr I ahd 9 pullout kids and that used to make me so mad cause they disrupted the rest of the class when they returned showing it off
meeha/ece/tx - Paulie, ask the SPED teacher to have the children either a.) eat it BEFORE returning to your room or b.) put it IMMEDIATELY into their back-pack (upon re-entry to the classroom)
vic - Good point Paulie.
Paulie - o I did to no avail don't see why they should be rewarded for doing the same kind of elarnign we are doing in the classroom
bette/tx - hello all
Addie/mo - paulie, that would bug me about our speech teacher when i taught because the "give out candy reward" thing was counter to my philosophy. i ended up talking with the teacher and explaining that i felt it was unfair to my other kids and i required that it be put away quietly when they returned to class. i also pulled the children aside and told them my expectations and that worked pretty well.
vic - I'm sure that you run into these same dilemmas every day Addie. You couldn't pay me enough to do what you do!
bette/tx - ((((((((meeha, addie)))))))))
meeha/ece/tx - (((bette)))
bette/tx - hello vic, paulie
Paulie - besides that they were not allowed to go to their back packs til school was over
Addie/mo - ((((bette)))))
Paulie - hmmmmmmm hi bette
vic - hi bette
Paulie - this chat has turned into a sped chat tonight
vic - sorry Paulie
meeha/ece/tx - Addie -- I have a problem with the speech teacher giving the kids HARD CANDIES -- the kiddos I work with are 3 - 6 years of age with speech/language/apraxic issues ... HARD candy??? -- and we've talked about it many, many times!
Paulie - Hey, it was that before u arrived Vic
Addie/mo - paulie, then i would ask her to let them eat it before they left her room and not bring it to your room. i explained to my kids that it simply wasnt good manners to eat in front of the class and unless they had enough to share, i would not allow them to eat it. but, i let them go to their backpacks.
meeha/ece/tx - My kiddos do put it directly into their backpacks -- I insist they do so!
Addie/mo - choking hazard...i am surprised she doesnt know better
Paulie - Addie I did that to no avail sicne they had new kids coming in and mine ahd to return to class when they were rewarded
meeha/ece/tx - I think it would not be in the best interests of a LOT of her kiddos!
bette/tx - meeha and maybe it should not be candy?
Paulie - Addie rule in our school unpavck backpack adn then do not go to it until ready to go home
Addie/mo - but, i had to make a new rule in my school that all candy (reg. ed teachers) had to be consumed within the classroom where they were supervised. some teachers gave out candy at the end of the day and they would walk out to the bus with it in their mouths. no one seemed to think anything about it.
bette/tx - addie and make the rule no suckers with the sticks those are bad bad
Paulie - They were all piled in a big barrel we ahd no hooks and they played with them behind chairs and there really wasn't room for all the toys they packed in them for after school
vic - We also have a no eating on the bus. The bus drivers enforce this regularly and have garbage bags right inside the door.
meeha/ece/tx - Bette -- I've dropped ALL candy this year ... we use stickers, stamps, tattoos, hugs, dances, choices .....
Paulie - I don't udnerstand why we feed them rewards anyway
bette/tx - meeha i am against candy too..look at the cavitts too
meeha/ece/tx - Addie -- I like that rule!
Addie/mo - we have no eating on the bus too, but apparently this was not being enforced by the drivers, because no one complained about it
bette/tx - meeha choices are good
vic - Unfortunately Paulie, some special needs students are still at an edible stage for reinforcement. Unfortunately it has gotten out of control.
bette/tx - meeha my parents give candy early in the morning to get them going
meeha/ece/tx - bette -- what a mess!
Addie/mo - that is different, bette
bette/tx - meeha gum is the worst coming into the classroom...
Carol/pre K/WI - The problem with candy is it becomes a requirement for all children to do anything
Paulie - Vic who put them in the "edible stage" for rewards We ahve ourselves to blame because that is what we offer them
bette/tx - addie but when a child has had sweet candy at 7 am no breakfast till 8:30 am ...it is not a good thing
Addie/mo - when i was a teacher, i didnt allow gum in my classroom, the kids knew just to spit it out upon entering the room if they had it in their mouth from home.
bette/tx - carol so true that is what i think my parents who are teenagers do to get them up and dressed in the morning ..you can see the colored tongues
bette/tx - addie i have one girl that hides it ....and if i ask her to spit it out she hides it and i have to stand right by her
Addie/mo - it doesnt sound like a good thing
bette/tx - but also the parents are eating candy at 7 am too
meeha/ece/tx - I don't encourage gum, but the speech therapists would like it with some of our kiddos -- to strengthen certain muscles, to train the "swallow" response ...
Addie/mo - carol, exactly...the kids say things like "what do i get if i do it?"
vic - well everyone, my hip is screaming at me and if I am going to be any good tomorrow with it being my first day back, I better go get some heat on it. Paulie, I was taught this in college (edible stage of reinforcement). As I said though, it has been overused.
Carol/pre K/WI - it is much easier than listening to the crying or whining
Addie/mo - i hadnt thought about the exercise potential of gum. i think i would assign it for homework! LOL
bette/tx - bye vic
meeha/ece/tx - 'nite, vic -- best wishes tomorrow!
Paulie - Get better Vic
vic - Thanks everyone, until next week.....
Addie/mo - nite vic
bette/tx - carol and when you are 16yr with two children under 2 yr ...whining is hard ..so they give candy , cokes, sugar and more sugar
Addie/mo - carol, then we spend a lot of time, unteaching this behavior
Carol/pre K/WI - Only one more disadvantage of being a teen parent
meeha/ece/tx - Addie, I hope to guide children to become "lifelong lovers of learning" ... I won't argue with intermittent reinforcers that are "tangibles" or even "edibles" ... but ultimately the goal has to become that "learning is its own reward" ... funny thing is, I think we all are saying that in different ways
meeha/ece/tx - )
Addie/mo - bette, i assume that part of your job is to work with the young mothers on this, right? do they "know" better and just get worn down til they give in?
bette/tx - carol tell that to the 125 girls in our district with babies
bette/tx - addie yes work with the moms..no i think they don;t know better...as thier own moms were teens too
Addie/mo - i think we are, meeha
bette/tx - addie sometimes telling them not to give candy to them etc helps and that whining is normal for a 2 yr ...they say" Really"?
Addie/mo - so that is just what they consider normal, i see. that is hard to deal with
bette/tx - meeha but we reward ourselves with treats too...lol
Paulie - Meeha, I like to give rewards when they don't expect them I call it a treat lol but all get it and not for being good or learning something Yes, learning is it's own reward -- that is why I disagree with sped giving food rewards
Paulie - I don't call eating a reward
Addie/mo - interesting discussion. i have to go. l8r!
meeha/ece/tx - 'nite, Addie -- good to see you!
bette/tx - paulie i think the idea of rewards have changed so now people think eating candy, pie , cookies is a reward
Paulie - nite Addie
bette/tx - bye addie
bette/tx - i have to go too night all
meeha/ece/tx - Come in next week ... we'll be talking about "december ideas"
bette/tx - meeha i will ..i need ideas ....bye
Paulie - bye bette
meeha/ece/tx - 'nite, bette -- hope to see you next week!
Paulie - waht is ISr?
meeha/ece/tx - Paulie -- I've rethought the edibles as reinforcers this year -- no longer use them (no jelly beans or M&Ms in my classroom!)
meeha/ece/tx - l8r -- later!
Paulie - o hehehehehe
Paulie -
Paulie - I am not against treats totally just using them for rewards
meeha/ece/tx - there is a chill in the air tonite! wonder if I should turn the heat on?!?
Paulie - Gosh, I taught my 4th graders how to use the scientific method with a box of chocolates
meeha/ece/tx - We have snack every class session ... and do "treats" on special days ...
meeha/ece/tx - Carol -- are you still here?
Paulie - nah stay ehre and I'll send u a hug to keep u warm lol (((((meeha))))))
meeha/ece/tx - thanks, Paulie!
Paulie - well snack has been in K and preschool sicne forever
Paulie - U R welcoem
meeha/ece/tx - This week my p.m. class is busily preparing a "harvest feast" -- to which we have invited families on Friday!
Paulie - meeha I know u told us alst wek I think that is special
Paulie - what days do u get off for Tahnksgiving?
Carol/pre K/WI - I 'm here got distracted!!! Snacks and food for learning is one thing but is when its for reward that we can get in trouble
Paulie - I type too fast sorry sicne u r early childhood u must be able to make sense of my typos anyway (hoep hope)
meeha/ece/tx - we have class monday and tuesday -- off wednesday-thursday-friday (Wednesday is an "exchange time" day ... we do training on "our own time" and get the day off in exchange. I think I have 40 hours training for the REQUIRED 12 for the school year!
Paulie - lol can't even spell hope twice in a row correctly
meeha/ece/tx - Paulie -- I understand what your saying - asking ... not even a problem!
Paulie - so what kind of training will u go to?
Paulie - or do u mean u ahve already done it
meeha/ece/tx - Paulie -- I"ve done Crisis Prevention Intervention, Music Therapy, a seminar on a specific genetic disorder, technology training, ..... already done!
meeha/ece/tx - Wednesday I'll go to my parents' house -- come home on Sunday.
Paulie - great! good 4 u
meeha/ece/tx - BRB ...
Paulie - (guess it is time for a little nap)
Carol/pre K/WI - Paulie I get Thursday and Friday
Paulie - glad you have the days off for T urkey day because then u can do something with own family -- do u have special plans?
meeha/ece/tx - back again ...
Paulie - WB meeha
Paulie - I am going to go prepare and serve dinner for battered women in a nearby shelter
meeha/ece/tx - Paulie -- how special!
Paulie - sometimes they have their kids too
Paulie - always makes me feel so good
Carol/pre K/WI - No I'm going to enjoy Thanksgiving and then work on my masters degree class work
Paulie - I do this when i ahve so little to remind myself my life is better than some
meeha/ece/tx - Carol ... keep up the good work! You'll get there!
Carol/pre K/WI - I know six more months graduation is in May
Paulie - soudns liek special plans to me Carol
meeha/ece/tx - I'm going to be heading back to university in August ... to work on my Ed.D!
Carol/pre K/WI - Hi Soccermom
soccermom - hi carol
meeha/ece/tx - Carol, that is SO exciting for you -- I thought I would burst (excitement) when I finished my masters' this past May!
Paulie - I am not puting any more money into my education until I ahve a steady job again
soccermom - gonna go finish my e-mail check...bye
Carol/pre K/WI - Good luck with that
meeha/ece/tx - I can understand that, Paulie!
Paulie - Hoep I can get back to teaching this fall . . . I ahve missed having my own class
meeha/ece/tx - Is your local market so flooded with teachers, Paulie ... or is the cert. the challenge?
Carol/pre K/WI - I know where your coming from Paulie and even than I? whether it is worth it sometimes
Paulie - I am certified in WA no problem there
meeha/ece/tx - reciprocal certification ... that was the term I was looking for!
Paulie - I know I took all that time to take classes and get good grades and graduate when I was older than most and for what 8 years of subbing and 6 years of my own classroom?
meeha/ece/tx - Carol -- I was listening to a commercial about getting a masters' degree (generalized, I think) earlier tonite ... asking "where will you be in 3 years?" ... my response, even with masters' degree ... right where I am today!
Paulie - no I ahve regular certification in WA
Carol/pre K/WI - hi milymo
meeha/ece/tx - (((mily)))
Paulie - This is my 4th time of renewing certificate here
meeha/ece/tx - I found the Masters' degree considerably easier than the undergrad degree ... maybe because it works in conjunction with my daily experience
milymo - I am in the middle of getting my masters now. It is my 5th year of teaching.
Paulie - I may never get one
Carol/pre K/WI - No kidding I will be right here too but I feel better prepared for the new children and how they learn
milymo - I thought I would wait until my kids were in high school to get it, but I looked at the teachers with high school kids and saw that they were busier than me!
Carol/pre K/WI - milymo is it a traditional program?
meeha/ece/tx - Carol, I don't regret the time, the energy, or the effort expended to complete the second degree ... I think it made me a better teacher and I'd do it again! (obviously!)
meeha/ece/tx - and I made some professional contacts I wouldn't trade for the world!
milymo - No - It is through Marygrove in Michigan. We tape responses, type papers, and put together portfolios.
Carol/pre K/WI - I agree it just during this process I ? myself and then I implement something I have learned in class and it make the effort worth it
meeha/ece/tx - too true, Carol!
milymo - It's all done through videos, the mail, and the Internet.
milymo - I love how I can apply what I am learning to my classroom.
meeha/ece/tx - mily, I'm glad that works for you -- I'm truly not disciplined enough to make a go of that!
meeha/ece/tx - (((Guess I will become that kind of disciplined ... the doctoral level study really demands that kind of work!)))
Carol/pre K/WI - I have to do a portfolio also along with a journal article on the action research I'm doing in the classroom
milymo - I work in a study group and there are due dates that keep me accountable. I'm still up late typing papers at the last minute!
meeha/ece/tx - I need to log off for a couple minutes ... re-boot ... problems here -- see you soon.
milymo - I found an interesting research module through my current course and I started it with my five of my kindergarteners today.
Carol/pre K/WI - My program is Learning community and we meet once a month and then work independently the rest ofd the month
milymo - That seems like a good set-up Carol!
Carol/pre K/WI - What did you start as research I'm looking at emergent writing in PK
milymo - We haven't started our action research yet.
milymo - I think it would be interesting to do something on phonemic awareness, but by the time we get to our research class, I may be teaching a different grade.
Carol/pre K/WI - at first I thought it would require alot of time but it has fit into my classroom routine
milymo - Yes, same here. Do you have any children?
Carol/pre K/WI - what grade are teaching now
Carol/pre K/WI - yes, he is 20 and sophomore at UW-Madison
milymo - I am teaching kindergarten now. My first year I taught kinder, then three years in second, and now I'm back to kinder.
milymo - My daughter is 2.
Carol/pre K/WI - If i had small children I don't know how I would do it
Paulie - Kinder and 2nd are the two BEST grades
milymo - We decided to put kiddo #2 on hold for a while. It's working out with just having one right now.
milymo - I haven't taught any others except through subbing, but I think I agree Paulie!
Paulie - Is your hubby a teacher too?
Carol/pre K/WI - Have only taught pre-K
milymo - My husband works in a factory - 3rd shift.
Carol/pre K/WI - and love it
Paulie - K all day, first, 2nd, half day K (two sessions) and 4th here and every grade including high school subbing
Paulie - o
meeha/ece/tx - back again, back again!
Paulie - {{{{{meeha}}}}}}
Paulie - I made me a peanutbutter and banana slcies sandwich was kinda hungry
meeha/ece/tx - mily, you can do phonemic awareness no matter what grade you teach ... in your time frame your daughter will be in the right age bracket even if your classe is older kiddos!
milymo - Yes, I subbed for every grade too Paulie! Even high school Spanish and middle school SBH! It really improved my confidence, because even if I didn't feel comfortable in a situation, I would have to fake comfort to keep control!
meeha/ece/tx - kinder is the "top end" of my age group to work with.
Carol/pre K/WI - Well, it has been a long day and I have to teach both AM and PM tomorrow
Paulie - I taught advanced shakespeare in high school (I hate Shakespeare)
meeha/ece/tx - 'nite, Carol, good seeing you!
Paulie - nite Carol
Carol/pre K/WI - Good night
milymo - I can teach up to 8th, but I will probably stick with 5th and below.
Paulie - and sicne I am also a media specialist, I subbed in libraries too
Paulie - K-8 here for educ and K-12 for Lib sc
meeha/ece/tx - In TX I can teach through 8 years of age (general ed) ... with generic sped and ESL certs I am guessing I can go to any grade!
meeha/ece/tx - when our librarian is out our library is closed.
milymo - Changing from second to kinder has really been a blessing this year in so many ways.
meeha/ece/tx - mily -- is kinder your preferred grade level?
milymo - I subbed in a library for about a month. I enjoyed it a lot.
Paulie - well a media specialist does more than read stories and check out books
meeha/ece/tx - Paulie -- I don't know where JM is ... I heard from her last week, but expected to see her tonite!
milymo - At this point, it's a toss up between kinder and second. I loved second so much and didn't want to change at first. Now I can see so many positives about the switch. If I had a choice between the two next year, I would pick kinder again.
meeha/ece/tx - I don't think our school would function with out our "librarian"!@
Paulie - I usually get an email from her before the Tues chat but nothing this week she did have conferences
Paulie - do u have all day K?
meeha/ece/tx - mily ... how about a 3-year-loop?
Paulie - I like 2nd because I liek to write and they have a few basics down and you can give them the enthusiasm for writing but I love alld ay K
Paulie - I would not liek to teach first gr I did it one year but never again
milymo - I would do it! I think I would enjoy that a lot. I wish I could have looped up to third with group from last year. Other teachers might not be so found of the idea however.
Paulie - are u all day K?
meeha/ece/tx - Get creative ... write a grant ... see if you can do it!
milymo - Paulie - I have 1/2 day kinder in the morning and my pm group is extended day - low kids from my class and the other a.m. class come for the rest of the day with me.
Paulie - why do u have to write a grant to do it?
Paulie - o I had forgotten milymo thanks for reminder
milymo - No problem!
Paulie - I really want the kids all day had that situation my first year and loved it
meeha/ece/tx - Sometimes when you do something "unique" you need (((or want))) to throw in some "specials" ... twists to make the curriculum stronger ... add some professional texts, etc. ...
Paulie - k
meeha/ece/tx - This year I have 5 morning students, 5 afternoon students, 5 full-day students -- we have exactly 45 minutes for lunch ... NO planning time ... I have kiddos in my room from 8 am to (at least) 3:35 p.m.!
milymo - Wouldn't I need other teachers who would want to be involved? I'm not sure I would have that. Several are close to retirement and do not want to "budge."
meeha/ece/tx - The 45 minute lunch break is split -- one group eats "early", the other two teachers eat "late" ... we take about 30 minutes for each set
Paulie - and no recess break?
milymo - That sounds exhausting!
meeha/ece/tx - mily, if your parents agree and your administrator agrees it wouldn't be an issue!
meeha/ece/tx - recess break? if the kiddos go out we take them!
Paulie - you would need a teacher that would also want to loop
Paulie - Do u like my new outfit?
meeha/ece/tx - sure -- you're trying to wake me up!
Paulie - or trying to keep me awake
milymo - I do! It really brightened up the atmosphere!
Paulie - and it is early here I miss Just me . . .
Paulie -
meeha/ece/tx - well, much as I hate to do it, I need to excuse myself. I"ll see you all in one week ... come prepared to talk about "december ideas"! We'll need a lot to share!
Paulie - nite meeha
meeha/ece/tx - ...... bedtime in Texas ......
milymo - Bye meeha!
Paulie - early in WA
milymo - Pretty late in OH!
Paulie - I think my new outfir was too "loud" and scare her off
Paulie - well I was hoping Just Me would arrive
milymo - Yes, she'll probably have problems sleeping tonight!
milymo - Hi jennifer!
Jennifer - hello
Paulie -
Jennifer - is this the ece chat
milymo - Yes it is!
Paulie - yup u have arrived what gr do u teach?
Jennifer - just chatting or is their a protocol
Jennifer - reschool 3's and 4's
Paulie - no subject tonight just chattign about anything (almost)
Jennifer - this is my first teaching position
Jennifer - am loving it
Paulie - o u just missed meeha who also teaches preschool
Paulie - congrats
Jennifer - Bummer
Jennifer - hank you
Paulie - what state u in?
Jennifer - Thank you that is
Jennifer - Michigan
Paulie - she coems every week -- come back next week ---- earleir
Jennifer - bout 2 21/2 hours from mackinaw bridge
Paulie - oic Just Me is from Michigan too
Paulie - but she didn't make it eyt tonight
Jennifer - i go to school on Tuesdays that is why i am usually late or miss out
Jennifer - what grade do you teach?
milymo - I better get going too! I still need to take the trash out!
Paulie - we are usually here til 9 Pm west coast time
Paulie - the trash can wait
Paulie - bye milymo see u next week
Jennifer - it is 11:40pm here
Jennifer - bye milymo
Paulie - yep we got 20 minutes
Jennifer - nice to meet you
Paulie - 8:40 in WA
Jennifer - 20 minutes ?
Jennifer - what?
milymo - I'm in Ohio, so it's 11:40 here too!
Jennifer - is there a time limit on the room/chat?
Paulie - yep 20 min left of the late chat
Jennifer - oh ok thanks
Paulie - early one starts at 9 east coast
Jennifer - d you get snow yesterday Milymo?
Jennifer - we did
Paulie - late one at 11 east coast but we stay and chat the hr in between too
milymo - I wish I could come to that one, but my daughter is usually still awake.
Jennifer - ah
Paulie - I would like snow in WA we only had 7 snow days last year it snowed in mountains here today
milymo - We've had flurries on and off within the past week. Not too much yesterday.
Paulie - first oen is usually dinner time aroudn ehre so if home I eat at computer
milymo - We have 5 snow days, but we don't usually use them all.
Paulie - did u decide to stay milymo?
Jennifer - well it is late and i have finals this week and the next one is going to be murder
Paulie - no I meant days that it snowed in WA lol I figuree u might take it wrong
milymo - I don't know... sure - why not?
Paulie - sigh everyone is leaving huh?
Jennifer - cognitive ideas to promote brain development
Paulie - o good u r staying milymo
Jennifer - i will try to make it earlier next tuesday
milymo - I'll stay! What's 15 minutes more?
Paulie - soudns interesting jennifer u will ahve to share some time
Jennifer - g me feel welcome
Paulie - o good and u can take trassh out in AM . . .
Paulie - u certainly are Jennifer
milymo - Are you working on your masters Jennifer?
Jennifer - yes just finished a 8,000 word paper on preschool children and biases how they learn them and interventions
Jennifer - no associates in ECE and ba in elementary ed
Paulie - sounds interesting
Jennifer - yes it was to write it
Jennifer - ight
Paulie - do u ahve it online?
Jennifer - typing bad here Good Night
Paulie - would be interesting to read
Paulie - nite Jennifer
Jennifer - i have it on disk and i can email it
Paulie - o I would love to read it Jennifer
Jennifer - next Tuesday i will have it and can email it to those who may want to read it
Paulie - o ok thanks
Jennifer - night
Paulie - milymo I checked and Just me did not email me Hope all is ok at her part of the world
Paulie - o I guess I emant that for meeha and she is gone lol
milymo - Yes, it's been a while since I've seen her here, especially because I don't get to all the meetings.
Paulie - usually she checks in tho
Jennifer - never new private msg possible
milymo - Everything is going to be so busy between now and Christmas. It's so hard to get everything in.
Paulie - Yes, it has been awhile sicne I saw u too
Jennifer - hard to see them at the bottom of the screen
Paulie - I forget to look at private messages sometimes
milymo - After all our special things today, I only had 45 minutes to teach - including calendar and snack.
Jennifer - bye see you next TUesday
Paulie - but I ahte to post my screen name for email here sicne they archive these chats
Paulie - nite Jennifer
Jennifer - no problem
Paulie - well maybe that was a blessing indisguise
milymo - What do you mean?
Paulie - and I don't know why my name doesn't get blue when i type my email in when I sign on
Paulie - milymo why do they schedule so many specials the same day?
Paulie - well jsut meant it gave u a break for doing the teaching
milymo - It was an unusual situation. We had music and then a special 911 program, and the title reading teacher brought her literature club in to do a special activity.
Paulie - oic well then that is not too bad if jsut once in awhile
milymo - Last Monday was like that too, with Veteran's Day.
Paulie - oh no
milymo - I usually do centers 4-5 times a week. This week, I'll have three days.
Paulie - but u knew about it ahead of time?
Paulie - hard to accomplish what u want to I know
milymo - Kind of - I had centers planned today, but ended up having to switch my plans around to accomodate an activity from the 911 presentation.
milymo - Have you used Building Blocks?
Paulie - and you adjusted and that is what makes u a great teacher
milymo - I'm pretty flexible most of the time!
Paulie - I used BB before in all day K
Paulie - I love the whole idea
Paulie - think it is great program
Paulie - ng with Kid writing, I would imagine but I don't have the KW book yet
milymo - I do too! It's helping my students connect things so much better than the first year I taught K.
Paulie - I left CA when they started using Open Court in K
Paulie - re was no tiem for anythign else and I ahte scripted programs
Paulie - there
milymo - If they let me stay in K for next year, I will have to get the Kid Writing and read up on it.
Paulie - hoep u can read my typos
Paulie - yes I liek the concepts of KW and if I get another K job I will get it too
milymo - Yes! I'm doing fine!
Paulie - well thank u for staying and keeping me company have a good rest of week
Paulie - I will see u next week, I hope
Paulie -
milymo - Yes! You have a good week too! I always enjoy your posts on the main chatboard and kinder chatboards!
Paulie - thanks I haven't posted much on K board they are having big fight now
Paulie - thanks nite
milymo - I stopped in for a bit tonight and glanced at some of the debate.
milymo - Goodnight!