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Kathy/5/IA - Welcome to our Focus Chat on Reading/Writing Workshops.
Kathy/5/IA - I'm looking forward to discussing Reading/Writing Workshops. Do you use them in your classrooms?
Paulette - Hi, Kathy. I teach 6th grade and have used a Reading Workshop concept several times this year. I'm interested in finding out other teachers' methods.
Brian - I am curious about reading/writing workshops and how I could use them.
Kathy/5/IA - Do you use the Nancie Atwell method or something else?
Kathy/5/IA - What grade level do you teach, Brian?
Brian - I am currently doing my student teaching in a 5th/6th grade social studies classroom
Kathy/5/IA - Do the kids in your class use a text book for SS?
Paulette - I don't think I really can say I use one particular method. I've done a lot of reading and tried to incorporate several ideas into something that is doable for me. I like the freedom kids have when using a Reading Workshop. It gives all levels of readers a chance to read at an enjoyable level.
Brian - Yes, they do
Kathy/5/IA - What types of things have worked for you, Paulette? Are your students all reading their own material?
Kathy/5/IA - You could incorporate many aspects of writing within the SS curriculum that you are to cover, Brian.
kim - What does a Reading Writing workshop look like on a fourth grade level?
Brian - That is why I decided to attend this meeting. I was hoping to hear about some ways in which I could use this method.
Paulette - We do not have a textbook or basal. We use all trade books which is great but can be expensive to replace and take time to develop units.
Kathy/5/IA - I haven't used a Reading Workshop in my room. I'm anxious to hear what others do, also. I do use Literature Circles (with trade books) in my 5th grade class.
Kathy/5/IA - Do your kids all read the same trade book at the same time, or are they reading individual material?
Kathy/5/IA - What area are you studying in SS with your class right now, Brian?
amy/oh - kathy - I use lit circles with grades 3 and 4 - they are great
Shel - What exactly is a literature circle and how does it work in your classroom?
Brian - Within the 5th grade, they are studying the colonies fight for freedom. Within the 6th grade, we are completing a study on China; next we are studying a unit on the Renaissance.
Kathy/5/IA - There is a great book by Harvey Daniels that describes Lit. Circles. This site describes them well. http://www.sasked.gov.sk.ca/docs/mla/circle/intro.html
amy/oh - shel - Harvey daniels wrote a book LIterature circles. The group of kids have jobs they are responsible for to cary out a discussion on a particular section of the book
Paulette - Most of the time I have my students reading at their own level in one particular genre or theme. Right now my students are reading survival books. They have dialogue journals to write before during and after the book and I have them collect vocabulary. They read at their own pace and share the finished book in an oral book talk. This is just one way I have used a workshop. Sometimes we all do the same book together if I want an all class discussion about a particular topic.
amy/oh - I feel like I'm in a rut with writer's wksp
Paulette - Amy, what have you done with Writer's Workshop?
Kathy/5/IA - I like the ideas you shared - Paulette. Could you explain your dialoge journals.
amy/oh - paulette - all the kids have a list of topics they would like to write about at some time. We've strayed a bit from that with pop up stories, friendly letters, that kind of stuff - it seems like we just always run out of time
amy/oh - my kids love to write but they are so obsessed with typing on the computer that they are throwing their stories together and forgetting all of the mechanics and imagination required to put a good story together
Kathy/5/IA - Do you require a certain number of writing pieces that they take to completion?
Kathy/5/IA - I love discussing Lit. Circles - email me anytime: teach@willinet.net
amy/oh - kathy - I assume that was a general question - I tell them that 1 out of 3 can be published
Shel - With w.w. I have trouble letting everyone work at their own pace. It seems like some students never finish.
amy/oh - kathy - I like lit circ because any ability or age can use them to their advantage
Kathy/5/IA - Do you have them complete some type of log of what they are writing - amy?
Rivka/3/NY - What criteria do you all use for publishing (student choice/teacher choice)?
amy/oh - kathy - no - I don't how I could fit that in! Do you think it would help?
Paulette - My dialogue journals are set up so the student responds to the reading through a letter format. They write to me generally. At the beginning of the book they look at the cover, title and read about 3-5 pages then give me a short summary. They also make a prediction of what they think will happen. Other dialogue journals deal with character traits, importance of setting, any surprising developments, etc.
amy/oh - rivka - the choice varies
Shel - Judy, yes. This is my first time in a chat room and I thought that was routine.
amy/oh - kathy - do you mean recording what they accomplished each day?
Kathy/5/IA - Yes, amy - some of my little darlings end up doing nothing!
Kathy/5/IA - How often do you have them write to you - Paulette?
amy/oh - kathy - same here - quite often I take a verbal check of what they are working on at the beginning of the session and again at the end. That helps, maybe I'll try a log
amy/oh - paulette - how often do you respond to them?
Kathy/5/IA - I'm going to start a quick "Status of the Class" as describe in Nancie Atwells book at the beginning of WW.
amy/oh - kathy - that's what I do
Paulette - kathy - I usually have them complete 6-8 dialogue journals including before, during and after the book.
Kathy/5/IA - Do you find it keeps them on task, Amy?
amy/oh - nancy atwell is going to be at octela's fall conference in cols in fall1999
amy/oh - kathy - it helps
Kathy/5/IA - Do you require a certain length in your dialogue journals, Paulette.
judy - Does anyone know about the GEPA test for New Jersey eight graders
Kathy/5/IA - Do you get to go to the conference, amy??
amy/oh - paulette - when my kids are in individual books they have to respond in a jouirnal daily. They have about 20 choices to pick from. They love it
judy - Thanks Kathy. That solves a major problem.
Kathy/5/IA - Reggie Routman is going to be in Iowa this Spring. I'm seriously thinking of going for a day (Saturday)
amy/oh - kathy - next fall, in 1999 - I'm on the planning committee. Is anyone going to NCTE nat'l conf in Cin next month?
kim - Amy, what kind of choices do they have?
Paulette - I don't want the students to get bogged down in journal writing so I tell them I'm looking for quality not quantity. I want them to use specific details or examples from the book.
Kathy/5/IA - Do you have a list of your 20 choices you could share, Amy. I'd like to do something like that inbetween my lit. circles.
judy - I teach eight grade in Paterson NJ. I teach to the test.
amy/oh - kathy - I've seen her, very interesting and enthusiastic
amy/oh - kim- ideas like : a char. I would (n't) like to meet, a place I would like to go in my book is,...
kim - How much time do you spend on reading writing workshops a day?
Rook - Thanks, Kathy. I'm interested in assessments used when running literature circles in a 5th grade classroom...?
amy/oh - if anyone who wants a list of my choices sends me an email through pm I'll send it.
Barb - Hi, I teach remedial reading for grades 3-6
amy/oh - kim- about 1hr 15min every 2 days
Paulette - amy - I like giving many choices too. Right now my dialogue journals are directed specifically towards survival books so there are certain ideas I want to see they are understanding.
judy - How could you do writers workshop in 8th grade
Kathy/5/IA - Amy/Paulette - how long do your kids read for during their Readers Workshop? How do you incorporate skills through the literature.
amy/oh - rook - my kids disigned a grading rubric so when they finish a book I collect the job sheets and rate them on the rubric
Rook - Amy, what does your rubric consist of? MIght I get a copy?
kim - Amy - What does your workshop look like? What do you do the rest of the week
amy/oh - kathy we have an hour block everyday
Rook - Ok,what's the difference between reading workshop and literature circles?
Kathy/5/IA - What type of assessment, Rook?
amy/oh - kim- do you mean writers workshop - we have to alternate with health/science
Paulette - kathy - we have 52 minute periods for reading and english separately. I like the separate periods so they have a nice long time to read and respond. We deal with skills in between the workshops.
Kathy/5/IA - Are you all on email rings at t.net (or should we collect a list of emails) to share ideas more - since we seem to be interested in the topic!
Rook - Exactly my problem, Kathy. I have many excellent assessments BUT, I have problems giving a LETTER GRADE. How can I do that?
amy/oh - I also hold weekly reading conferences with each child
Rook - Amy, do the kids pick out their choice of book?
amy/oh - rook - I try to let them pick - if we are using lit circles I try to limit the groups to 6 tops, individual choices are up to the kids - we use our accelerated reader books for that quite often
Rivka/3/NY - Rook, I don't grade ideas. I grade mechanics.
Rook - Rivka-you mean in writing or reading? Amy, 6 kids per book?
amy/oh - I'm lucky I don't have to give letter grades for our multiage class
amy/oh - rook -each kid has a copy
Rivka/3/NY - Rook, writing. The only grade for reading is in oral reading.
Rook - Again, what is the difference between lit circles and reading workshop? How often should I do lit circles and what should I do in between them?
amy/oh - rook - I alternate between lit circles and individual choice silently read books
Rook - Rivka, can you expand on how you give a GRADE for oral reading?
Rivka/3/NY - Rook, I consider reading workshop and literature circles the same
Rook - Amy, do you do any "lessons" or group activities in reading?
Rivka/3/NY - Rook, my oral reading grades are very subjective. I have kids read aloud (usually in other subject areas - sci, ss)
amy/oh - rook - I do mini lessons as the need arises - sometimes just to the group I'm working with
Rook - I still don't get it. How do you take a grade? I've been giving a weekly grade for reading at home and a participation grade. What else should I be "grading" on?
Kathy/5/IA - To assess my kids with Lit. Circles I grade their "jobs" on a 6 point rubric. I also give occational quizes over the book. I also assess how well they are discussing in the book.
amy/oh - kathy- similiar to what I do although I also hold weekly individual reading conferences to check for fluency, expresssion, observing punc, comp
Barb - Kathy, what do you include in the 6 point rubric?
Rook - So an occassional quiz. OK, is that rubric on that web site? Also, what if I have not read the book? Should I be using it?
Rivka/3/NY - I also do reading workshop on a novel we read as a class. We just finished Charlotte's Web. I do mini lessons based on the novel for writer's workshop
amy/oh - sometimes the books are on accelerated reader and they take a test on the computer
Kathy/5/IA - My 6 pont rubric changes to letter grades well: 6 = 100%, 5 = 90%, etc... I have a "kid friendly" rubric called a Cookie Rubric.
Rook - Rivka, do you do the class novel, along with the reading ws or is it a whole seperate thing?
amy/oh - barb - I assess each job sheet based on mechancis, completion of ideas, quality of job, I also try to sit on a couple discussion circles throughout the book
amy/oh - rook what grade?
Rook - 5th, amy
amy/oh - kathy - do you have to give letter grades? Our grade cards are more of a checklist
amy/oh - rook - lit circles would work nicely with that age
Rook - Amy, you are so lucky. We HAVE to give a percentage grade.
Kathy/5/IA - Yes, have to give letter grades - ICK - would love to see your check list! That's what we would like to move toward
amy/oh - rook - I would hate that - it would complicate things
Rivka/3/NY - Rook, we have silent reading (kid selected books) while I check homework and take care of clerical stuff (about 20-30 min) The kids then spend another 5 minutes writing in their reader's response journal. Then we have a separate time where they read and answer teacher prepared questions on the book we are doing as a class. Sometimes there is a pre writing activity included.
Rook - Amy, things run SO smooth until I have to give a grade.
amy/oh - rook - what is a "B" reader? I can't answer that one
Rook - Rivka, do you do, for instance, reading groups 2 days a week and whole group 3?
Rook - EXACTLY, AMY!
Cathie - Hello all, I am trying to understand how to do these workshops. I have to use a reading basal. How can I do the workshops with that?
Rook - How many days a week should I do lit circles? Is everyday OK?
amy/oh - I've given several workshops on lit circles - teacher's love the idea
Kathy/5/IA - I give inservices on Lit. Circles too - Amy!!! Too Cool!
amy/oh - cathie - use the basal stories as a spring board and incorporate the lit circles into them. what grade?
Cathie - I teach third grade, amy
Rivka/3/NY - Rook, I check h.w. every day, so silent reading is every day. Sometimes when I am using a portion of the book for a mini lesson we might do some reading aloud from the book. An example would be EB White's use of imagery and how it enhances his descriptive writing.
Kathy/5/IA - I hold Lit. Circles Mon. Wed. and Friday. On Tues. Thurs. we do some type of mini lesson.
amy/oh - cathie - it works well in 3rd grade - it needs more monitoring than upper grades. I have 3/4
Kathy/5/IA - I do lit. circles with the basal stories at times, too. The basal works well to "teach" and "model" the jobs.
Rook - Rivka, what HW are you grading?
Cathie - amy, how do I do the literature circle, is there a website that I can go to to read about it?
amy/oh - at the beginning of the year we go over each job in great detail - we all practice being each job at the same time so we can review the type of things required - that helped a lot
Rivka/3/NY - Rook, not grading. Just checking that it's done and cursory corrections. Whatever I've given the night before.
amy/oh - cathy - harvey's book is worth the money - it has several copies of job sheets
Kathy/5/IA - I just started reading a book called "The Book Club Connection" by Susan I. McMahon and Taffy E. Raphael. Sounds similar to Lit. Circles.
Kathy/5/IA - The book - by Daniels is well worth the $. The site I listed has copies of the job sheets.
Cathie - How do you all grade writing?
amy/oh - cathie - on a rubric
Cathie - amy, can you give me an example?
rook - WHEN do you take a grade on a piece of writing?
amy/oh - cathie - our course of study has a cbe tests high of 4 down to 1standard rubric that we use to grade the
amy/oh - the rubric rates mugs, creativity, organization
amy/oh - rook mechanics, useage, grammar, spelling
rook - The problem I have with writing workshops is that I don't have time to edit with them like I would like to. Also, it seems that they have a hard time rewriting, and revising. . .too tedious, how can I fix that?
vonda - 5th every other year, sixth the other year.
Kathy/5/IA - I have the same problem, Rook.
rook - Any ideas to help that problem?
Kathy/5/IA - Do you loop with your group, Vonda?ail
rook - Do you make the kids rewrite several times, once, or what?
vonda - no. I just teach the same students for two years. Is that looping??
Kathy/5/IA - Someone suggested tonight to have them take 1 out of 3 of their pieces of writing to the publishing stage.
Kathy/5/IA - Yes, that is what I mean by looping, Vonda. :0)
vonda - I try to get at least one published piece per six weeks.
rook - So you only take a "grade" on the final piece?
Kathy/5/IA - That's what it sounded like to me, rook.
rook - Vonda, what are you taking grades on in the mean time?
vonda - I only take a grade from a rubric on the final piece. I take other grades for other parts as we go.
rook - Like, word choice, ideas and content, voice, etc?
vonda - We write something everyday. Sometimes I take things that are responses to lit. etc.
Kathy/5/IA - Do you use a certain rubric, vonda for your lit responses, etc..
vonda - I use lots of children's books and spinoff from them.
vonda - A lot of it depends on the type of response I am looking for.
Jade Moore - Assign points to the daily writing. Then let them select or you select one piece to complete for grading.
Kathy/5/IA - Could you explain what you do with the children's books - sounds like a neat idea!!
Gale - rook- I have the same problem with editing too. I need help .
vonda - Example: I read Mem Fox's Wilfred,Gordon... and we write about all of the mentioned types of memories.
rook - Gale, went to a 6 trait writing conference, they say to edit for ONE THING ONLY but grade a final publication.
vonda - I have useed Barry Lane's After the End book for revision. He has some pretty awesome ideas.
rook - They said that editing for ALL areas it too over whelming for the kids and the teacher. Concentrate on one of the 6 areas at a time: word choice, voice, mechanics, ideas and content, and .. . uh, forgot the last one, haven't taught it yet.
Kathy/5/IA - I'm interested in learning more about the 6-traits. We may be getting some training on it next year.
Kathy/5/IA - Vonda - you have some great ideas for uses of children's lit!!
Jade Moore - Yes, I haven't heard of the 6-traits.
rook - Our district is mandating it. I was the with the second group of teachers to go. It's pretty awesome. Takes some real time to put together, though. Lots of examples provided for you fortunately!
Kathy/5/IA - Who was your trainer, Rook. I know someone who trains for 6 traits
vonda - Thanks, after three years of training, I should have come up with something.
rook - Jade, maybe contact the AZ Dept of Ed. I would copy it for you BUT it's about 5 billion pages worth!
rook - Oh, I guess, our AIMS state standard testing is going to be based on these 6 traits, etc.
Kathy/5/IA - There are some good sites on 6-traits on the net.
rook - Just thinking it must be getting late back east. Only 8:30 here but need to serve dinner. Thanks SO MUCH, Kathy, for all your help!
Kathy/5/IA - We hold a elem/middle school chat every third wednesday here.
Kathy/5/IA - Night everyone - thanks for a great session!!!
