Teachers.Net Meeting with JCooper regarding Literacy and the Net

Teachers.Net Focus Session
Thursday, January 7, 1999
Literacy and the Net
With
Jeff Cooper
Sponsored by

JCooper - I am holding this chat to share ideas regarding Literacy and the Net. My motive is somewhat selfish, since I will be training teachers in my district on this subject later this month.
JCooper - I am a Computer Resource Teacher at Portola Middle School in El Cerrito CA. I help teachers and students integrate computers, more specifically the Net into curricula. I am very interested in what I see as the potential for shifting pedagogy away from teacher centered didacticism towards student centered learning. I believe this is a critical issue in the area of Literacy as well. We need to learn how to motivate students to read starting from Day 1. I would like to explore here how people think this can be accomplished.
Sandy/K/Mo - I teach kdg. and we are in the lab 5 days a week 16 computers with 22 kids
Sandy/K/Mo - I have found that the computer, email, interactive sites have raised the level of my kids for beginning reading
Sandy/K/Mo - no that cost money :-)
JCooper - I am concerned by how literacy rates are declining, in my district, and I believe across the country as well. I attribute this to a variety of factors: 1) Lack of reading at home 2) Short attention spans (tv) 3) Ends oriented instruction (grades) rather than means oriented (students there to self-improve).
Shady - I agree 100% Coop.
JCooper - I firmly believe that we need to get the kids started as young as possible... and agree with Sandy, that the computer is a major carrot for students. Email projects, interactive online, the Net can be *the tool for breaking down the classroom walls*. Once the kids are here there are many positive motivators. There are downsides to the Net as well... but I will withhold critical remarks for later in the hour.
Sandy/K/Mo - I have different sites that the kids can go to, the ones that have the smaller atten. span will stay with it :-)
Sandy/K/Mo - we have kinder pals.. have made a web site, and are doing several projects
Shady - Even though I have 5 computers in my room and a lab available to me. I only have one computer with internet access.
JCooper - I have been collecting Literacy WWW sites, and will post them to Teachers.Net later this month. I am constantly on the prowl for more, and not just sites, but ideas. I encourage everyone here to send me whatever info you deem pertinent (coops@edmail.com)... in return I will send you everything I get. Collaboration is the key as well.... getting teacher to share ideas is critical... how else can we expect to do our best?
MaryWA - In my district, we have a LOT of kids who don't own a single book of their own, and many parents are either monolingual Spanish speaking or aren't good readers themselves.
MaryWA - Shady we have a small computer lab in my building that isn't wired to the net. The 4/5th grade classes are, but that's it.
meeha/ece/tx - I have 4 computers in my room, the computer tech shudders when I ask to bring my kids to her lab -- and NO net access. at 4 and 5, the kids are learning to manage the mouse and to work their way around on the 'at ease' screen. Guess that is good for pre-literate munchkins.
Shady - Does anyone have their own classroom web page?
kinderkate - Same here Mary. We USED to have a schoolwide program where we bought class sets of books 4 times a year. After we used them for the unit the kids brought them home to keep. It was great.
Applelady - We have a wonderful network in our school and min. of 2 mahcines in every room, plus 2 - 30 machine labs that the kids go to every day for 10min(K-3,5) and 20 min 4th gr
kinderkate - We are a large school with one computer lab. Kids get to use it one hour a week. We each have a computer in the classroom - hooked to the net- but you would be surprised at how many teachers don't ever TURN it on!!!!!
JCooper - I think beyond WWW sites, there are other options the Net affords us that need exploring regarding literacy. My personal expertise is in utilizing Educational MOOs, which are virtual communities and primarily *text based* for real time collaboration, team teaching, exploring, etc. Many have told me that students won't respond to text only environments (although MOOs are evolving... MOO= Multiuser Object Oriented program). There is a lot to learn... and become involved. They are somewhat difficult to learn (steep learning curve)... and for that reason have been shunned by many educators. I wonder, and pose this to the group... have we become too complacent, expecting immediate answers, and graphic details... at the expense of imagination? I feel that this reaches into the core of literacy.
JCooper - I agree with kinderkate... many teachers won't turn their computers on, because *they are beyond their realm of expertise*... and when a teacher is outside their area of mastery, they cringe and hide... rather than dive in and explore.
Kathleen - JCooper, many teachers work in an environment that causes them to fear failure, so being faced with the challenges of technology can be daunting
MaryWA - JC, agreed. I had to sub for the comp tech in our building for three months and people panicked if they couldn't find me to fix it for them, rather than try on their own.
Sandy/K/Mo - You just need to go in and do it.. kinders can and will do anything.. :-)
Applelady - Our tech tchr says "Let the other schools make the mistakes first and we'll learn."
lvan/8/CT - Jeff, I disagree with your generalization that teachers outside their area of mastery "cringe and hide" - many many of us do dive in and explore.
Mary - JCooper, I think that the biggest obsticle to teachers really getting involved , besides the lack of classroom connections to the web, is the lack a adequate inservice
Sandy/K/Mo - :-) the older kids get upset because kinders are doing things they can't
lvan/8/CT - My team has been actively involved in designed activities for our students that integrate technology into our individual curricula.
Applelady - Sandy, it is kind of hard when the administration supports the tech tchr outlook
Applelady - Mary, you are exactly right, we are NOT given the time to explore
lvan/8/CT - The difficulty we have is in not having enough hardware to support what we can dream up.
JCooper - I posed a question to students, but may have posed it to the teachers as well, namely, if I gave an assignment to you 35 students, whose responsibility would it be for you to learn. Student 1 raised their hand and said "the teacher." I agreed with him, since indeed, if one project were to reach 35 students a lot of responsibility would be on the teacher. Student 2 said "the school" Student 3 said "our parents" Student 4 said "ourselves" finally. I feel that students have become distantly removed from a sense of what education should be all about. Students should read to improve themselves... not just to get a grade... but that is (in large part) the message that comes across to them.
MaryWA - JC, my job is to teach, it's the child's repsonsibility to learn. I can teach, but I can't MAKE that child learn.
Applelady - JC, I tell my kids everyday that they are in control and responsible
carolinajoy - Evening, all...I'm on team to plan technology inservice for our elementary staff...help me by telling me what NOT to do for teachers
JCooper - I reposed the question to them... namely, if I gave you a dozen projects... who would be responsible. Immediately they recognized that it was their own... indeed it is their own lives... but we don't give them the choices. That is why I wonder... when it comes to literacy... can we find ways to give students more choice... and therefore more responsibility... to *want to learn to read*. I feel that the net affords us this opportunity. We don't all have to read the same book or story...
MaryWA - Carolina, don't make yourself indispensible. Let the teachers learn to do it for themselves, or you'll run yourself ragged.
kinderkate - Definitely children should KNOW it is their responsibility to learn. And they should know that from KINDER on up.
Sandy/K/Mo - Jeff... have you taken part in any of the gsn ( I think that's it) activities?
JCooper - Global Schoolhouse Network Sandhy?
Sandy/K/Mo - yes thats it... I gave that site to the 7th grade science teacher and they had a GREAT time... even placed in one of the activites
Sandy/K/Mo - the kids really got into it.. worked harder and stayed with it.. she is going to do more with it
JCooper - Imagine becoming part of Moby Dick, or Dante's Inferno... the online versions allow you to jump into the action... of course, they are not the *real* versions, scaled down tremendously, but becoming part of the action increases motivation.
Sandy/K/Mo - I enjoyed taking my kids on the scavenger hunt through Plymouth Rock at Thanksgiving.. if they had been older would have been really cool
Kathleen - JCooper, my concern about virtual vs print reading is the elimination of the opportunity for kids to construct
JCooper - Obviously we disagree on that point Kathleen... but as others have noted, many teachers don't even turn on their computers... even when given support. Frankly, I find teachers to be very difficult students. Case in point: teachers were brought to Tapped In MOO to learn how to utilize it for both real time and asynchronous communication. They complained that it wasn't intuitive immediately, that there wasn't enough point and click and left, never to return. Because they couldn't grasp something immediately, they got discouraged and left. Do you find an irony there?
Sandy/K/Mo - I do.... we expect from our kids what we won't do :-) at our school several teachers use computer time as a break
Kathleen - Yes, that is ironic considering what we hope for from students, but students have a different (earlier) background of experience with technology, a better "intuition" based upon those early intros to the technology
JCooper - Actually Kathleen, there is a much greater opportunity for students to construct online than anywhere else. Case in point: I was teaching 9th grade English to classes of students on the 3rd grade level. Most had pretty much given up on writing. I had them write stories about their city, and then posted it to an educational listserv that distributed to 27 schools around the world. Several months later, school newspapers arrived, many with my student articles in them. The students felt enabled because other people around the world (one as far as Finland) thought that *what they had to say was important*. Students can create WWW pages online in under an hour, and show them to their friends... and make new ones. To me... it is this type of reaching out that is critical.
Kathleen - Oh, I agree that the 'net experience is wonderful, but not as a substitute for reading the book. I realize that Jeff probably isn't advocating it as a substitute.
JCooper - Actually Kathleen... I am to a degree.
Kathleen - Yes, yes, lots of opportunity to construct. But not the same and should never get to the point of being to the exclusion of reading from print and constructing from the text, I think we are in agreement.
JCooper - I do see downsides to the Net.... indeed, the high focus on graphics... tends to diminish imagination... compared to text based reading. I am concerned that if students see a picture, then suddenly that is what Aramis looks like, rather than constructing their own image. What do others think about this?
Sandy/K/Mo - I agree... there is something about holding that book in your hands and just "going" READING is my passion...
Kathleen - diminishing imagination in a way, yes, that is what I'm getting at. Of course, it encourages imagination in other ways
Sandy/K/Mo - I know that if a movie is made of a book I have read... that if the actor isn't what I visualized it really bothers me
JCooper - That is also why I favor text based virtual environments... it is the teachers who decry them saying "the kids think it's too boring." If teachers argue that text based worlds are boring, then what is the future of literacy? Must it by nature change to include graphic depictions?
Kathleen - Certainly I think that the 'net is much more beneficial and less harmful than many uses of television have been in terms of vegetizing kids brains (is that a word?? it is now ;-)
JCooper - Net=interactive by nature ... TV=passive consumerism
Kathleen - why a virtual experience if it is just text anyway?
JCooper - Isn't a book just a virtual text based experience? My interest in Educational MOOs (and some are set in the future)... allows students to become online authors, and join in the collaborative work of others.
Sandy/K/Mo - Jeff... I haven't seen these MOOs can you send me a link?
Kathleen - Jeff, as long as their first experiences are with books....or do you see books as anachronistic not far down the road?
JCooper - Another point re: hypertext... with all the pointing and clicking... are we moving away from in depth analysis? How deep is the WWW? Students read (maybe) a paragraph or two... then click somewhere else. (Note that we're getting towards the end of the hour... so please feel free to make your own negative rants re: the Net, Literacy, etc. known now).
Sandy/K/Mo - I hope not Kat.. that would be terrible
Sandy/K/Mo - as much as I am involved with the computer and internet I still think that books, storytelling, puppets, interactions of stories is very important
Kathleen - point and click works well for the sesame street generation, they have attention span of about 2 minutes and a great need for visual stimulation
JCooper - Don't get me wrong Kathleen... I am in favor of books... but I do see shifts happening, for both the better and worse. Let me add one really positive thing about the Net. I've been talking with teachers in Australia, who because of the distance problems there embraced the Net ten years ago... and have been online with their students ever since. Starting in *first grade* students learn keyboarding... in second they have email. Students are *project oriented self-directed learners*. The program is along the lines of Montessori... with students taking active responsibility from a very young age. Once they reach high school, the teachers have to do very little... the students have become highly involved self-learners. Can we ever do that here?
Kathleen - project oritented self directed sounds like they are going in the right direction
JCooper - I would really love to continue this conversation... perhaps I can have another meeting next week? Would others be interested? Unfortunately, I have a tech meeting to attend (now). I encourage people to stay and continue the dialogue. Also... please email me (coops@edmail.com) any ideas you have regarding this topic, WWW sites, etc. I will redistribute my findings to teachers.net.
Kathleen - Bye for now!
JCooper - waves bye