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Mary/PA - Wecome to this evening's Reading Recovery Meeting here at Teachers.Net
Didi (Oz) - I'm early as I was an hour late last ime lol
Doug - hello mary
Mary/PA - We don't have a set topic, so just chat about anything that you wish
Doug - I went BTG last
Mary/PA - last?
Doug - last Tuesday
Mary/PA - How did it go?
Doug - im's keep my thoughts from completing
Mary/PA - Are you on IM in addition to chatting here?
Doug - I told Jimmy to say it as you write it and I was corrected. It is only for the slow to accelerate child
Mary/PA - Is that multi tasking?
Doug - I thought that was interesting
Doug - mary- shame on me
Mary/PA - I don't think that was exactly corect
Mary/PA - correct
Doug - didi, mary, how are your lessons going?
Didi (Oz) - What do you do with a child who Doug was that for the fluency word
Mary/PA - I think that saying it while you write it is good for anyone who needs to do it.
Doug - no I told Jimmy that as he was drafting his story in the writing book
Mary/PA - What's wrong with doing that?
Didi (Oz) - I have a little girl who has real off days and screws up her eyes and won't look at the page even top say the first letter of an unknown word
Doug - mary- I have been saying that to my Kindergartener's for years
Mary/PA - I must be slow to accellerate, because I say it as I write it
Doug - didi- is that a n advanced form of one to one correspondence
Doug - mary - the topic brought about some interesting discussion...in the end, not all rr folks are hard to accelerate
Didi (Oz) - She's on level 5 but relies on structure and isn't good with visual info
Mary/PA - My lessons are going OK, the only probelm is that my kids are on levels 9 - 13 and we only have about 5 weeks left before we start end of year testing. I don't know if I'm going to get them up to the levels needed by the end, but I had to get those strategies going and they came to me 7 weeks ago at levels 2 - 4
Didi (Oz) - I just wanted her to put the first sound in her mouth as she read
Doug - didi- so cross checking may be your focus...remember the bicycle example in the guidebook?
Doug - hey tylee
Mary/PA - Didi, that is so common with so many - they just refuse to look at the print - have you followed the GB about looking at print
tyylee - Refresh my memory about the bicycle example
Didi (Oz) - On her good days she does it but on her coy days she just won't read properly and goes slow
Doug - tylee- if I remember right, clay had a conversation about checking using more than one source.
Mary/PA - Didi, does she search your face, or the walls or ceiling?
Didi (Oz) - I have looked in the green book but a refresh won't hurt
Mary/PA - I have to tell mine that they are not allowed to look at my face, the wall, or any thing but the book
Didi (Oz) - She closes her eyes or looks up in the air
Doug - didi- do you have a buddy that can do a collegue visit?
Didi (Oz) - Yea and I should have a tutor visit soon
Doug - mary- excellent advice, even sitting behind the child would have been appropriate
Mary/PA - Didi, tell her that she must look and the book, the pictures, the words, the letters, not up in the air
tyylee - I told one child to glue his eyes to the words and he replied that he needed to keep his eyes in his head. :)
Didi (Oz) - Thanks mary will do
Mary/PA - show her how to frame the first letter with her fingers and the get her mouth ready
Doug - tyylee- yes, self-questioning is a powerful way to respond to reading
Doug - our tl was sharing some brain based research she was reading...with some kids (especially the really active ones) it might be a good idea to have him or her stand while reading
Didi (Oz) - My lessions have been going over and it is the writing time when it happens . How much do you use the practice page?
Mary/PA - Didi, our practice pages are usually filled to the max
Doug - mary yes...if there was no work with sound boxes, letter boxes there is always room for generative list writing
darthy/RR/AL - Good evening to my favorite teachers ---RR teachers
Mary/PA - My kids are now reaching a point where they don't have too much to work on, they just write their stories straight out, but that's not how it has been up till now
Doug - thanks darthy
darthy/RR/AL - Mary, this is a good time to work on all kinds of punctuations marks
tyylee - Darthy, in reading and writing?
darthy/RR/AL - My principal has turned against RR/ she wants to spent $$$$$$ on REading Initiative Program
Mary/PA - Doug, do you have them generate, even when they didn't have any problem writing what they needed?
Didi (Oz) - Doug Generative list writing?
Mary/PA - Oh, darthy, that's too bad
darthy/RR/AL - Yes, tyylee, in all areas. I use Marie CLay's prompt of "REad to the mark"
Doug - didi- can man fan ran etc.
DebDub - on the practice page I have them generate and/or take words to fluency
darthy/RR/AL - Excellent idea Deb
Didi (Oz) - Never done that unless I was trying to get them to use analogy to get to their word
Doug - mary- a university trainer once told me that if there was nothing new then we must examine what we are teaching....keeping it 90 10 is very difficult at times though
DebDub - I gave the OS to an above average child in the classroom today and was surprised he got 110 words on WV
Doug - deb- in 10 minutes...wow
darthy/RR/AL - This is a good time of year to work in days of week, months, several compound words - mine are thrilled with compound works right now
Mary/PA - During writing? keeping it to 90?
DebDub - I dont think I can do that!!
darthy/RR/AL - I've never had to use that "third" box for over 100 words!!!!!
tyylee - When you do Make and Break are your children able to come up with another similar word? Some of mine never seem to be able to do anything except rhyming words, they can't seem to use word parts or analogies.
Mary/PA - darthy, do you work on those during writing when they wheren't part of the story?
DebDub - he's obviously not RR
darthy/RR/AL - Yes, Mary, they are easily generated from our talking time
darthy/RR/AL - How many successful students are each of you getting out this year?????
Doug - tyylee- analogies are important and at out continuing contact we were reminded to show 3 examples not just one...they all booooed me when I remended them that it must be kept to 2 minutes
tyylee - I just took a new child in at level 14. She knows lots of words by sight but has no strategies to use when she doesn't know a word.
Didi (Oz) - Keeping to 2 mins is hard
DebDub - doesnt she have to be using something to be reading at level 14?
Mary/PA - tyylee! How did she get to level 14? That's very strange
darthy/RR/AL - Good for you tyylee - I've tested some kids in the gifted program who were lost if they came to an unknown word - they had NO strategies
tyylee - Doug, we were told that after we show three examples to ask the child if they know any other words that look like/ sound like/ or work like that. They are suppose to be able to generate another example.
Mary/PA - Hi janice and ljs
janice - we are discontinuing children at level 14
Mary/PA - tyylee, at what point in the lesson do you do that?
Doug - tyylee- I forget that part
Mary/PA - janice, we have to have them at 16 now
tyylee - Our Basal reading program stresses lots of sight vocabulary and easy phonics. This child only knew how to make individual sounds, no sound parts, no analogies, and repeated continuiously over and over.
Doug - tyylee- it is a very important part though
Didi (Oz) - Janice how do they cope back in the classroom
Doug - mary- yikes 16?
janice - most of my children have discontinued at 16-18, but we are lettting them out at 14 if all strategies are in place
tyylee - Doug, after you have done your Make and Break you ask them to come up with a similar word.
ljs - I'm getting 4 out of 8 discontinued this year But this is my first year. Is this normal?
janice - pretty good
Mary/PA - ljs, that depends, every year is a bit different
janice - your training year is a tough one
Doug - janice...call me weird but I give equal value to all parts of the OS...for exaple, I like 40 words or more on the WV
janice - our district has those expectations also - text level is not enough
Didi (Oz) - Some of our first ones discontinued at 15 last year seemed to struggle but the class were very high in reading levels
janice - How many RR children do each of you do
janice - i do 5 RR children and 2 small groups
Didi (Oz) - I have 4
ljs - we're being told ours need to go out at at least a 16, hopefully a 20. What about you guys
Mary/PA - 4 at a time for me, I do Kindergarten every morning, so I only have half a day fro RR
Doug - I do 3 kids and I have a sub for absences
Didi (Oz) - Thats about the same as we've been told
janice - our TL expects 16 at the end of year - maybe a 14 if strategies are in place and writing is equal
ljs - I teach 2nd gr and do RR before and after school
Mary/PA - Doug, what do you mean a sub for absences?
janice - oz - what do you do the other part of your day
DebDub - ljs-how many kids do you see?
Mary/PA - ljs, when do you start? 6 AM?
Doug - 1js- wow. We have a teacher at our school doing that . You must have good cooperation from the parents...Do they get picked up at the end of the day?
ljs - I teach 2nd gr and do RR before and after school
Didi (Oz) - I take 8 classes for an hour each for the teachers non contact time and 4 1/2 hrs in the special ed unit
janice - i think I have it made - listening to some of you
Doug - Mary- its an idea from Carol Lyons. Rather than doubling when an absence comes I have a sub. They do a roaming lesson during an absence. Personally, I would much rather observe my kids in the class during absences
Didi (Oz) - each week that is
Mary/PA - Didi, that addes up to 12 1/2 hrs! is that every day?
DebDub - I have first grade in ht e AM then I teach 1 unofficial RR student and two Literacy Groups
janice - when i first started I did 1/2 day 2nd grade and 4 RR stduent in the afternoon
tylee - Some of my RR children who discontinues last year are now starting to struggle in second grade. They still have strategies but are so slow using them and are not able to get to longer words, partly because of limited vocab. on their part. How are your children doing in later years?
Doug - I wrote to Ohio and they have not responded. I want to skip Fridays and do guided reading in the class on a Friday
janice - but I really love my schedule now -
DebDub - I'm thinking about doing a RR/Sp. Ed. Resource split next year. Anyone do that?
tylee - Doug, I am a Title 1 teacher the other half of my day and we do guided reading for first and second graders. It is nice to see the children in both settings.
Mary/PA - Doug, do your first grade classes teach reading in the PM?
janice - we have some teachers in our district who do 7 RR students a day
Doug - don't laugh but literacy is taught all day
Mary/PA - DebDub, I don't, but have heard of others who do
Didi (Oz) - They don't let us do full time RR usually
darthy/RR/AL - I didn't mean to leave so abruptly - screen froze up and kicked me out
Mary/PA - We have no control over what we teach, the district tells us what our assignments are
Doug - darthy welcome back
Mary/PA - janice, is RR all they do?
darthy/RR/AL - I would love to do full time RR - one teacher in our group did that, but she served TWO schools - very difficult
tylee - Because of money issues all our RR teachers are also Title teachers.
Didi (Oz) - Doing non contact time there's non as much work as when I was sharing a class last year
darthy/RR/AL - Mary, same with us - we have almost NO control, BUT we use the buzz word "Site BAsed Management" familiar with that ruse????
Doug - I have to leave friends. I enjoyed the chat mary. Thanks again Mary
Didi (Oz) - What are title teachers?
Mary/PA - Didi, can you please explain "contact time?
DebDub - I've been sharing a class since 1993
darthy/RR/AL - BYe DOug
Mary/PA - Doug, hope to see you next time
darthy/RR/AL - I was a TItle I teacher until my school went "TOtal TItle I" and I don't like it at all now
Mary/PA - title teachers are paid through federal funds
tylee - Title 1 is a federally funded program for low income schools. We support reading and/or math in our schools.
Didi (Oz) - Our teacher get 2 hours release from their class a week non contact time and I take take their class for one of those hours
darthy/RR/AL - SOrry, folks, I have a new keyboard, and I keep getting in too many capital letters
Mary/PA - Oh, I see, didi, that's interesting
tylee - Didi, don't they get free time during specials like art and music?
darthy/RR/AL - How many successful students are each of you getting out this year????
Mary/PA - darthy, that depends upon what you mean by successful
Didi (Oz) - Their other hour is split with a music lesson and a phys ed lesson everything else the class teacher does
Mary/PA - I didn't discontinue any of my first rounders, I didn't feel that they were solid enough, but they are doing OK in class, we'll see what happens next year,though
RRTCA - I discontinued 1 of my first four students. 2 of my first round have been referred to our Student Study Team for a longer intervention. So 1 of the 4 was neither discontinued nor referred for further intervention.
darthy/RR/AL - Well, Mary, we've had 4 students who were unsuccessful by RR standards, and that's keeping our total school numbers very low - we are upset that we couldn't move those 4 on into another program before 65 lessons
Mary/PA - My second rounders are making good progress, their strategies are getting set very well, now I have to get the levels up
RRTCA - Is 65 a magical number in your district?
Didi (Oz) - What do you mean you didn't discontinue any ? do you mean at a satisfactory level?
tylee - 65 what?
DebDub - I have a student who's gaining levels but not fluently
RRTCA - Darthy mentioned 65 lessons
DebDub - tell us about 65
darthy/RR/AL - Yes, RRTCA, we were without a TL this year, and the one who hopes to train as TL, just wouldn't let us move out the ones who couldn't make it
Mary/PA - darthy, I know what you mean, but that's nothing new here, they do very little testing for sp/ed in first grade - will do it in second if there is a big push from teacher or parent
tylee - Mary, at what level were these nondiscontinued children?
Didi (Oz) - I just refered one on after 20 weeks at level10 but he has major learning difficulties
Mary/PA - Didi, they had their 20 weeks, time was up, their strategies were still no solid, I exited them
darthy/RR/AL - I am very upset at being considered a "screening program" for spec. ed. and having , or being forced to keep them for 65 sessions, or 20 weeks.
Mary/PA - 10 - 14
Mary/PA - darthy, I know what you mean
tylee - But that is one of the
darthy/RR/AL - Oh, thank goodness, Mary, someone else understands my frustration!!!
RRTCA - I am happy to hear that others have had students at levels 12 - 14 but chose to exit instead of discontinue due to strategies not being solid. I have had this happen also and colleagues questioned why I didn't feel discontinuning was the answer.
DebDub - bye
tylee - selling points for RR, we are suppose to save children from special ed
Didi (Oz) - It reflects badly on the program with these children with multiple problems
Mary/PA - I'm the only RR teacher in my building, the lowest kids are very low
darthy/RR/AL - BUT ----tylee, you know a long time before 20 weeks, or 65 sesions, that they are not going to make it
RRTCA - I just hear Marie Clay again say that there are two successful outcomes of RR - discontinuing and a realization that longer intervention is necessary ( something like that).
darthy/RR/AL - Yes, Mary, our first graders were VERY low this year, and we have 3 RR units
Mary/PA - I get them all, if there was another teacher, we'd be able to move up the ranks quicker, I would have had just two of the lowest, instead of all four, do you know what I mean?
Didi (Oz) - My three I started this year are not too bad and the new one I start with after the holidays has high writing scores in the ob but low reading so will be interesting.
tylee - Yes you know that they are or are not going to make it before that but I like to think about where they would have been without our help, we are probably the only time they will ever get 1-1 tutoring.
RRTCA - Yes Mary I do know what you mean. It would be nice to spread the children amoung other RR teachers.
darthy/RR/AL - Yes, Mary, we are trying to get our K teachers to begin SOME kind of referral process on the lowest ones, some will support us, others are just waiting to retire!!
Didi (Oz) - That's right Tylee and the mother and last years teacher think that about the one I just put off program
darthy/RR/AL - WHat is happening in my districts testing program is that the RR is pushing them just that tiny bit above the cut off for 1st grade LD placement, but they will go in 2nd or 3rd
Mary/PA - It used to bother me, but I do know that these children are better off having had the RR experience than they would have been without it
tylee - Having a second RR teacher in the building this year has made a world of difference. It enables us to reach into the higher children and it helps the moral of the RR teacher (me)
darthy/RR/AL - Yes, tylee, I need my morale boosted !!
RRTCA - I believe that with RR intervention the Student Study Teams see improvement and then will not refer for testing. Sometimes I feel that the educational communtiy don't see the difference between acceleration and progress.
Mary/PA - I keep hoping something will change in our didtrict, but I dought that it will
Mary/PA - Do we want to set a topic for next time?
darthy/RR/AL - AND, if we don't keep our SUccess rate up, with high numbers of "successful" RR's, we are threatened with losing the program - can you believe that???
Didi (Oz) - We had 4 RR teachers last year and that was great even though 2 of us were inour training year. It made teaching in the Year 2 classrooms easier too. ( Equiv to your grade 1)
Mary/PA - darthy, yes, I can belive it, that's what we hear every year
tylee - Mary, how about Make and
tylee - break at higher levels
Didi (Oz) - Yes please Mary
MNZ - Hello all. I still haven't figured out the time diference, it seems. Oh dear!
Mary/PA - Any other suggestions?
darthy/RR/AL - I understand MNZ, I've done the same thing
RRTCA - MNZ it's only 7:10 here on the West Coast
darthy/RR/AL - How about "END of the Year Testing???"
Didi (Oz) - I got tricked lAST TIME IS aMERICA ON SUMMERTIME NOW?
Mary/PA - It's after 10:00 here
darthy/RR/AL - We are on our DAylight SAving TIme
MNZ - It is2.05 pm here.
Mary/PA - Didi, yes we are
tylee - It is just 9:10 where I am. Hard to keep track of it!!!
Didi (Oz) - That's why I was late last time!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
darthy/RR/AL - I've enjoyed the chat so much! You RR teachers are so great!!!
MNZ - EOY teseting..is this like the followup monitoring of ex RR students?
Didi (Oz) - 12 noon here
RRTCA - Night all - See you next month
Mary/PA - May 8th, would be about the time for our next meeting, what do you think our concerns will be then?
darthy/RR/AL - THat could be included, I just love the chat time!!!
darthy/RR/AL - Mary, GEtting all of that PAPERWORK done for OHIO!!!!
Mary/PA - We have suggestions for making and Breaking and Testing, any others?
tylee - Dot, dot, dot, dot
darthy/RR/AL - tylee, you are so sharp!
Didi (Oz) - levels
Mary/PA - Paper work - something I just love - have you folks gotten you new numbers yet?
Didi (Oz) - maybe strategies at higher levels
tylee - no new levels yet, but we are having Cont. contact tomorrow so maybe then.
darthy/RR/AL - Mary, also, how about a chance to give each other a pat on the back for something that happened that really changed a child's reading?????
Mary/PA - We've never talked about Discontinuing as a topic of concentration - I think that next time we'll all be wondering about how others are doing with this and what problems we are having - do you think that the topic could be discontinuing?
Didi (Oz) - make and break is always good
darthy/RR/AL - See you RR"s next month, unless you are in the regular chatroom one evening, YES, GOod idea Mary
Didi (Oz) - sounds good Mary
tylee - I like that topic, Mary, we all need to think about that.
MNZ - I think that Disc would be a good topic.
Mary/PA - I think that M & B will be part of our concerns when thinking about Discontinuing - what are we teaching? what are we looking for etc
Didi (Oz) - MNZ where aboutin NZ ?
MNZ - Wellington, Didi. Where in Oz are you?
Mary/PA - OK, I have to go now, I'll see you all next time, good night and thanks for coming
tylee - Must get busy and get my RR homework done for CC tomorrow. Happy teaching everyone. Thanks Mary.
Didi (Oz) - Cairns Far North Queensland.
Didi (Oz) - Stayed with friends in Wllington what a windy time
MNZ - How long have you been doing RR, Didi? It can be windy...not all the time though LOL
Didi (Oz) - This is just my second year and as we had our tutor resign halfway through last year there is still so much to take in
Didi (Oz) - What week are you up to with your children
MNZ - There's a lot to learn even without a Tutor change. Did you get a new one easily?
Didi (Oz) - Yes the tutor from the other group then had both groups of trainees
MNZ - My kids come in throughout the year. They start school on their 5th b/day and come into RR as soon as poss when the turn 6.
Didi (Oz) - I'm with her again this year my partenetr is with the new tutor for continuing teachers.
Didi (Oz) - s right thats where the NZ system falls foul here with the cut of age at 7yrs 2 mths as ours all start in jan
Didi (Oz) - tried to explain the benefits of stagered intake but the teachers here throw their hands up in horror
MNZ - Yes, cut offs are hard to deal with. I am in favour of our system. That way the kids don't have to wait so long for the help that they ned.
Didi (Oz) - I have a new boy starting next week and he is 7yr 1mth would have missed out if he hadn't tested lowest for this vacancy
MNZ - Also, the pgm is designed to work with six year olds. It does work for older ones, but we are told that the optimum age band is 6.0-6.3.
Didi (Oz) - He is only 'old' becuse of our once a year intake and has only had the same educational exposure as the younger kids
MNZ - That has been revised to the child having had one year at school though.
Didi (Oz) - I think that is prob right but many of ours turn 6 within weeks of their first eb\ntry to school in Year 1
MNZ - I worked with a boy this year who was 6.5. He had no English at all and no schooling in his country of origin...one week off the plane and he was in RR!
Didi (Oz) - I'm on week 11 next week with the three I started with this year
Didi (Oz) - Do find the long Christmas break knocks the chldren back
Didi (Oz) - Wow that is a challenge
MNZ - Mine are spread out...2 new ones to come in, one at week 3, week 8, week 14 etc. I teach 8 students BTW.
MNZ - Some kids do drop back a bit...lack of practice, I think. But they do pick up again quite quickly.
Didi (Oz) - Are you full time RR
MNZ - Yes. I work in 2 schools and travel during the day.
Didi (Oz) - How long have you been in RR
MNZ - This is my 5th year.
Didi (Oz) - They say here they only want people doing it for 3 years I'm not sure why
Didi (Oz) - I enjoy RR and don't miss the classroom too much
MNZ - Yes, some here say the same thing. But there are several of us working this way in my area. I like it. I think that the 3 year thing may be to do with burnout and with transferring RR expertise back to the classroom.
Didi (Oz) - Do you have a public holiday for ANZAC Day too?
MNZ - Yes. We got Easter and ANZAC day tagged onto our April holidays. @1/2 weeks instead of 2 weeks!
Didi (Oz) - I think you're right it is a lot of lesson to write up each night for you
MNZ - Yes, lots of writing up, but not many Staff/team/subject mtgs :-)
Didi (Oz) - Same here but we only get one week Easter anzac 3days may day next week. No flies on the department
Didi (Oz) - The plus signs didn't come up!
MNZ - We ahve 4 terms in the school year. Breaks in April, July, Sept and Christmas/January.
Didi (Oz) - Same here but other states here get 2 weeks of in April instead of the one we get
Didi (Oz) - 2 weeks in July and Sept
MNZ - Guess that they are similar to us then.
Didi (Oz) - Have you ever heard Marie Clay talk
MNZ - When do you finish for Christmas break? We are usually about 17 Dec.
Didi (Oz) - About the same most years last year was a bit later
MNZ - No, I haven't. She seems to spend a lot of time O/Seas. She is speaking in Auckland soon, but it is too far for me to travel to easily.
MNZ - I have heard Barbara Watson though. She's great!
Didi (Oz) - How far is Aukland ? I guess it's time as well as distance
Didi (Oz) - Who is BArbara
MNZ - Yes, time too. It's about 800 miles.
MNZ - Barbara Watson is Director of RR in NZ and worked with MMC on researching and developing RR.
Didi (Oz) - A bit like here to Brisbane Thats two very long days of driving. We're not doing it this year have in July hte past two years.
MNZ - Well long day's drive for us to AK. I went to Brisbane last year at the end of June to visit my brother.
MNZ - Didn't drive there though!LOL
Didi (Oz) - I have to go and get some things done. See you later great chatting to you. I can get on next session as now with their daylightsaving its in our lunch time and The next lesson is my RR work time
Didi (Oz) - You'd have swim lol
Didi (Oz) - Do you go to the other chat rooms at all?
MNZ - OK. I will probably miss out next mtg. It seems to start at 1pm our time. I will be working. Might catch you another time. Do visit any of the other rooms?
Didi (Oz) - Yes I often look in on the other rooms at this site
MNZ - Ha! Great minds! I sometimes look in them in the evening. Maybe I'll see you in one of them sometime.
Didi (Oz) - will keep an eye open for you
Didi (Oz) - see you
MNZ - OK. CU..bye
