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Kim/KS/8th - Hello! Welcome to tonight's live discussion of Six Trait Writing.
Kim/KS/8th - Rabb, I love Six Trait! It helps you be a better teacher, and helps the students become better writers!
Rabb - Kim--how long have you used it?
Kim/KS/8th - Rabb, I have been using Six Trait for about six or seven years. I have been a trained facilitator for five.
kat/Kathleen - Kim, can you give us a brief definition of what Six Trait is?
Kim/KS/8th - Kathleen, sure. Writing has been divided into six areas that teachers value most--Ideas and Content, Organization, Voice, Word Choice, Sentence Fluency, and Writing Conventtions.
n2kids - Kim, do you teach an area each day or what?
Kim/KS/8th - Ideas and Content is the basic message that the writer is trying to get across to the readers.
Lori - How do you go about teaching ideas and content?
n2kids - Kim, do you teach an area each day or what?
Mary K&1 - How do you get them started?
Denise/3/nj - This is the first time I have heard of this type of writing. could you let me know what it involves or did you already do that this evening?
Kim/KS/8th - n2kids, By the time I get the students (8th grade) most have had Six Trait for several years. One trait a day is still too much! I usually cover one or two traits for each major writing assignment, and try to do mini-lessons and activities beforehand.
Cathie - Can you do this with primary grades,Kim
Rabb - Kim--can you share some of your activities?
Kim/KS/8th - Your questions are coming fast! If it seems like I haven't answered your question--please ask me again!
n2kids - Is this tied to the Cunningham Model in terms of writing?
Barb E. 9/MI - Kim, would you please repeat the six traits?
Kim/KS/8th - Denise, the six traits are Ideas and Content, Organization, Voice, Word Choice, Sentence Fluency, and Writing Conventions. Let's all talk about Ideas and Content for a while. It is the basic message that a writer is trying to get across.
Mary K&1 - Where's the starting point?
Tony B/CA - Thanks for this workshop, Kim. You
kat/Kathleen - Kim, should we concentrate on one at a time, in order?
Denise/3/nj - Thank you for posting the 6 traits.
Tony B/CA - You're brave and wonderful for taking this on. My ? is the same as Cathie, what is the appropriate age to introduce this set of skills?
Lori - How do you teach ideas and content?
Kim/KS/8th - Cathie, yes you can do this with primary grades. My district is even using it with Kindergarten--to an extent.
n2kids - Do the students use graphic organizers for organizing their ideas?
kat/Kathleen - KIm k-12?
Barb E. 9/MI - I second Lori's question: How does one TEACH ideas without teaching what to think?
Kim/KS/8th - I'm trying to type quickly, so pardon the errors! Yes, Kathleen K-12!
Denise/3/nj - Great question Barb
Kim/KS/8th - Graphic organizers!! I love them. I have my students use them for everything!
Mary K&1 - Hey, gang, Bob put the six traits in the side panel! Thanks Bob!
Denise/3/nj - Kim if you were to just start this approach . How would I begin?
Kim/KS/8th - Okay, some ideas for teaching ideas and content (I/C) are coming up!
n2kids - What's everything???
Bob R/CA - :o)
kat/Kathleen - (a good meeting topic: graphic organizers)
n2kids - Yes Kathleen, I agree!
Lori - Yes - Kathleen!
Kim/KS/8th - Denise, one trait at a time. I would start with I/C--especially with primary students.
Barb E. 9/MI - Duhhh, what are graphic organizers?
Tony B/CA - Are the traits developmentally ordered? If so, is there some assessment rubric used?
Mary K&1 - For Ideas and Content, do you use story starters?
Denise/3/nj - grapphic organizers are those WONDERFUL graphic or shapes used to represeent ideas and their relationship to each other. A Spider web is the one I use most often with my third graders.
Kim/KS/8th - Barb, Graphic organizers are tools like webbing, Venn diagrams, etc. There are a bunch! I wish I had the capability of showing you some. If you go to my website, there is a section with links to examples. I'll give my URL later.
Barb E. 9/MI - Thanks, Denise. I sometimes use webbing, too.
Barb E. 9/MI - Thanks, Kim.
Kim/KS/8th - Thanks Denise! Your def. is better than mine.
n2kids - Kim, with content do you teach the students what their writing should consist of?
Lori - Kim - Can you tell us ways that you teach each area?
Denise/3/nj - Oh Kim I can't wait to se your web site. I just started teaching this year and found that graphic organizers were the easiest way for my students to see how to organize their thoughts - this form of prewriting seemed to really get the ball rolling.
Kim/KS/8th - Okay, first activity for I/C. Cartoons! (and I use them for all the traits.) I look in the comics everyday to find cartoons that relate to EVERYTHING I teach. For I/C, Calvin and Hobbes is great. Of course, now you will need a book of cartoons. Most of mine for I/C have to do with Calvin tring to come up with an idea without working at it.
Barb E. 9/MI - Our curriculum gurus are currently into Power Writing.
Rabb - Denise--do you color code your graphic organizers? My kids (2nd) were really able to focus using color.
Rabb - Barb--that's what we do.
Kim/KS/8th - n2kids, I'm not sure I understand your question.
Lori - Cool - I love Calvin! What's next????
Denise/3/nj - Rabb- what do you mean by color coding? I am not doing it. My kids would love cartoons.
Patti - In Florida, the 4th, 8th, and 10th graders take a state writing test. They write to either an expository prompt or a narrative prompt. They are scored on focus, organization, support, and conventions (spelling, punctuation, etc.). We have found Power Writing to be extremely helpful in the area of expository writing.
kat/Kathleen - Define "content", Kim, I think
n2kids - Thank you Kathleen.
Kim/KS/8th - Rabb, COLOR CODING! I color coded all of the traits. Barb--I want to know more about Power Writing. Can we talk later, maybe at the end of this session?
Barb E. 9/MI - Yes, Patti, it is. But it kind of stifles creativity. Kim, sure!
Rabb - Denise--at the center of my web is the topic (red), ideas about each topic (green), details about each topic (blue). Then I can just tell them I want a red, green, blue, green, blue, green, blue, red...does that make sense?
Denise/3/nj - Okay once we find a good cartoon; what do we do with it?
Kim/KS/8th - Ideas and Content is really IDEAS! I am going to post my defintion. Give me a minute.
Barb E. 9/MI - Shoot, Rabb . . . freshmen would love that! 8-)
Denise/3/nj - Rabb I LOVE it!!!! I can't wait to use your idea. so many times I tried to have them add more details but they were too broad. Your idea will zero in on what they need to add. Thanks!
Cincin 1 - I came late. I teach first grade. I am looking for ideas for mini-lessons for first graders. Will any of this be appropriate?
n2kids - Do your kids ever have trouble coming up with a topic to write about?
Rabb - Not my original idea--my mentor teacher's good thought!!
Lori - Rabb- Thank you for the idea about webbing. I have done it with grammar, but never thought about webbing. duhhhh!
n2kids - Barb, I want to join the disc. on power writing.
kat/Kathleen - Cicnin, perhaps, stick around, it can't hurt ;-). And the transcriopt might be posted at some point so yu can go back and refer to it.
Denise/3/nj - We used the webbing when writing everything from original fairy tales to animal research projects.
Kim/KS/8th - I/C is what the writer has to say, a message. The ideas should be fresh and original. The ideas should also come from the writer's experience.(when possible. The paper should be interesting and hold the reader's attention all the way through. The paper should contain suppporting details that enrich the main idea. The main idea should stand out from the supporting details. The writer should show how people respond to life and to each other.
Patti - Many teachers agree that Power Writing stifles creativity. However, our scores have improved at the fourth grade level. I can only attribute it to the fact that we now have a curriculum that all teachers are using, K-5. Once Power Writing is introduced and fine tuned, by grade 3 the students are able to add their own creativity because they have mastered the focus and organization part.
Kim/KS/8th - Cincin, you can adapt almost anything!
kat/Kathleen - (We'll have a meeting on Power Writing soon)
n2kids - Do your students have difficulty coming up with topics to write about?
Barb E. 9/MI - Thanks for the clarification, Kim. My greatest difficulty is getting them to come up with fresh ideas.
Kim/KS/8th - n2kids, we brainstorm for topic ideas. My writing assignments usually tie into another curricular area. So we are sometimes limited.
Patti - Our students are not left to come up with their own topic very often. The way the state of Florida tests, the students are supplied with a prompt. The prompt may or may not be something that the student has some experience with. Therefore, teachers usually give the students prompts once or twice a week to use for their writing.
Kim/KS/8th - Barb, there are ideas for coming up with topics at my website.
kat/Kathleen - Ok, back to 6 Traits :-)
Denise/3/nj - What type of ideas(topics) do you like them to write about for this type of activity? I have found that some children ggcan write about anyuting but that others have a difficult writing about many things. How do you encourage originality?
n2kids - Once you've reviewed the traits, do you expect their writing to have all of them present?
Kim/KS/8th - Okay, back to the cartoons. Put one on the overhead and discuss its relevance to I/C. Without an exact example, it's hard to explain it. You have to adapt to what you have.
Kim/KS/8th - n2kids, eventually, yes.
Barb E. 9/MI - Kim, Tony asked earlier about assessment rubrics. Do you use them for each trait?
Kim/KS/8th - Thanks, Patti. Denise, sometimes the originality comes through in voice.
kat/Kathleen - So, you elicit the literal and the implied meaning of the cartoon? not making myself clear, I think:-/
Lori - How do you do voice?
Mary K&1 - If you're going to talk about rubrics, have you put the ones for lower grade levels on your web site?
Kim/KS/8th - Tony, sorry I missed your question. Yes, there is a rubric for every trait. (http://www.nwrel.org/eval/toolkit/traits)
Barb E. 9/MI - Yet another question, Kim. I hope this isn't overwhelming! Do you discuss the cartoon as a class, or just have them write about it?
kat/Kathleen - Lori, I think we'll get voice after 'organization'
Denise/3/nj - So you have a cartoon up, and you discuss the meanings of the cartoon. sounds good so far.....
Kim/KS/8th - Mary, I don't know yet. Since the original rubrics are copyrighted, I'm afraid of getting in trouble. Bob says I need permission.
Lori - Oh, sorry. I thought organization was graphic organizers?!?
n2kids - Do you also teach the stages of writing?
Kim/KS/8th - Barb, we discuss it as a class. I usually use it as a warmup--not even a mini-lesson.
Patti - Kim, I tried to link to your website from the link you posted. I got an error message.
Kim/KS/8th - Kathleen, I think tonight I am going to focus on Ideas and Content. There are so many questions. Perhaps we should set up more meetings for the other traits.
Barb E. 9/MI - Good idea, Kim! Maybe take each one as a topic?
Mary K&1 - Ok, too bad, the little folks need easier language, I guess that'll be up to each teacher
kat/Kathleen - Kim, that makes sense..tonight stay with "Ideas and Content"..this is a big topic to cover in one meeting..
Kim/KS/8th - Patti, that isn't my website. It's the site of the original rubrics. I'll try again. n2kids, YES! The writing process goes hand in hand with Six Trait, but they do not replace each other. Lori, graphic organizers fit in with I/C and Org.
Kim/KS/8th - Mary, maybe I could email them to you.
n2kids - Kim, do you usually model a story before you ask the class to write?
kat/Kathleen - Sorry, Lori, my mistake about graphic organziers, you were right! ;-/
Mary K&1 - Kim, That would be great!
Kim/KS/8th - Original Six Trait rubrics: http://www.nwrel.org/eval/toolkit/traits
Lori - Kim - Would it help if you had an example of a cartoon to develop? Ok - Kathleen :o)
Kim/KS/8th - n2kids, not with 8th graders, but I believe the primary teachers do.
Kim/KS/8th - n2kids, I take that back. The very first writing assignment, I write my own and they help me go through all of the stages.
Denise/3/nj - Where do we go from the class discussion? =Þ
Kim/KS/8th - Lori, we could try it. Or here, this one is easy to describe. It's a drwing of car with a bumper sticker that says, "I BRAKE FOR SUDDEN INSPIRATION."
Barb E. 9/MI - I can see it, Kim. What's next?
Kim/KS/8th - I put it up and let the students read it. Then I ask, "Do good ideas just suddenly pop into our heads?
n2kids - What creative ways to you publish your students' writings?
Kim/KS/8th - The students usually answer sometimes. I reply with, "Okay, what about when they don't? Then what do we do?"
Kim/KS/8th - Then we brainstorm different ways to come up with ideas for topics.
Kim/KS/8th - Here's another activity to generate ideas. Collect a variety of transparencies of pictures, paintings, drawings, etc. with NO words.
Kim/KS/8th - Denise, I don't think so.
Kathleen - Kim, the kids must really 'get into' that activity..
Lori - What do you do with the pictures?
Kim/KS/8th - Number the transparencies and show them one at a time to the students. The students are to write a phrase, title, or sentence about what they see. Encourage them to really LOOK!
Mary K&1 - Yes, we call them story starters up here
Kim/KS/8th - There is no talking or discussing at this time. Give the students a few minutes, then move on to another tranparency. Do this for all of the trans.
Kathleen - I like that they don't discuss at first..encourages everyone to think, not depend upon others to come up with the ideas
Kim/KS/8th - Now go back to each transparency and discuss what the students wrote. Point out that different ideas can evolve from the same image. Discuss each trans. You can then have the students choose one to write about.
Kim/KS/8th - Ready for a new activity?
Mary K&1 - Yes
dsw - Great way to get independent thoughts!
dsw - Yes
Lori - Yes! :o)
Kathleen - Kim, let's set a limit here on time, this has been a lot for you to do alone..one more activity???
Barb E. 9/MI - Fire away!
Kim/KS/8th - Okay, this one has to do with smell. Present the students with something that has a distinctive odor, but don't let the students see what it is.
Mary K&1 - OOO, muti-sensory, I like it!
Kathleen - multiple intelligences!! ;-)
dsw - Wow my kids love anything different!
Kim/KS/8th - After a few minutes have the students write down their thoughts about what the odor REMINDS THEM OF and why. (not what the odor actually is!) It could be a place, event, etc. Then have the students write a story or essay based on their thoughts.
Rabb - That's a great one Kim--smell is a very powerful trigger for memory!:)
Kim/KS/8th - For example, every time I smell freshly cut grass, I am reminded of my grandmother. I could then write about the connection.
Mary K&1 - What are some examples of smells that you've used?
Kim/KS/8th - Kathleen, I don't mind staying longer, if that's okay.
Kathleen - ahhh, how well does it work with the kids, kim?
Kathleen - Kim, you go as long as you can hold up! :-)
Kim/KS/8th - Mary, lemons, cut grass, cleaning solution, baby powder or lotion, strong "old lady" perfume--wish I could remember the name.
Barb E. 9/MI - I agree, Mary. I'm trying to think of something which would smell strong enough to cover the classroom. . .
Lori - Rose perfume!!!!
Kathleen - (OH, boy, I'm afraid to ask which is considered "old lady perfume". ;-)
Kim/KS/8th - Kathleen, the different responses are a scream. One kid might find the smell to remind her of something wonderful, like her grandmother, while another remembers the time his leg was cut by a weed eater.
Kathleen - oh, YUCK!! I hope that's not my scent!!
Barb E. 9/MI - So am I, Kat!
Kim/KS/8th - Kathleen, I can't remember the name, but when I worked in a nursing home, all of the ladies had it! It smelled like a grandma!
Lori - What about the other senses?
Kathleen - (is wasn't arpege, was it?? i hope)
Kim/KS/8th - For some of the odors, you might need to pass around a sample. This is great time to teach a science lesson on how to properly smell a substanc. Wafing, I think?
Barb E. 9/MI - Lori, how about sound?
Mary K&1 - You could use music in this way also, couldn't you?
dsw - I would love to use sounds...do you incorporate them?
Barb E. 9/MI - I was also thinking about music, Mary.
Kim/KS/8th - I also use other writing prompts, and there are links to some great ones at my website. (It's easier to send you there than give them all out now.
Lori - This would be a lot of fun! Barb - rattlesnake noises from a bag that you shake! ha!
Kim/KS/8th - WAFTING--I just remembered, it's wafting--where you use your hand to fan the odor toward your nose so you don't directly inhale it.
Barb E. 9/MI - Cool, Lori!
Kim/KS/8th - Yes, I have one for music!
dsw - Doorbells and balloons popping.
Barb E. 9/MI - Kim, is your website address the one I'd get if I click on your blue name up in the Occupants list?
Kim/KS/8th - This one I call Movie Music, but you could also do it with those tapes of nature sounds.
Barb E. 9/MI - creaky door, footsteps, flushing toilet . . .
Lori - flushing toilet - just imagine the stories!!!!
Kim/KS/8th - Barb, No, that's my email. My site is http://www.angelfire.com/ks/teachme/teachertalk.html
Mary K&1 - How about taste?
dsw - I am picturing my class writing furiously!!!!
Kim/KS/8th - Lori, love the toilet idea! Play the sound (or music) and let the students write down what they would expect to SEE (toilet idea not good, now!)! Play the sound several times.
dsw - Lemon slices and jelly beans could really get the creativity to stir I bet.
Barb E. 9/MI - Taste could get weird . . .
Mary K&1 - And touch? Oh, I'm starting to think!! Look out!
Kim/KS/8th - Mary, you could do something similar with taste, but I worry about kids with allergies.
Lori - ohh - slimy jelly on Halloween!
dsw - Weird with third graders can also be hysterical.
Lori - I agree - dsw!
Barb E. 9/MI - touch: cooked spaghetti?
Kim/KS/8th - Okay, touch. Put something in a bag and have the students touch it without looking. Then have them write about what they think it is.
Mary K&1 - I always know who is allergic to what and would stay away from those
Kim/KS/8th - Barb, that's gross---I love it!
Barb E. 9/MI - wet, cold cooked spaghetti
dsw - I am picturing on offf those feely box activities that I used to do when I taught preschool. SCooked spaghetti was always good as well as sandpaper and fur.
Barb E. 9/MI - Kim, with my students, gross is good.
Kim/KS/8th - Mary, then go for it. With 8th graders, I know very little. I even had a student who had asthma, but I didn't know until he had an attack and no inhaler!
Tabs/K/Mo - A rubber glove filled with ice water
Lori - What about the sauce - put a little in there with them having to reach in and then pull out their hands - I'd love it!
Kathleen - LORI!! LOL!
Barb E. 9/MI - Good one, Lori!
Kim/KS/8th - dsw, I love those ideas. I hope you guys know that these new ideas you gave me are going to be added to my site.
dsw - Lori ...your kids would probably love it!
Mary K&1 - This is great, I'm starting to wish I had a class to run to tomorrow morning!
dsw - Lori ...your kids would probably love it!
Kim/KS/8th - Idea #4 anyone?
Lori - I have a "little" sick humor in me! Me too, Mary K&1!
Kathleen - Kim, it's up to you :-)
Lori - YES!
Tabs/K/Mo - How about vaseline smeared on something. that would be a spooky tacile
dsw - I am getting sleepy but I would love to hear #4.
Kim/KS/8th - Tabs, vaseline and 8th graders? I don't think so! LOL!!!
Barb E. 9/MI - #4?
Tabs/K/Mo - if it was in a bag they would not know what they were touching.
Mary K&1 - Kim, yes, please ... this is getting very interesting!
Kathleen - OK, one more, #4
dsw - vaseline and pencils maybe baby lotion?
Kim/KS/8th - Before I do #4, there is a bibliography of literature to use with the traits. For I/C the URL is http://www.kent.wednet.edu/staff/creed/ideas_bib.html
Tess - Hi all! I'm a new arrival - just a little lost here. Shaving cream with objects hidden in it? Just a guess...
dsw - How about sand or cornstarch?
Kathleen - Tess, that's a good one!
Kim/KS/8th - If that link doesn't work, you can get to it from my website. From that link, you get to the bibs for the other traits.
Tabs/K/Mo - cornstarch has a nice tactile feel
dsw - Tess I love it!
Kim/KS/8th - This idea is called STORY SKELETON.
Barb E. 9/MI - Cool idea, Tess!
Mary K&1 - I was thinking of fabrics, different ones bring back different memories
Lori - Kim - Thank you for all the sites.
Barb E. 9/MI - Also good, Mary.
Kim/KS/8th - Give the students a series of sentence beginnings that, when completed, will create a very short story.
Tabs/K/Mo - leather, silky, burlap,
Kim/KS/8th - Example: Sentence 1--One morning I was on my way to...
Kim/KS/8th - Sentence 2--I saw a huge spotted...
Kathleen - Kim, so the sentences are each part of a story when put together?
Kim/KS/8th - It was sleeping under...
Kim/KS/8th - Kathleen, yes.
Barb E. 9/MI - Kim, are these sentence starters at your site? If not, could they be?
Kim/KS/8th - Sentence 4--I didn't want to wake it because...
Kim/KS/8th - Sentence 5--Suddenly, I hear...
Tabs/K/Mo - I think if the sentences were simple enough even primary children could do this
dsw - Kim are these on your site or should I be writing furiously?
Mary K&1 - This is starting to remind me of "Build a Super Sentence" books
Barb E. 9/MI - I agree, dsw!
Kim/KS/8th - Barb, there is another example at my site. I got this set from someone else--better not add it to my site.
Kim/KS/8th - Sentence 6--I began to run toward...
Kim/KS/8th - Just as I got there...
Kim/KS/8th - Sentence 7--I'm lucky that...
Kim/KS/8th - That's it. The best one I read was about myself. I was the huge spotted thing and the student didn't want to wake me because there was a test that day!
Kami/KS/3 - Kim could I have the URL of your site to check out some of your six trait ideas
Kim/KS/8th - Barb, I can email them to you if you give me your address.
Kathleen - Kim, why not post them on the main chatboard?
Barb E. 9/MI - Done, Kim! I'll e-mail it to you!
Lori - Me, too - Please?
Barb E. 9/MI - Good idea, Kat!
Kim/KS/8th - Kami, sure. It's
http://www.angelfire.com/ks/teachme/teachertalk.html It's geared mostly toward middle school, but almost anything can be adapted.
dsw - bye all.. I thank you for all of the great ideas. Kim I thank you for all of your help and advice I look forward to seeing the rest another night . Night all.
Kami/KS/3 - Thanks....elementary teachers can always ADAPT....HAHAHAH
Kathleen - yes, elem. teachers are very adaptable!
Kim/KS/8th - Kathleen, okay, I'll post them on the chatboard. I know I'm being a big chicken about copyrights and using other people's ideas, but I have always been such a goody-goody. Well, most of the time!
Kami/KS/3 - Kim where do you teach in KS
Kathleen - bye, Barb, I'll be in touch with dates for Power Writing! :-)
Kim/KS/8th - Okay, any other questions about Ideas and Content? Kathleen, I'll get with you about setting up some more sessions. And let's not forget the one about Power Writing!
Kathleen - Kim, thank you VERY much, you really were on the hot seat alone, but you did a wonderful job! You really know the topic!!
Kathleen - I'm moving out for now, good night and thanks to all!!
Lori - This was truly wonderful!
Mary K&1 - Yes, Kim, Thanks so much, You did a great job!
Barb E. 9/MI - Thank you, Kim! I got some super ideas!
Kim/KS/8th - Thanks, Kathleen. This has been fast, furious, and FUNNN! I got some new ideas myself.
Kami/KS/3 - BAxter Springs...we have some six trait activities that are on-line
Kim/KS/8th - Kami, could I have the URL? I will probably link to the activities from my site. I have my own ideas there and links to others on the web that relate.
Kami/KS/3 - http://www.baxter508.k12.ks.us/cook/ if you go under the title on-line projects, you will find tons of activities that children can do over the internet
Kim/KS/8th - Kami, I started my site because I couldn't find anything on the net about Six Trait--apart from the rubrics, and how much help are they?
Kami/KS/3 - Kim they are actual six trait writing lessons- they are all catagorized...we are finishing them up this week...
Kim/KS/8th - Kami, thanks for the URL. I look forward to exploring!
Kami/KS/3 - Bye Kim...nice talking with you..sorry I was late...
Sea/2 - hello...i'm surprised this is still on! thought I'd missed it all! :( :)
Kim/KS/8th - Hi, Sea. We just finished up. We only covered one trait, so Kathleen and I are going to set up some more sessions. This one will be archived.
Sea/2 - kim, which trait was covered?
Kim/KS/8th - Ideas and Content.
Kim/KS/8th - Sea, everyone had some great ideas. I got some more, and I'm going to add them to my site.
Sea/2 - i'll log off too! (betcha you're a wee bit tired?)
Sea/2 - thanks kim...and so long!
Kim/KS/8th - Goodnight everyone! See you next time--same time, same place!!!
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