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~Janet/AR~ - Welcome to the Substitute Teacher's Meeting.
~Janet/AR~ - Are all of you Substitute Teachers?
pambre - I am a sub in IL.
~Janet/AR~ - I am what is called a Certified Sub.
pambre - Are you looking for regular classroom or are happy subbing?
Diane - I am subbing in a suburb of Phila and am looking for a full time teaching position anywhere on the east coast. :)
Diane - I am in elementary ed and there are no jobs in PA.
~Janet/AR~ - Diane, I am too. Are jobs there scarce?
Jen/MD - I subbed last year. Had no problems, but always dreaded the 6AM call!
Diane - I applied to half of the public schools in PA and no one is hiring.
Diane - So now I'm looking into MD,VA, NC
Kathleen - Janet, would it be ok if I ask how people learned of this meeting? I'm interested in knowing what forms of publicity are bringing people to our meetings.
~Janet/AR~ - Diane, jobs in the teaching field are hard now but we should never give up.
~Janet/AR~ - Sure Kat! Go right ahead.
Jen/MD - Kathleen, I'm on the mailing list. BTW: how about having a link for FIRST YEAR TEACHERS on the mentor board?
Diane - I'm just giving up on PA, not teaching
roz - I learned of this meeting from a yahoo search
Kathleen - Would each person post how you learned of this meeting?
~Janet/AR~ - Jen, that seems to be the norm. An early call in hopes they will find someone to fill in.
Diane - I found out about this by browsing the site that I've had bookmarked for awhile.
pambre - I read the chat board and send mail out on sub mail ring.
Mary K&1 - I found it in the meetings schedule
~Janet/AR~ - Welcome Webfoot to the Substitute Teacher's Meeting.
Kathleen - Jen, first year teachers chatboard is on the list..it's a long list...
Jen/MD - Kathleen, did you find any administrators?
Kathleen - Hi, WEBFOOT, welcome...how did you learn of this meeting?
Jen/MD - Kathleen, the TO-DO list?
Kathleen - Jen, I haven't heard from any adminis..I sent a notice in their mailring again today, Janet posted on their board (I think I did too)
Webfoot/WA - I check the sub board every week & saw the posting.
roz - I don't know many subs in my district..just became friends with one and then she left
Kathleen - Yes, Jen, the loooooooong wish-to-be-able-to-do list ;-)
Webfoot/WA - I originally made it to this site through the substitute teacher page.
Kathleen - thank you for the info everyone, I won't interrupt anymore. Thanks, Janet, I'll be in and out eavesdropping :-)
Webfoot/WA - I'm in a very small district. The pay isn't too bad, but the respect could use some work.
Jen/MD - I'm glad that I subbed last year, b/c I learned respect for the position. I will always discipline students more strongly if they act up if the sub is there!
~Janet/Ar~ - cap, I am from AR too. What part are you from?
Mary K&1 - From reading the archive of the last session, did anyone find any lose ends that need to be addressed?
Kathleen - Yes, Janet I did receive that e-mail, thank you for keeping me informed :-)
~Janet/Ar~ - Mary K, some of the issues were about teachers not leaving enough work for them to give out for one.
~Janet/Ar~ - Kat, at least I am still in the running.
Jen/MD - I always came prepared with extra handouts for different topics. If a teacher had a great handout, I took a copy for myself. I also kept track of what lessons I did for each teacher: theirs and my extras.
Mary K&1 - Janet, did we come up with a solution to that problem?
~Janet/Ar~ - Does anyone have that problem with teachers not leaving enough work?
pambre - I always carry extra things as books etc.
Webfoot/WA - Major problem, esp. in jr.& high school! The classes are 75 min lng & the teachers usually only leave 15 min. of work!
~Janet/Ar~ - roz, just discussing some of the issues everyone has about subbing and trying to help each other with solutions.
Jen/MD - In addition, I took copies of other teacher's activity sheets as I went along.
Kathleen - roz, open forum on the issues related to substitute teaching, perhaps you will get into organizing as an association
Mary K&1 - Did any of you find any helpful information in the sites that were linked for the last archived sub. meeting?
~Janet/Ar~ - Well one solution I have is my bag of goodies!
Jen/MD - Finally, I kept track of what each class had on Excel--also helps you verify your paycheck!
Kathleen - John, are you from the Substitute Teachers Assoc.?
cap/ar - Janet, what do you keep in your bag?
~Janet/Ar~ - Jen, I do the same thing.
~Janet/Ar~ - Diane, any issues that one may have and helping find solutions to the issues.
Kathleen - Diane, what is the biggest issue (problem/need) you encounter as a substitute teacher?
pambre - I also carry candy in my bag.
John T. - Kathleen: I am heading newly formed M-POST, Massachusetts Project Organizing Substitute Teachers; formerly very active with Boston's advocacy group, Substitutes United in Boston Public Schools.
~Janet/Ar~ - cap, educational games, books, puzzels, word searches, crosswords, etc.
Jen/MD - pambre, it's amazing what kids will do for a little jolly-rancher;o)
pambre - Thanks for coming John!
cap/ar - Is there a substitute website?
Jen/MD - John, how can subs learn about associations in their state?
~Janet/Ar~ - John, I read your posts and why don't you explain about the organization.
pambre - HOWS union forming coming!
Kathleen - John, I'm glad you made it tonight. Janet hosts these meetings, John, so I'd like you to meet her first, then perhaps she would like to ask you to talk about what your group is doing to advance the cause/s of Substitute Teachers.
Mary K&1 - You can find the list of sub. sites at http://www.teachers.net/archive/substitutes071098.html
~Janet/Ar~ - cap, on my wesite is a couple on my teachers resource page. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Academy/5146/
roz - I usually make a list on the board or on paper of the students who are well behaved. I'm not too fond of dolling out punishment. I find too many teachers and administrators expect you to have problems. I don't get paid enough to doll out punishment, especially if I don't know the child, or what his background is.
roz - Is there a sub union anywhere?
~Janet/Ar~ - thanks for the website Mary K.
John T. - One important way is to check in regularly into substitute web home pages; e.g. S.U.B.S. and M-POST, http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Agora/4532/subs.htm or to FASTA, Fresno, CA organizing; link is on S.U.B.S. web page; Madison, Wisconsin SUBS union is good; I use AltaVista often to surf their substitute Teacher web sites..Thank you.
pambre - YES unions are forming across the country1
~Janet/Ar~ - roz, I understand what you mean. But one does have to do some punishing, unfortunately.
Diane - How long has everyone been subbing? I just started in March.
~Janet/Ar~ - Diane, I subbed so far for one year.
pambre - I have been subbing 12 years.
cap/ar - This will probably be my 3rd year.
Jen/MD - roz, that may work for small classes. However, in larger classes, I think the majority do okay but there's just a few who decide to give one a hard time.
pambre - ROZ do you ever send students to the office.
Jan/MO - I am just now putting my app in for sub jobs for the upcoming school year
Jen/MD - Last year was my first too, Janet.
roz - I taught full time for 2 years, had my own kids and then began subbing...on and off I've been subbing for about 7 years
~Janet/Ar~ - John T. explain a little about the union for us. How would we join and get the info for the union.
Jen/MD - What I dislike are the start-up costs. I was certified out of state so had to pay $50 for a sub certificate then another $60 for fingerprints. For heaven's sake, I only earned $70 a day at most!!!!!
Kathleen - John, is there any hope for a national assoc. of substitute teachers? or does one exist already?
roz - If I send a kid to the office it's admitting that I can't handle the situation..many times the office can't handle it either..
John T. - response to union inquiry; as pambre say, union organizing is starting, finally, of substitute teachers in California, more in Massachusetts (Springfield newly organizing); but major problem is that existing Teachers' unions, such as AFL-CIO Federation of Teachers, and National Teachers Association do not seem to be interested in organizing substitute teachers, either nationally, or locally; inSpringfield, substitute teachers were rejected by permanent teachers local union; now they belong to Food & Commercial Workers Union!; in California, Fresno substitutes are joining with S.E.I.U. because local teachers union did not seem interested until very lately.
Jen/MD - roz, do you write notes for the teacher? Most asked for names to be given punishment when they returned.
Jan/MO - What ideas work best for rewarding good behavior
pambre - Roz I like that ans. I have found the office is often not a help.
roz - I once called for assistance
roz - what happened
Jen/MD - John, teachers don't realize: if there are not enough willing to sub, they may have to give up their prep time to sub!!
Kathleen - John, do you have information about what percentage of Substitute Teachers nationwide receive some form of benefits?
Webfoot/WA - After being hit & kicked twice, I don't hesitate to call for help. There are many troubled kids with anger problems where I teach.
John T. - Response to Kathleen: thank you for this inquiry. Yes, there is not only hope; but it could become a reality in next two or three years; Warren Fletcher, a longtime substitute Teacher in Los Angeles; sees time when after a number of state and regional substitute associations are created, that a National Association or Project for Organizing Substitute Teachers may evolve. I hope day comes, and I am a senior citizen, when I can proudly attend such a national gathering, perhaps in St.Louis, or Chicago for a central location.
~Janet/Ar~ - Jan, I have used many ideas and one is coupons.
pambre - I found teachers often hate coming back to a list of problem students.
Jen/MD - Jan, I probably shouldn't have, but I let nice ones leave 5 minutes early.
Jen/MD - Gosh, Webfoot, that's awful!!!!!
Kathleen - John, are Substitute Teachers' right protected in any way that our group might not know about?
~Janet/Ar~ - John, in the last meeting Substitutes expressed concern for not having a union for fear of something happening and no one the help them or support them.
pambre - WEBFOOT I have seen these students also. Problem is I get to see them again and again so I try real hard to find a wat to reach them.
Jen/MD - John, what about teachers who are asked to sub for another teacher during their prep time? Is that not violating the substitute teacher's rights?
wendy - Thanks Janet! I will be subbing for the first time in Sept.
Jen/MD - wendy, do you want to sub, or still looking for a permanent position?
Webfoot/WA - I see the same kids over & over, too, but no one does anything about their behavior, so you never know when they will blow up.
pambre - John are we even covered by workmen's com.
John T. - Re: Kathleen query on benefits: Probably very few, especially per diem or daily substitutes; at least that is the case in Massachusetts, where per diem or daily substitutes comprise about 80% of total working; although a high percentage of per diem substitutes work 30 to 40 hours weekly (4 to 5 days) what is needed is someone to do a doctor's thesis on these matters; research statistics on numbers of substitutes; their lack or access to benefits; pay; retirement, etc. etc. Perhaps someday some younger substitute teacher can seek a sizable grant from a Foundations (say $100,000 or more to finance such an inquiry; here in Massachusetts, our State Education Depatment has little or no information on substitute teachers; only a high school diploma is required; although most towns require a B.A. degree for substituting, here in the state where Horace Mann founded public education!
Jen/MD - Janet, isn't there a huge demand for spec. ed?
Mary K&1 - Jen, in my district, we tried to convince the district to recognize substitute teachers as being part of our bargaining unit, but they just won't go for it. We try to get what we can for subs, benefits, protection etc. but the laws aren't on our side.
Kathleen - I wonder what percentage of Substitute Teachers are seeking fulltime employment..I guess there is not way to know without the study that John refers to.
cap/ar - Janet, how long have you been trying to get a job? I'm still trying also.
~Janet/Ar~ - Yes, I am just waiting on a call about the interview I had a month ago. I have kept in touch with the Principal who interviewed me.
Webfoot/WA - Why do they take out unemployment benefits $ from our paychecks when we aren't eligible for unemployment?
Jen/MD - Mary, at least they're fighting the good fight:-)
~Janet/Ar~ - Only this year cap!
wendy - Not certified yet. I'm still in school.
~Janet/Ar~ - wendy, have you started you teacher internship yet?
pambre - Unemployment benifits are available in some states.
Kathleen - WEBfoot, excellent question..if you pay into unemployment, why not eleigible??
Mary K&1 - The labor union laws say that both sides have to agree on who can be part of the group - employer groups and employee groups
Webfoot/WA - The unemployment office says we aren't eligible, but money for it is still taken out of every check!
~Janet/Ar~ - Here in Ark. there is a huge shortage of subs so when openings come up it seems certified subs seeking teaching positions are ignored due to the shortage.
wendy - Yes, I have.
Kathleen - John, do you think that Teachers.Net's Substitute Teachers' chatboard and mailring could be helpful as a national, central information source?
Jen/MD - To those hunting for a job, remember: You can even get hired the week school starts!!!!
Kathleen - WEBfoot, I would take that up with a legislator.
~Janet/Ar~ - wendy, how do you like it?
Mary K&1 - Webfoot, because the courts have declared that you are a seasonal worker, thus not entitled to collect. Back in the old days subs did collect unemployment
Diane - Did anyone get any training or orientation before they started subbing? I didn't get anything. Luckily I am in the district where I went to school so I am familiar with the locations and layouts of most schools.
pambre - The law changed and it is up to each state to decide if they give benifits.
~Janet/Ar~ - Jen, how right you are!!!
John T. - Re: workman's compensation: at least in Massachusetts and especially in Boston, substitutes, I believe, are covered by workman's comp, as this is under state law for most Re: Kathleen on seeking fulltime employment--if she means contract or permanent teacher jobs, of course many would like to have the higher pay, benefits; but among many of my Boston friends, first, many work full-time as substitute teachers, every day, and enjoy our work; S.U.B.S. insists that we too are professionals; all do not want contracts; we want professional status, pay, training, benefits,etc. in our chosen work,at least many of us,as regular substitute teachers--I have been doing it for 12 years, and generally enjoy it and love to teach children from kindergarten through 4th grade; formerly taught middle and high school.
cap/ar - Thanks, Jen for the reminder. There is hope.
Jen/MD - Diane, when I had group interviewing, personnel did orientation at the same time! Pretty freaky, but also efficient!
wendy - Janet, I love it!!
Webfoot/WA - Thanks for the info.
~Janet/Ar~ - Diane no I did not. There is no training for Subs before subing. I think there should be some form of training before one can sub.
Diane - I didn't even have to interview to become a sub.
John T. - Re: Teachers Net Substitute Page and Mailings Can be very helpful in exchanging information, new ideas, techniques to manage classes; how to organize groups, etc.; definitely
~Janet/Ar~ - John, thanks so much for attending and giving us this wonderful information. I think Subs feel left out to the wolves when it comes to protection. Reg. Teachers have protection from the unions so why not Substitutes?
Jen/MD - It may interest some, I have a friend in the United Arab Emigrates. He says that subs wait in a central office every morning for an assignment. They get paid regularly. I like the sound of that! May encourage more outsiders to sub!
~Janet/Ar~ - Jen, that is a good idea! I like that.
Kathleen - John, please spread the word that we are happy to make our Substitute Teachers' chatboard and mailring available to help ST's nationwide.
Kathleen - John, are there any publications for Substitute Teachers.?
John T. - Re: training; in Boston, only a two hour orientation session held only in summer before September school opening; after that NO other training or workshops especially for substitute teachers; although such workshops now are held regularly in Cambridge and Lowell, Mass. and I understand that in Utah, a state group or institute is working on methods to provide special training for substitutes (how to deal with lackof lesson plans,etc.)
~Janet/Ar~ - John, I live in AR and we do not even have an organization. All I had to do to sub was say I wanted to and pass a finger print test.
~Janet/Ar~ - John, I would love to hold workshops for Subs. here how would I go about setting them up.
Jen/MD - John, do you know of an association in Michigan? I had a friend where I student-taught who attended annual meetings. I think it was a state organization.
Webfoot/WA - Here in WA you must be a certified teacher to sub, so it would be nice to see some benefits & rights.
pambre - John have you had negative reaction bt district to union work.
Susan/2nd/NY - web...the only way that will ever happen would be to get all the subs to unite
wendy - Earlier in the chat someone posted some sub sites to look at. I missed them, could someone email them to me or post them again, please?
John T. - Re: publications: except for very few (one is a History of Substitute Teachers, writtenin early 1980's by Ben Visnick, former president of Oakland Teachers Union; most publications or paper deal with how to obtain substitutes;how they can do a better job,etc.; but few books or papers deal with low pay, no benefits in most cases; etc.
~Janet/Ar~ - Lets let John catch up on questions and talk amongst ourselve for a min for him to catch up on the questions.
Webfoot/WA - Susan, your right, not much progress here in WA though.
Kathleen - Partidipants, keep in mind that no employee initiates the formation of a 'union' or any other bargaining unit...that is not unique to our profession. It has to start with you.
Jen/MD - As a sub, I felt intimidated. I wanted to make nice and "be a team player" despite the humiliation, b/c I was trying to make job contacts.
Mary K&1 - Wendy, check the Teachers.Net Archives, you can find them there. This is the address http://teachers.net/archive/index.html
Susan/2nd/NY - The problem is that subs want jobs and don't want the districts think they are involved in causing conflict...starting unions etc.
~Janet/Ar~ - The pay here is not great at all and I feel that keeps the Substitute shortage going.
pambre - WEBFOOT what level do you sub.
Webfoot/WA - Preschool thru 12!
Susan/2nd/NY - I feel for subs...but if this is any consolation....I was a sub too...and that is how I got my foot in the door
~Janet/Ar~ - Susan, subbing is a great way for someone who is certified to get a job eventually.
Susan/2nd/NY - It is also an opportunity to keep your eyes open...and you might pick up ideas on what or what NOT to do that can be useful in an interview
~Janet/Ar~ - How many times a week was everyone called to sub?
Jen/MD - Janet, I've heard of people on jobtalk say they've been looking for up to 10 years! I could not even afford it! I worked another job part-time.
Susan/2nd/NY - It also gives you exposure on different grade levels
pambre - I work 5 days a week for $ 70.
~Janet/Ar~ - Those of you who are certified and subbing, I always took a notebook and kept notes about each classroom.
Webfoot/WA - On the average, 5, but in May I worked almost every day & I only work in one district with one elem., a small jr. high & high school, as well as special needs pre-school.
Jen/MD - Janet, I was not yet certified in the state so I was not called enough to put food on the table.
Susan/2nd/NY - Jen...keep the faith ...we baby boomers will be retiring in a few years and the field should open up big time!
cap/ar - I substituted for 2 years. Worked as an aide for 1. Taught an overflow of kg. and now I'm back to subbing.
~Janet/Ar~ - Jen, I am working in a local hospital in the Radiology Department full time and subbing as well.
Webfoot/WA - Oops! I meant on the average 3 days!
~Janet/Ar~ - Jen, That happens a lot. I was called almost everyday.
Jen/MD - Susan, I'm not licking my chops! I start my first roller-coaster year this fall:-) LOL!
~Janet/Ar~ - We all just have to keep trying. Persistance is the Key!
John T. - Re: Michigan: Yes, I have heard of a recently organized Michigan Substitutes Association, but do not have their address. Re: Benjamin Visnick's book or paper, titled Substitute Teachers in American Public Education, published in May, 1983 in Oakland, California; Ben worked as a substitute for some years; then as a contract teacher; later became president of Oakland Teachers Association and was a champion Re: pambre comment on negative reation to union activities: Since 1983, substitute teachers have been dues paying members ($30 monthly) of Boston Teachers Union, only l or 4 cities unionized for substitutes in Massachusetts) problemis that BTU leadership does little or nothing to upgrade pay, benefits,etc. for Boston substitutes (We have been trying, through S.U.B.S., for 18 months to create an independent advocacy oriented union, but so far no success due to a bureaucratic Mass. State Labor Commission!
Susan/2nd/NY - Try to stay in one area...people can leave in the middle of the year and you can fill in....make sure your name is known
Jen/MD - Janet, I feel for you! I worked part-time, and looking for a job is a full-time occupation in itself!
~Janet/Ar~ - Jen, how right you are. John we appreciate the information. It is very helpful.
Susan/2nd/NY - Also....even if the teacher left bad plans leave a nice note....and you will be requested
Jen/MD - John, was the book privately published?
~Janet/Ar~ - I left notes and left a business card stapled to the note for their future use.
cap/ar - If you'll grade their papers for them, they will request you every time.
Jen/MD - Good way to get your name known, Janet!
Susan/2nd/NY - cap/ar...you are soooooooooo right!
Diane - I would be afraid to mark their papers since some teachers have certain methods to it.
Jen/MD - cap, as it was, I spent an hour cleaning up and writing a note to the teacher!
Jen/MD - I agree, Diane!
~Janet/Ar~ - Cap, that is very true. Also if you finish everything they leave for you to do.
Jen/MD - My experience taught me to always back up whatever the sub says. Otherwise, students will not listen to future subs.
~Janet/Ar~ - Some teachers let me know to not grade and some asked me to and send the papers home.
Susan/2nd/NY - make sure you leave the room cleaner then you found it...don't worry about how the teacher marks papers...one thing I HATE is coming back to a bunch of papers to grade!
John T. - Re: inquiry on Ben Vishnick's paper or short book: perhaps you can get a copy by writng Oakland Education Association, 272 East 12th St., Oakland CA 94606; or if you E-Mail me your address (mailing address, I can send you a photo copy--one of the earliest substitute teachers, mentioned by Visnick, was John Scopes, taught in Kentucky,famous evolution trial!
pambre - Diane -more teachers want you to grade than do not. They can always regrade.
Susan/2nd/NY - and don't leave a note complaing about discipline problems...the teacher knows who they are
~Janet/Ar~ - Susan, teachers have told me that they want to know who your discipline problems were so they could nip it in the bud for the next time they may need you.
John T. - Inquiry from John T/MA--are any of you in Chat Page part of a local Teachers Union or substitutes Union? Please advise
Susan/2nd/NY - If they ask that's another thing Janet
John T. - My E-Mail address: 102361.625@compuserve.com John P. Thomson
~Janet/Ar~ - John, no but I feel subs need one badly nationally!
Jen/MD - Susan, with all due respect, I would want to know what happened in class.
pambre - I could join local teachers union but was basicly told not to by teacher rep.
Susan/2nd/NY - Jen, when I subbed unless the teacher asked who the problems were I handled them since I am a professional
~Janet/Ar~ - John, are you thinking about this nationally for Subs?
roz - Subs need something, because now some of us are treated like the lowest form of life
~Janet/Ar~ - Susan, but teachers need to know and know what the sub did about the discipline problem in case of a parent complaining!
pambre - What happens in room I record but not problem students.
Susan/2nd/NY - IF that ever happened I would then contact the sub...never has happened
~Janet/Ar~ - Susan, whether one is a professional or not the one that was there had to take care of the problem. Being professional has nothing to do with that.
pambre - In regard to parents . I have been know to meet with them.
Jen/MD - Susan, I "handled" the problem, and talked to principal after I sent a child to the office. However, teacher needed to know for follow-up.
Kathleen - Substitute Teachers should think of themselves as professionals
Susan/2nd/NY - If there was a situation that warrented the principal...the principal would contact the parent in my school
~Janet/Ar~ - Jen, how right you are. The reg Teacher always needs to be informed of the problems how small and how big.
~Janet/Ar~ - Exactly my point Kat! Thanks!
Susan/2nd/NY - The same applies in the playground and cafeteria...with a certified teacher on duty
Susan/2nd/NY - I cannot get involved with conflicts outside when I wasn't there....there are many sides to the story...that is why a professional is on duty
~Janet/Ar~ - Does everyone think there should be a series of workshops that is required for one to be a sub? I do. I feel some subs are not qualified to sub at all. Here in AR one only has to be 18 to sub.
Jen/MD - If the regular teacher takes the student's side, what is the teacher saying about substitutes' authority?
Jen/MD - You got to be kidding, Janet!!! Kids in charge of kids!
Susan/2nd/NY - A substitute IS the teacher for the day and should make decisions...including a note home to the parent...I have had subs do that
pambre - Workshops would be wonderfull!
Kathleen - Yes, I think Substitute Teachers should have training; their responsibilities are unique and important
~Janet/Ar~ - Yes, Jen, that is my point. There should be a stricter criteria about who is allowed to sub don't you think?
cap/ar - Janet, how true you are.
Susan/2nd/NY - One should be a certified teacher to sub if they are to be considered professional
~Janet/Ar~ - Susan, here a sub is not allowed to send a note home to the parent.
Jen/MD - I never had nightmare situations when I subbed: you know the ones you hear about? I think part of it was my ability to avoid escalations.
Mary K&1 - Susan/2nd/NY, I agree - Janet, that is a state issue, in PA subs are certified teachers
pambre - But I do not think one needs a teaching degree to sub.
Susan/2nd/NY - Janet...then they ARE second class citizens...and my argument won't hold
roz - I agree. Students spend a lot of time during the year with subs. I don't know the f igures, but if your child is to be in a room with a sub all day, would you not want him/her to have the latest knowledge?
Susan/2nd/NY - absolutely roz
~Janet/Ar~ - Like one said earlier....did not even interview. I didn't. Just had to be finger printed and even started subbing before they got the results of the finger prints for background check.
Jen/MD - You kidding? I felt my treatment as a sub was an insult to my education! I just feel those who sub should have a paid orientation and at least one workshop per term!
Susan/2nd/NY - we have 180 days of school and children should get QUALITY education every day of it
pambre - I have a masters in social work and know of others subs with masters who sub.
~Janet/Ar~ - Jen, absolutely!!!
Susan/2nd/NY - Subs should not be glorified babysitters...having to report every minor problem to the "real" teacher
roz - Sometimes they just want a warm body in the classroom.. What about subs who are able to function better than regular teachers.?
~Janet/Ar~ - I agree with the issue of one needing to be certified to teach. But there are some states that do not require it at all.
pambre - Nor should subs just be teachers looking for regular classrooms.
Susan/2nd/NY - Janet...that way they can pay less...and the kids suffer
Jen/MD - In NJ, I think one had to have two years of college under their belt...
Susan/2nd/NY - That would be ideal pamber..actually some districts hire permanent subs with benefits
Jen/MD - Susan, I think subs would be underpaid anyway. I feel they love to exploit teachers with a lot of education.
Susan/2nd/NY - It all boils down to money...supply and demand...that unfortunately is the name of the game in education
~Janet/Ar~ - Susan, I agree! The kids suffer for it in the long run. But even us who are certified and not really do effective teaching due to being called at the last min. and not even knowing the grade level and area one is in for teaching certain subjects.
Susan/2nd/NY - absolutely Jen
Kathleen - The way funding is obtained locally for education budgets causes the difficulty
Jen/MD - What do you mean, Kathleen?
~Janet/Ar~ - Kat, that is soooo true!
Kathleen - So, organizing into a bargaining unit would be very helpful.
Susan/2nd/NY - yes Kat...the most important job....training of future citizens...so sad
~Janet/Ar~ - Here certified subs make $40.00 a day. No benefits at all.
roz - In many cases, they feel guilty if a sub is really good because they are only paying them less than half per diem than reg. teachers. They don't expect much from us.
Kathleen - I mean that as long as citizens are taxed so directly, education budgets remain sparsley funded..it is one place people have control, and they wield it.
Jen/MD - The shortage of subs is so great that some teachers have to give up their prep time to sub for another's class.
Susan/2nd/NY - yes roz...and once again...who suffers?
pambre - roz so true!!!!!
~Janet/Ar~ - roz, when I subbed this past year most teachers left WORKSHEETS! Those poor kids!
Jen/MD - My Goodness, Janet! The killer for me was no benefits. Fortunately, my part-time job had them!
Mary K&1 - Jen, when that starts to happen enough, that's when things will start to change
roz - It's almost like a glorified volunteer position, isn't it?
Jen/MD - Janet, what do you suggest teachers leave instead?
Susan/2nd/NY - more like a glorified babysitter
~Janet/Ar~ - Jen, my job at the hospital has great benefits but extemely bad pay. I could start out here as a teacher making more than I am now after 20 years at the hospital.
Kathleen - Mary, good point, then teachers will pressure their unions to help by making certain that there are substitutes. To do that, they will have to help Substitutes obtain adequate pay and benefits.
Jen/MD - I would leave out glorified--stigmatized is better. I know I had little respect for subs before I became one...
~Janet/Ar~ - Jen, just their plan book and the pages marked that needs to be taught and the materials that they were gonna use. Just like their day but they are not doing the teaching.
Susan/2nd/NY - I work in themes...and I don't leave tons of worksheets...I'll leave a book on the theme and ask kids to write summaries, illustrate, etc.
Mary K&1 - The teacher union have to work at the State level to get the labor union laws changed
Jen/MD - True, Janet! I was clerical, but the library I worked in was unionized--I loved it!
roz - What bothers me is when teachers complain about their lot, and don't give a da-n about the sub situation
~Janet/Ar~ - Susan, good for you. I like that but here none did that unfortunately.
Susan/2nd/NY - I care Roz...or I wouldn't be in this room
Jen/MD - Janet, I will be teaching math. Some teachers may not be comfortable with that. Maybe, I should leave worksheets and the lesson and leave it up to the sub?
~Janet/Ar~ - roz, agree wholeheartedly!
pambre - Or they complain about their pay.
~Janet/Ar~ - Susan you are an exception!!
roz - Susan, good for you..we need support all across the country
~Janet/Ar~ - Good idea jen. That way if you did get someone who did not understand the plans they have a backup.
~Janet/Ar~ - Goodnight everyone, thanks for attending.
Kathleen - Goodnight, and thank you all for coming, Janet, thank you for hosting so competently. :-)
