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Marjan Glavac
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Mary K&1 - Greetings and Welcome to Teachers.Net. Teachers.Net welcomes Harry Wong and moderator Marjan Glavac.Marjan Glavac - Hello. My name is Marjan Glavac and I will be moderating this meeting of Harry and Rosemary Wong. I teach grade 5 in London Ontario Canada (http://www.glavac.com) and I had the great pleasure of meeting and interviewing Harry and Rosemary way back in September.
Marjan Glavac - Harry K. Wong is the most sought after speaker in education today. Dr. Wong regards himself as a "a plain, old classroom teacher." However, his record shows that he has been an excellent classroom teacher who has shared his successes with thousands of teachers internationally. He is usually booked from two to four years into the future for speeches, and because of his many professional activities, must turn down many requests each week. He has given over 3000 presentations to some half-million people, including the Distinguished Lecture at the American Association of School Administrators Convention. He has lectured in every American state and Canadian province and in South America, Asia, Africa, Europe, and Antarctica. He has over 30 publications including a leading book in education on how to start the first days of school, a video and audio tape series, a science textbook series, three films, and numerous magazine and journal articles to his credit.
Marjan Glavac - Welcome Harry and Rosemary.
Harry and Rosemary - We are happy to be with you tonight. We met Marjan in Canada last year and were very impressed with his work. We are delighted he has asked us to join him this evening. Please know that this is our first attempt at an interactive chat. Your overlooking the typos and other miscues will be most appreciated. We will try to share as much as we can in our field of expertise—classroom management—in the allotted time.EEAC - Hi Harry or should I say Mr. Wong? Are there many universities developing teacher induction programs to help future teachers? (Jim from NSU, Tahlequah, OK)
Harry and Rosemary - They may not call it induction, but ask Jim from NSU and he will be happy to share his program with you as well as tell you of others.teechur - This is my first year as a high school teacher after 6 years as a junior high school teacher. I teach Network Administration and I am continually stunned by the number of students who do not do any work. (One would think that high school diploma would be a carrot...but not really). Anyhow, I am having problem with this. I consider not working a discipline problem because I expect everyone to be on task during my class. The administration is not supportive of outside intervention, and sometimes I feel I'm reduced to being a baby-sitter.
teechur - I should also mention, I have my Networking students for four semester, which adds another dimension because after a semester they tend to get overly "comfortable" and discipline becomes MORE of an issue, not less.
Harry and Rosemary - Have you ever taught the concept of procedures and routines? Procedures govern how to get the work done. For instance, do you teach the procedure for how to head a paper, what to do when class starts, what to do if they are absent, etc.
teechur - Yes, I teach them the first week of school.
teechur - Freshmen and sophomore take right to it, Juniors and Seniors not so much.
teechur - I actually have the students teach most of the procedures, but I do the important ones.
teechur - They also have a test on the procedures and must all pass with 80% or above or keep retaking it until they do.
Harry and Rosemary - Discipline will not get the work done. One must establish procedures to get the work done and then practice those procedures until you are sure they understand. If you teach procedures during the first week, what do you do if they don't follow the procedure?
teechur - It ranges from one on one talks to higher disciplinary action. Unfortunately this class isn't as "procedure" intensive as say my Computer Apps or Keyboarding classes where we have a somewhat established routine.
Harry and Rosemary - You may test them on it, but do they model it in their everyday class activities. For them to keep retaking the test, do you do any remediation for them to learn the procedure?
teechur - Part of the history with other computer programs in the district is more "laid back and do what you want...fail, don't fail...it's up to you" but I have a problem with that. So part of what I'm fighting against is other (very good, but more "lax") computer teachers who let them play a lot of games, surf the internet, etc. To me this should not make a difference. It is my class, my policies, my procedures, but it's been an uphill battle.
Harry and Rosemary - You've answered your own question. You need to make this class more procedure intensive. A final note--procedures should never have disciplinary action. Discipline has to do with behaviors, classroom management has to do with procedures.Marjan Glavac - Go to http://firstdaysofschool.com to see some great handouts and material from Harry and Rosemary.
maggie - hello, I teach grade 7 about an hour away from Marjan,,,, my question is this,, I have quite a few "talkers" in my room this year. I refuse to begin my lessons or start any activity until I have silence and their attention. I have noticed that it is now March and it still requires several minutes before this is achieved, Is there any pointers you might have which might help speed up this daily ritual? I get the feeling this is turning into a game for these kids!!!
Harry and Rosemary - Have you taught the class the procedure for getting the class to attention? If so, what is it?
Harry and Rosemary - And if you don't have one, that's OK. We'll suggest a few that will speed up your getting their attention process.
maggie - perhaps that is where I went wrong, I have simply stood there and said right from the beginning of the year, when you are quiet we will begin,, any pointers on how I can improve this , please?
Harry and Rosemary - Example of Teaching a Procedure: Quieting a Class
Harry and Rosemary - And this procedure must be rehearsed over and over again, very calmly, until they are doing it to your expectation. The key to teaching a procedure is rehearsal. All procedures must be rehearsed over and over again. Next question.
Harry and Rosemary - Do you yell, scream, and flick the lights to get your class quiet, with no results? Quieting a class can be achieved with the following easy steps:
Harry and Rosemary - 1. Freeze 2. Turn and face me, pay attention, and keep your eyes on me. 3. Pay attention, I am going to speak. Explain to the students you have a procedure to get their undivided attention. When you stand at the front of the room with your hand up or hit a bell because some of you will not be able to see the hand, follow the procedure as outlined in the 3 steps. All of this can be found in chapter 20 of our book.
cybernutty - Hi Harry and Rosemary! What do you do with a disrespectful and defiant child when you can't always send the child to the office?
Harry and Rosemary - cybernutty--try a time out table. It's a quiet place with a form for the student to complete. It has such things as Why am I here? What can I do to correct the problem? Although this defiant child is a bother to you and his/her classmates, this is really a disciplinary issue and would prefer to discuss tonight classroom management and student achievement.
cybernutty - tried something like that. he won't go.
Harry and Rosemary - Then give the child the form at his/her desk!Jules/GA - Mr. Wong, I use the give me five to get the children's attention. It is taking them longer to respond, any ideas?
Harry and Rosemary - Yes, change it. There are too many steps involved. Shorten it to a procedure with 3 steps! For instance, a football coach we know only has one step. He says "Gentlemen, please." A first grade teacher we know simply puts her finger to her lips. We prefer to just raise our hand.
Harry and Rosemary - Rehearse, not reteach. Just tell the class the new procedure is and then rehearse and practice it until they do it correctly.Ken - Harry - First, thanks so much for being an inspiration and helping shape my teaching style when I first started in the late 70's. My question is do you have a website listing your publications and books? Authored any science books lately?
Harry and Rosemary - Our website is http://www.effectiveteaching.com. No science books. Just The First Days of School which just sold 1,000,000 copies. We are very pleased with the positive comments from everyone who use it. Thank you to all of you!Ann - I would like to use your book for staff development. Do you have suggestions on what would be the best time of year, and ideas how to do this?
Harry and Rosemary - Anytime--Teaching is so wonderful that each day in the classroom is a new day. If things aren't going well, start all over again. But don't change everything at once. Do it one procedure at a time and then move on to the next one.JerryT - What is the best way for new, inexperienced teachers to learn from their more experienced colleagues?
Harry and Rosemary - Ask for time to go and observe in those teachers' classrooms. Does your district have mentors as part of an induction program?Harry and Rosemary - For those of you who don't get your questions answered this evening, we have a newspaper that has lots of helpful tips in it. Just email orderinfo@harrywong.com and request a copy of Successful Teaching to be sent to you via snail mail. If that doesn't work, please send it to me personally and I will forward it on. My personal address is rwong@harrywong.com
student teacher - First of all, thank you for writing the book. It has become my bible. My question. i am a student teacher of 23 students (in first grade) My children are given an hour to complete bell work and a theme book. Can you offer any advice on how to motivate the student to complete their work quietly, independently and to be self motivated. i use that hour to read with groups, but find that i am using it to tell students to focus on their work, or sit down, to stop sharpening pencils etc.. any advice?
Harry and Rosemary - One hour is far to long for a first grade assignment. 20 minutes is the max. Bellwork should not take longer than 3-5 minutes. You need to restructure your teaching/learning time so there are transitions every 15-20 minutes. Be sure to teach the class the procedure for transitions.
student teacher - But this allows for independent learning time. They go to centers when they are finished with there work! Should that still be cut down?
Harry and Rosemary - Yes--You don't want them to have independent time first thing in the morning. They are fresh. Attack the day with learning and structure. Independent time is much better later in the school day.Cindy - What advice from you to help me with my Headstart kids ages 4 -5, most of my kids have a tough home life and im having problems with discipline and repeating rules to often, I want to have a positive reaction with my kids, help
Harry and Rosemary - There is a difference between rules and procedures. With the head start kids they need structure or procedures in their life--not disciplining.
Cindy - I agree, but how do I get them to follow rules and procedures in a positive way, i feel my kids really need more hugs than discipline.
Harry and Rosemary - For the chatty room, please refer back to our answer for how to get the class's attention.Harry and Rosemary - Because our time is short, you might also want to locate a copy of our video series The Effective Teacher. Tapes 3 and 4 deal with classroom management, procedures and routines. It's a real eye-opener and many new and veteran teachers have learned much from it.
Cynjit - Here's my ?. I had a good routine at the beginning of the year. But I have a small class. Every little change disrupts everything . ONe student started having severe problems at home. His behavior has become interruptive. He wont do his work. Makes some comments during class. How can keep this child from disrupting the class as a whole? Or what can I do to motivate this child out of his current state?
Harry and Rosemary - It's just one child. Deal with the one child aside and don't let it disrupt the class. Give the class lots of praise for following procedures while disruptions take place. The next time the disruptive child does well, give him/her very sincere heartfelt praise.lulu - first of all i want to say thank you for writing your book it was very helpful to me, my question is regarding student motivation, it seems so difficult for my 8th graders to be motivated and willing to work, they sometimes resort to whining and complaining
Harry and Rosemary - Students don't get motivated to do the work. Teach the student the procedure for doing the work. And practice it until it is done.Kathy/5/IA - I have a few 5th grade students who just can't seem to get their work finished on time. Collecting it late from them is such a chore and a disruption for the rest of the class. Any suggestions. The assignments are not long by any means. If it is homework, it has meaningful implications to the classroom. Thank you for squeezing me in!!
Harry and Rosemary - Is it classroom work that isn't completed in the allotted time or homework that wasn't done the night before?
Kathy/5/IA - Classroom work that isn't completed in the allotted time.
Harry and Rosemary - Could be that the assignment is too long for some. Make the lessons shorter at first so they all get the sense of accomplishment before you step up the workload. Success is guaranteed in small increments. Watch tape #8 in the video series for more details.
Kathy/5/IA - Thank you! I'll look up your tapes.Marjan Glavac - This is the part of the moderating job I don't like--it's time to say thanks and goodbye to Harry and Rosemary. All of you were great!
Marjan Glavac - Harry and Rosemary--THANK YOU once again for all your warmth, generosity and TIME you shared with us. Please feel free to logoff at any time. Goodnight!Harry and Rosemary - Thank you again for your great questions. We're exhausted. But it was great hearing from all of you. Best Wishes.
Marjan Glavac - On my website http://www.glavac.com I have a review of Harry and Rosemary's book, an interview with Harry and other goodies!
EEAC - Harry and Rosemary: Go treat yourself to a Braums after tonight! Thanks for your comments!
Harry and Rosemary - EEAC--Braums is the greatest ice cream in the world! Thanks for the thought!Marjan Glavac - Thank you to all of you for coming out. You were ALL GREAT! Take care.
Mary K&1 - Marjan, thank you so much for moderating tonight - A big T-Net Thank You!
Mary K&1 - Thank you Marjan!
Mary K&1 - Good night all
