Working bG - First time user. do we just talk about what's on our mind about the 4 block plan?
deb - we had a first grade guided reading meeting today
Working bG - Do children really learn how to spell and use words just from chanting them
Working bG - Our prin. wants everyone to teach the same thing at the same time daily by grade
deb - their spelling improvements are amazing. You link spelling to their writing too. Any word wall word must always be spelled correctly.
Working bG - Just by using the 4 block plan and no other phonics program?
deb - I make sure I do dictated sentences, "on the back" activites etc. to reinforce the word wall words.
deb - working bG - that's ridiculous
Working bG - We think so too
deb - yes, if you do all the activities in the month by month books for phonics your children will get there without anyother phonics plan. What grade are you? What plan are you looking at?
Working bG - 1st grade Cunningham
deb - were you trained by Connie Prevette?
deb - I meant what other phonics program... since you wondered if this will work w/o any other plan
Working bG - No, not trained at all, just given books by the princ.
deb - the reason I ask is that she makes those type of suggestions at her trainings.
deb - I am in Michigan.
deb - There isn't anywhere in the book that says you have to teach the same things at the same time
deb - Have you seen the interviews in the pink book for phonics for first grade? Many teachers use these interviews to get the children reading and applying phonics
deb - working bG where are you located? I am in Michigan
Lisa - I teach first grade in Charles County, Maryland
deb - lisa, are you teaching four blocks
Lisa - What grade do you teach and where?
deb - I teach second grade in michigan
Lisa - I am teaching four blocks except that we use the Fountas and Pinnell Guided reading. Our whole county does this.
deb - how do you address the on grade level comprehension
Lisa - Do you teach four blocks on your own, your whole county, or most of the state?
deb - do you cover it in science and social studies? The Guided reading the four blocks way book is really helpful
Lisa - We have included a fifth "block" of shared reading using the basal series
deb - I teach it alone. I am a four blocks trainer. There are 4 teachers who are exploring it in my school. The whole district has had an overview training.
Lisa - I think that the reading recovery teachers in our building are going to see Pat Cunningham and they will get a book. I look forward to reading it then.
Lisa - When you say that you are a trainer, how did that come about? Who is in charge of you?
deb - we just started reading recovery in our school
deb - dottie and pat told me to go ahead and train. Dottie spent a day in my classroom. They put me on their site and blessed me to train
Lisa - Have you gone to observe a reading recovery lesson? You should, it gets you pumped to teach in your own class.
deb - I went to leadership training. I have done over 25 workshops, I use their materials
deb - not yet since they have only had their kids for 5 lessons. I figured I would see it after semester when they are more comfortable
Lisa - Interesting. I would like to do training, but since the whole county has adopted it, most people already know. We have 3 new first grade teachers this year, so I have been able to work with them and they have come in to observe me.
deb - are you going to leadership in Jan then
Lisa - Have you thought about the other guided reading way. It really helps to meet each individual child's needs
Lisa - What is the leadership you are talking about?
deb - in Michigan nothing is county mandated. Each district decides what to teach
deb - I started with f and p. I find that four blocks is much more pure
deb - much more effective I mean
deb - My population needs direct instruction for two hours a day instead of centers that reinforce what I am teaching in small group
Lisa - What do you do to insure that the emergent readers are learning to read?
deb - They learn to read in the structure of four blocks pure. Last year my class minimum growth was .9 years and that was the two kids with IQs of 59 and 62. Most of my kids went from 1.1 - 1.4 to over 3.0. The two high kids with scores of 2.0 moved to 5.1 and 7.1.
deb - During self selected reading, I have three adults listening to children read. Everyone is reading books at their level. I met with every low kid daily for a minimum of 5 minutes. The other adults meet with the middle and high students and also low.
piggybear - I am a classroom aide mainly in third grade. This year is the first for 4 block and I have a huge case load.
Lisa - Who are the other adults?
deb - I do all the emergent reading skills that f and p stresses during self selected and reinforce them again in guess the covered word. teaching kids to do word coaching is also very effective
bev - which state has seen student improvement using the 4 block
deb - title I teacher and sped tchr
Working bG - I teach 1st grade and this program is new to me. I am enjoying the information you all are giving
piggybear - I have used the DIBELS benchmarks as a guide line for determining reading level for movein students and to catch the poorest readers.
deb - indiana and ohio and north carolina and south carolina's ed depts are all recommending four blocks
deb - I would bet that we teach a lot of the same things -- good teaching is good teaching.
Lisa - You are probably right. I think I heard some research somewhere that the reading program doesn't matter, the teachers matter as far as teaching kids to read.
Lisa - Working bG: Where do you teach? Are you liking the four blocks?
Working bG - Do you send books home for reading nightly?
deb - I agree. The first grade studies that were just revisited is where that comes from.
Lisa - I have in the past but you have to be careful to make sure that you get them back. We make a lot of paper books that they take home and keep.
deb - I send home black line books, poems, interviews, kids writing. I don't send home real books since they are often stolen, no parental support and no school support. Every thing is my personal copy
Lisa - We keep a reading binder filled with poems. I let them take that home once a week to read.
Working bG - Aa books you listen to students read the next day?
deb - I have a poetry notebook too. We update and send it home weekly.
Working bG - Correction, are these the books you listen to students read the next day?
Lisa - I'm not sure I understand what you are asking, but if I am going to test a child on a book, then I don't send it home until afterwards so that they can't memorize it.
Working bG - What type of books do you listen to children read?
Working bG - I don't have enough leveled books to use for the whole year.
deb - I listen to the books that the children choose in self selected reading
Lisa - Well, I teach guided reading from Fountas and Pinnell which teaches groups with leveled books. For example right now my emergent readers are reading books that say like: Here is the pig. Here is the cow. Here is the horse. Here is the farm.
Lisa - They are also reading grade level books with the rest of the class during shared reading so that we can talk about comprehension and story elements.
deb - I use emergent books from CTP and scholastic and wright group and the sunshine books
deb - One of my emergent readers read I Can Write today. Another read I Can Read. Another read Four Seasons
Lisa - Did they read those during SSR?
deb - all are by CTP
deb - yes
deb - they then used the pattern to write a pattern book during writing time. Remember I am second grade
Lisa - I can see your points about the pure four blocks, but I have a few kids who don't even know how to spell their names so it is nice to have a chunk of time each day to work on their needs with them in a small group.
deb - In the Reading Teacher magazine there is a list of leveled stories for all the basals. Maybe that would help you too workingbG
deb - I can appreciate the scheduled time too lisa. I think a lot of first grade teachers find time for your small group instruction
Working bG - Thanks I'll try to look them up
Lisa - It is also different for me because I have to teach it this way. There is a second grade teacher across the hall who wants to do guided reading the four blocks way, but she is getting herself into trouble.
Working bG - I just need training. But it looks good
Lisa - deb, do you have a web page?
Lisa - Eve, what grade do you teach?
Eve - This year I am teaching 2nd and 3rd graders in small groups. Using the same good strategies that we bring from 4 blocks.
Lisa - Interesting. Are you only responsible for teaching them in literacy areas?
deb - all my stuff is posted at www.readinglady.com
deb - Laura the site owner and I are friends. She is the computer person, I am the trainer
Eve - I was an administrator for 16 years and went back to the classroom this year at my request. I had two other teachers come visit my room today. It felt pretty good to be on the teaching end instead of the observing end.
deb - I would not be an administrator if you paid me a million dollars
Eve - Yes, I work with the children for 45 minutes a day for reading.
deb - I like the curriculum end of being a principal but NOT the parents, discipline, etc
Lisa - I agree. Our administrators only know the problem children.
Eve - After facilitating the implementation of 4 blocksat my last school, it is truly wonderful to get in my own classroom and practice what I have been "preaching."
deb - eve, I bet that helping implement four blocks school wide was exciting
Lisa - I would like to help implement. I think it would be easier to do it after teaching. Then you could say, I did it so it works.
Eve - Implementing 4 blocks schoolwide was the most exciting thing I have done in my 29 yeard career.
deb - That is why I am so busy training. Teachers all over the country want to hear me since I have done it. I am in the classroom teaching and presenting on the side. They appreciate hearing from someone who is there.
Eve - Yes, you're right deb
Eve - I also do some training of the side and teachers and administrators want to know from people who have walked that mile, so to speak
Working bG - I am in North Carolina, know wher I can get a schedule of training in my area?
deb - exactly
deb - www.ergsc.com
Eve - There is going to be a one day seminar for teachers with Pat and Dottie in February, I think
Eve - Maybe it is a weekend seminar. It's on Pat's website
deb - it is a Sat in Feb. Just one day.
deb - Eve are you going to leadership
deb - in January?
deb - I am
Eve - Yes, definitely. Last year's conference was great. Were you there?
deb - it is a three day conference over Martin Luther King Jr weekend
deb - Yes I helped with registration.
Eve - OK I did a round table discussion on staff development
deb - round table with internet
deb - internet use I mean
Eve - We were busy at the same time. We'll have to take some time to talk to each other this year
deb - sounds great! I am looking forward to seeing some of the same people and meeting some new people too.
deb - Well lesson plans are awaiting! Nice chatting!!
Eve - See you soon
deb - the whole chat was a philosophical debate between me and lisa about guided reading f and p vs. guided reading cunningham
deb - I could have used the support!!! ha ha
Eve - Did you solve any of the controversy?
deb - especially since she wants to be a four blocks trainer and change it
Eve - Oh
Eve - I wish I had been on line to help
deb - not exactly, although she did admit that we probably teach the same things and call them different things. She explained shes required by her county to have five blocks
deb - me too, wish you could have helped
Eve - I have run into some districts doing the same thing. It confuses the teachers
deb - I find that many teachers call themselves four blocks teachers and DON't teach it
Eve - Some think they are doing a great job when they had not had proper training
deb - I was hired by one district to come and speak on guided reading. I flew 10 hours, etc. Spent an entire day on comprehension guided reading only to find the lady who hired me trained her teachers HER way of guided reading. I was so frustrated I could have SCREAMED
deb - and they don't read the books. I get so frustrated by the teachers who REFUSE to READ the books! How can teachers not read
deb - ?????????? it makes me crazy
Eve - I kind of ran into the same thing in one place where I was working. I just told the teachers that what I was speaking to them about was the 4 blocks way
Eve - I don't in any way change my sessage. If there is a controversy I telol them that the
deb - I told the teachers to forget "guided reading" as the title and lets discuss comprehension and how to teach thinking about their thinking. The teachers always agree that they have curriculum that can't wait until the kids can read so the kids need skills
Eve - I tell them that they will have to research and make a decision about what is right for chioldren
deb - I also use Jim Cunningham's leadership speech about the last 100 years of reading instruction and how come we teach all four ways
deb - like the teachers I deal with would really research!!!!!!!!
Eve - That is good info to reference. Most teachers who have been in the business a while can relate.
deb - I have taught four blocks for three years in the class room. the previous 10 years I was missing the phonics block and using the other three. I just couldn't teach that workbook!
deb - I quote jim's every nine years we are on a new reading trend, etc
Eve - The workbooks were so meaningless, just busy work. Our children have really prospered with the words block
deb - the teachers in my district are finally starting to notice. The administration is looking at my reading and writing scores and noticing that the kids are learning to read and write better than the other rooms and I have sped inclusion and low readers in the Fall. I am thrilled they are ready to listen. I trained both buildings. They are dabbling this year
Eve - I really appreciate my district letting me teach this year. It has been a wonderful experience. My principal it asking me to work with the other teachers, but I don't know when I do it. I have a full teaching day.
deb - the rules that the kids can't and don't apply drove me crazy. I always taught patterns, I just didn't teach high frequency too. Now it is balanced
timber - What do you both teach if you don't mind
Eve - 2nd and 3rd graders-small group instruction-6 per group-45 minutes per day
Eve - Yes, I do and love it. Sorry, folks got to go.
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