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Kathleen - Well, thank you for coming to Book Talk: The works of author illustrator Paul Goble. "'Sacred Dog' is a Native American name for the horse; in the story and illustrations here, Goble captures the mixture of familiarity and reverence in the tribal attitude toward this essential animal. . . . The pictures dramatically render both nature and culture."-Booklist, starred review. A Reading Rainbow Feature Book. Full-color illustrations. The Teachers.Net Bookshelf section has many books listed, already linked so that you can order them easily, helping Teachers.Net at no extra cost to you. At http://teachers.net/bookshelf/shopping/lit_frame.html
sarahw/2/TX - I alway love the illustrations!
Sea/2 - goble's illustrations are so bold and detailed
Sea/2 - bright earthy colors
sarahw/2/TX - We got a class set of "sacred Dog" with our last text book adoption--a touch difficult for my second graders, but they enjoy the pictures.
Sea/2 - sarah, what is the reading level on sacred dog?
sarahw/2/TX - I got the impression that Goble has written some novels (??) but books like "gift of the Sacred Dog are not too long a read.
Sea/2 - kat, they are picture books! take a 10 minute journey to the land of the first americans through his eyes... ;)
sarahw/2/TX - Sea-- I don't know--I wonder is it an AR book?
Sea/2 - sarah, if not, you can make the test up for it! (our library purchased the rights to make a certain # of tests)
Kathleen - Though I haven't had the pleasure (yet) of reading any Goble books, I understand that they are beautiful in word and picture. Anyone?
sarahw/2/TX - The illustrations are just breathtaking!
Kathleen - Goble concentrates on Native American stories and settings, what Goble books are you familiar with?
Sea/2 - bold beautiful watercolors!
Sea/2 - buffalo woman is well done
sarahw/2/TX - He has some trickster tales--what is the characters name?
Kathleen - Sea, would you tell us a bit about Buffalo Woman?
Sea/2 - the first page introduces the brave and the second page...
Sea/2 - is a double spread of the brave, arms raised, praising the creator for the buffalo
Sea/2 - very powerful
Sea/2 - it is a love story and a legend
Kathleen - You're painting a picture in my mind's eye, Sea, go on
Sea/2 - well, goble teaches you many things about native american tribes through his illustrations
Kathleen - Sea, this is the one you used with you second grade students, Buffalo Woman?
Sea/2 - authentic tipi paintings, designs, clothing, etc.
Kathleen - Would you say the illustrations are more telling than the text?
Sea/2 - yes, kat! (plus gift of the sacred dog)
sarahw/2/TX - Sounds like a good "study" for November
Sea/2 - the text tells the story/legend, well written
Sea/2 - the illustrations capture the imagination
Kathleen - That's why Yolanda selected Paul Goble for this time of year, heightened interest in native cultures during this season
Sea/2 - the "quote" at the end of this one, kat, you would like...
Kathleen - Sea, what is that quote??
sarahw/2/TX - I like to show the illustrations before yet another attempt at "art" in my room. Try to give the kids an idea of what I mean by "fill the page, add details, color it!"
Sea/2 - Mitakuye oyasin - We are all related.
Sea/2 - great idea, sarah!
Sea/2 - goble also details plants, wildlife, trees, etc. native to the region (Cheyanne in Texas, etc.)
sarahw/2/TX - Sea--thanks--I keep trying!
Kathleen - Goble concentrates on the Plains Indians, correct? I wonder if that quote is in a Plains dialect?
Sea/2 - in other words, respect nature
Sea/2 - yes (plains indians)
sarahw/2/TX - Our 5th graders just had a field trip on medicinal and food source "wild plants" I noticed the teacher had a few of Gobles books out on display to go with it
Sea/2 - Love Flute is a good one too!
Kathleen - Sarah, do you often refer to book illustrations to inspire your students?
Sea/2 - wow! love that idea, sarah!
Kathleen - Sea, tell us about Love Flute if you will:-)
Sea/2 - goble researches all of his books before writing
sarahw/2/TX - Kat-- I am always looking for ways to inspire my kids--their world is so "TV" and relatively small. These illustrations are so inspiring!
Sea/2 - this one (Love Flute) is based on native american customs of courtship
Kathleen - sarah, while sea is typing, can you tell us approx. what grade level/reading level Gobles books are written for?
Kathleen - Sea, would that be a more adult novel?
Sea/2 - the braves ONLY played their flutes when courting!!!
Sea/2 - not really! maybe more appro. for 4th and up! (I still may share it with my 2nd graders though)
sarahw/2/TX - Kat-- this is just a guess on the level: We have a class set with our reading text adoption, but I think at least 3rd grade-- anyone concur?
Sea/2 - they also carried a blanket to wrap around the maiden for privacy while they whisper together right amidst village activity :)
Kathleen - Sea, sounding more adult all the time :-)
Ben - When I tried the link to Amazon Books, several of the books were listed as 4 - 8. I asume that means Gr. 4 to 8.
Sea/2 - the legend goes, kat, that the elk people gave an Indian brave the flute because he was good and brave
sarahw/2/TX - LOL Kat! That's what I was thinking!
Kathleen - Sea, are these traditions described within a story, or is this a nonfiction account about traditions?
Sea/2 - (this brave was too shy to tease the maiden of his heart's desire!!!
Kathleen - Ben, I think you are right about the grade levels
Sea/2 - am i an incurable romantic or what!!! ;)
Kathleen - Sea, does the love flute prevail?
Sea/2 - goble usually puts a forward (or notes at the end) that give the more adult elaborations. the actual text is sweet and easy to follow for children
Sea/2 - kat, read the book , dear! :)
Sea/2 - also, in this book... he draws
Kathleen - Goble sounds as though he is in love with the culture. Does anyone know his background?
Sea/2 - authentic love flutes! beautiful!
Kathleen - Sea, very skillful, that lead in to "read the book"! :-)
Kathleen - So, it would be wonderful to bring in flute music while using this book in the classroom
Ben - There was a write up in Amazon books re the Gobel but at this moment it escapes me.
Sea/2 - (they say the braves were buried with their flute... and when they played upon the hills, the maidens in their teepees recognized their true love's song
Sea/2 - thanks kat!
sarahw/2/TX - AWW__Now I gotta go get the book!:-)
Sea/2 - neat idea, kat!!! (music)
Sea/2 - whoa! just looked inside back cover and...
Sea/2 - you can order actual Lakota flute music to acompany this book!!!
sarahw/2/TX - oh boy oh boy oh boy!
Kathleen - Oh, that sounds like a real enhancement of the experience, flute music to order...I'll have to look into ordering this book...
Kathleen - Now, we have flute music, watercolor painting, what other aesthetic experiences could we use to tie in with this book?
Sea/2 - legends!
Kathleen - I wonder if sand painting would be appropriate?
Sea/2 - how about The Lost Children?
Kathleen - Legends! yes!
Kathleen - Is the Lost Children another Gobel book?
Sea/2 - that sounds neat, kat. also food chains and interdependence on nature among the native americans
sarahw/2/TX - weaving? Sorry don't know as much about the plains idians as I should
Sea/2 - yes. Lost Children is about a 2. 6 level
sarahw/2/TX - though I can spell "Indians" properly
Kathleen - Well, sarah, if you don't then you could explore that topic with the same enthusiasm as would your students
Sea/2 - sarah, woven designs would be good
sarahw/2/TX - Good point Kat!
Kathleen - Imagine saying after reading the book, you know, I would really like to know more about these people
Kathleen - You know, I think we can help correct centuries of stereotyping by being careful to relate authentic practices to each Native culture..
Sea/2 - kat, i think goble humanizes them. you feel and understand their thinking and the books generate respect for their customs
Sea/2 - true, kat.
Kathleen - We can't assume that all tribes engaged in the same crafts or arts, right? So it would be important not to introduce a non-plains art form while studying the Plains culture
Sea/2 - the lost children is a blackfoot indian story
Sea/2 - but many tribes did share very similar stories
Kathleen - In my opinion, it is important to teach that the native tribes were civilized, not the savages that older generations (like mine;-/) were led to believe they were
Sea/2 - true, kat
sarahw/2/TX - That's also a good point Kat! Perhaps a couple of Goble's books about different Indian cultures could be used for compare and contrast w/ each other or w/ what we "think" we know about indians
Kathleen - Sea, yes and that sharing of similar story themes is a very interesting topic of study, would it be so for your second graders, or would that be for older students?
Sea/2 - i'm hoping to use these for my cluster children this year
JT/1/VA - Sea/2, have you tried comparing The Gift of The Sacred Dog to the Quillworker?
Kathleen - JT, would you tell us something about Quillworker?
Sea/2 - but usable by many grade levels (2 - 5 especially)
Sea/2 - jt, i've not read the quill worker (but sounds like the heroine of Her Seven Brothers who sewed the beautiful quilled clothing?)
JT/1/VA - The Quillworker is a Cheyenne legend. The same story as Goble's Her Seven Brothers
sarahw/2/TX - Anyone remember the name of the trickster tales that Goble did --Iktomi??
Kathleen - Jt, so Goble based his "Her Seven Brothers" upon a legend known as the Quillworker?
Sea/2 - JT, i've found Her Seven Brothers and The Lost Children to share VERY similar themes! (Both wind up in constellations and teach a moral)
Sea/2 - yes, sarah! he did several of the Iktomi ones! haven't read them recently though... have you?
JT/1/VA - The Gift Of The Sacred Dog is much the same as The Dance of the Sacred Circle.
sarahw/2/TX - Sea--not even sure how to pronounce the name!! Seems like I did read one several years back.
Sea/2 - haven't read the dance one, JT. so, horses come from the sacred circle?
Sea/2 - sarah, if you know S.J., she uses them in her room
JT/1/VA - Yes. Helped the Plains Indians have a better life.
sarahw/2/TX - Sea-- what does he do with them? Grade?
Kathleen - Is the dance of the Sacred Circle a Paul Goble book or a legend?
Sea/2 - The Lost Children is about "not neglecting orphans" theme
Kathleen - JT, have you found a way to use Goble books in grade one?
JT/1/VA - It is a legend/
Sea/2 - S.J. grade 1... her kids love the trickster! Ikowhatever!!! LOL
JT/1/VA - I use Goble's books to compare legends.
Sea/2 - jt ? how horses came to the people?
Kathleen - I think we have to alert our elem, middle school colleagues to the richness of Paul Goble's work
sarahw/2/TX - I have several tricksters--might be worth looking up a tale or two
JT/1/VA - Yes. I tell my children legends from many tribes. Then we write our own legends.
Sea/2 - sarah, possibly compare Ikomiti (?) to ol' Briar rabbit? ;)
Sea/2 - cool JT!
Kathleen - sarh, that's an interesting concept, relating the legendary tricksters to those in your midst
Kathleen - JT, do you do a lot with Native cultures? sounds as though you do
sarahw/2/TX - I don't know though-- might give them more ideas-- I'd better pre-read! :-)
Sea/2 - you could also compare some of goble's work to tomie de paola's Legend of the Indian Paintbrush
JT/1/VA - I have several tapes of legends told by Indians. Children love hearing them.
Kathleen - Jt, do you TELL the tales, demonstating the original, suthentic, oral tradition that gave us the tales in the first place??
Sea/2 - LOL sarah! my trickster don't need new stimulation either!!!
Sea/2 - sounds good, JT! tell us more (tapes)
sarahw/2/TX - Sea--that would be an interesting comparsion (de paola and goble)
Kathleen - About your tricksters: imagine how you could diffuse a situation that could turn into a more negative one if you laughed and said, "Oh, you must be imitating [insert trickster name]!"
JT/1/VA - I also tell the legends. Parents have laughed at some of the tales their 1st graders tell at home.
Kathleen - JT, can you recommend a source for the tapes you describe?
Sea/2 - goble (in his forwards) always credits oral traditions and the respectful way the storytellers begin sharing their stories (touching themselves with sweet smoke or warm soil)
Sea/2 - kat, you're so sweet! i'm usually not that considerate of my tricksters! LOL
sarahw/2/TX - Kat--good idea!
Sea/2 - i bet they have JT!
sarahw/2/TX - sea-- me either!
Kathleen - So, it would be wonderful to invite visiting storytellers to come to the classroom, and for the children to practice the art of storytelling
JT/1/VA - I do not have information here. It is all at school. I also have wonderful flute music by Native Am.
Sea/2 - YES!!! (storytellers!!!) great idea!!!
Kathleen - [well, you would use that gently technique for the more benign tricksters in your class]
susan/2nd/ny - There is a link on my site...by a professional story teller...Heather Forest...tons of info for teachers...if you want I'll get it for you
Sea/2 - everyone could sit in a quiet circle as the story reveals itself!
Sea/2 - sounds cool, susan!
sarahw/2/TX - Yes, susan, please share it!
susan/2nd/ny - Actually, I put it on the chatboard...
Kathleen - JT!! I'm so glad you came tonight! would you be willing to post some information on the main chatboard about the tapes and other info that might help us gather ideas and materials for a native culture study??
Kathleen - susan, if you can get it, it would be GREAT in our transcript, yes:-)
JT/1/VA - We make a talking stick and then share our stories.
Sea/2 - neat JT! tell us more about how they are made!please
JT/1/VA - I would be delighted to share information.
Kathleen - JT, tell us about the talking stick???
susan/2nd/ny - Story Arts Online http://www.storyarts.org/index.html
sarahw/2/TX - cool a project brewing!
JT/1/VA - Can I wait and post? My mind is a little blank from a work night.
Kathleen - susan, thank you!! I will look at that with one eye for my husband, he is an amateur storyteller
susan/2nd/ny - Kat...you will both be AMAZED...and I know you will thank me for this url
Sea/2 - welcome susan! i ALWAYS admire the stuff you have on the net!!!
JT/1/VA - I found a wonderful web site with many legends. I'll post.
Kathleen - maybe we should try to get a good thread going on the chatboard, collecting ideas such as we have shared here and putting them together in one post in the Lesson bank as "Native Culture Study"
Kathleen - JT, what is your favorite Paul Goble book?
JT/1/VA - I like your idea Kathleen.
JT/1/VA - I think I use The Gift of the Sacred Dog the most.
Sea/2 - JT, that's one of mine too. probably because i always loved horses and it was the first goble book tocapture me
JT/1/VA - I wish I could learn to read the board and type too!
Kathleen - Gift of the Sacred Dog was a Reading Rainbow selection, so we will have to watch for that episode, I'm sure it will be full of good ideas and activities and info
Sea/2 - and buffalo woman is good!!!
Kathleen - Yes, I will, I will read Love Flute ;-)
JT/1/VA - Gift of the Sacred Dog was a Caldecott in1979.
Kathleen - Bringing in the flute music, storytelling, watercolor painting, a very rich experience for the children. Jt do you have other activities you can tell us about?
Sea/2 - i think goble's latest book is I WILL SING FOR THE ANIMALS...
susan/2nd/ny - I wish people would all approach native studies through literature instead of the sterotyping....dressing up as "Indians" and treating them as objects
Kathleen - susan, I agree with your statement about avoiding the stereotyping
JT/1/VA - I am an lover of Native American anything. I have lots of material. I go through it and share.
Sea/2 - I agree susan. we are currently studying the powhatan tribes (east) and Pocohontas... heading to Jamestown in November
susan/2nd/ny - A president of a local university on Long Island is a Native American and his gripe is that we always teach about "Indians" from Long Ago...not the people today...and kids get the wrong ideas.
Kathy/5/IA - Good point, Susan!
Sea/2 - well, susan. what would we say about the indians today? many are trying to recreate the customs of long ago, right?
susan/2nd/ny - Another author that I adore and maybe we can study is Shonto Begay
Sea/2 - what has he written susan?
Kathleen - Yes, each year I think I will tell the children we will be visited by a real live "Indian", have them draw (predict) what they think s/he will look like, then intro a real live native american in 1998 garb.
susan/2nd/ny - Yes...Mi and toad...mud pony...
Sea/2 - oh! i always share Mud Pony! it's a good one!
susan/2nd/ny - Scholastic puts out Shonto Begays books
Kathleen - Goognight, and THANKYOU!!!
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