Join a Mailring at the
Teacher Mailring Center
http://www.teachers.net/mailrings/
Bluette - good evening Dave
Dave MontrealCan - Hi Bluette welcome
Bluette - I have worked for special ed classes this week as a sub
wizzlewolf - Hello everyone!
Bluette - some were LD children but one was my fav guy Michael who has CP and is in a wheelchair
Dave MontrealCan - Bluette I understand you are doing a special project for one of your grad classes which will include my book "Integration A Rewarding Experience" Can you tell us a little about this project?
Bluette - well, we are a group of 5 grad students who chose "Inclusion" as the topic for a presentation.
Dave MontrealCan - Hello Betty and Wizzlewolf welcome
wizzlewolf - Hello!
Bluette - and I will use Dave's book as a reference to show how this kind of education can work
Dave MontrealCan - Wizzlewolf what grade do you teach welcome also Betty what grade do you teach?
Wilfredo - hello each grade 4, new teacher!
Dave MontrealCan - Wilfredo hello welcome
Betty - I work in the South Carolina Department of Education in Learning Disabilities
Wilfredo - teach in new jersey
wizzlewolf - I teach K-12 art at a school for severely emotionally disturbed students.
Dave MontrealCan - Betty welcome nice to meet you perhaps you can help I am trying to get my resource mannual known a little more out there it is called "Integration A Rewarding Experience"
Bluette - we have a huge number of LD and sped in our schools
Betty - We are working toward more inclusive models in our state
Dave MontrealCan - Betty I am sight impaired myself and was mainstreamed in the regular school system from K through University
Dave MontrealCan - I went to elementary school in the 1970's
Betty - We are relatively good at mainstreaming the visually impaired and hearing impaired. Trouble in the other areas, though.
Dave MontrealCan - Betty it was a challenge I have to admit when I was in school but I had strong parents who insisted that I attend regular school and they fought for me at that time
Betty - We also have a school for the deaf and blind in our state.
Betty - We really don't have a lot of problems in that area. We have lots of technology available. And good teachers. Except not many universities offer a degree program in that ara in SC.
wizzlewolf - I teach K-12 art at a school for severely emotionally disturbed students.
Dave MontrealCan - Bluette how will you use my book to help your fellow students to understand about the message of inclusion in the classroom?
Betty - Wizzlewolf- are all the students ED in the school? Are there any that were in the juvenile justice system?
Bluette - don't really know, our turn to present isn't for awhile, we will meet as a group and read the book and discuss our experiences
Dave MontrealCan - Wizzlewolf that must be quite a challenge for you sometimes tell us a little about how you manage to get through each day?
Betty - What types of laws are there in Canada regarding students with disabilities?
Dave MontrealCan - Bluette that is a great way to approach the subject
wizzlewolf - Betty, the whole school is for severely emotionally disturbed. I would guess at least 50 % have juvenile justice involvement.
wizzlewolf - Dave. everyone has their teaching "niche". I have the type of personality that just goes well with tough to teach kids with emotional problems. I love my job so much I can't believe they pay me to go there everyday.
Betty - for me it's hi y'all
Bluette - we will also use Educ journals in our research to back up info on the subject
Betty - You are lucky, wizzlewolf. Not many people can say that. Your kids are lucky to have you.
Dave MontrealCan - Betty at the moment there are wonderful laws on paper but infortunately they are not enforced for example often a sight impaired or blind person will be hired at a company on condition that a government grant is offered the grant lasts for 6 months to a year and then unfortunately when the grant runs out the companies almost always inevitably let the person go and that leaves them to start all over again they get another grant and go through the same thing it is a vicious circle
Chase - so anyone wanna give me some sympathy
Chase - or underdstanding
wizzlewolf - Betty, Oh I know! My boss tells me my job is secure! He said nobody wants my job!
Betty - what do you need chase?
Chase - r u a teacher betty
Betty - DAve, do you have any laws similar to our IDEA-protecting school age kids?
Betty - Not any more, chase. I work for the state.
Chase - i'm not feeling to good in my new teachingsituation
Chase - i'm not confident
Betty - What do you do, Chase?
Chase - 5th grade at a middle school
Betty - 5th at middle? What grades are in your school? Do you teach kids with disabilities?
Dave MontrealCan - Betty yes as far as laws for school age children they are there and enforced a school cannot legally refuse to accept a student because of their disability that law was not there when I went to school however in the 1970's
Chase - well its 5-8 i do have somekids who are included
wizzlewolf - Dave, the grants cycle is a familiar scenario here in the US too.
Chase - there are just so many procedures
Betty - Do you have the same categories of disabilities as the US? Do you know how LD is determined?
Chase - i just don't feel i have any directins from my mentors
Chase - with my lesson planning i feel lost
Bluette - I have seen some disservice done to our sped students, the administration seems to forget we are there for the children, not the children there for us
Dave MontrealCan - Wizzlewolf this is what led me to become self employed I no longer have to worry about that anymore I am much happier working for myself
Betty - What exactly do you teach?
Chase - math social studies and LA
Betty - So you are self-contained? Are the kids LD or MD? (MR)
wizzlewolf - Dave, Ironically, that is why I joined the school system. I used to work jobs supported by state and federal grants. I got very tired of being without a job between grants!
Dave MontrealCan - Hello Amy welcome
Amy - Hi dave and everyone thank you
Betty - What we are struggling with in SC is that we have too many kids in self-contained sped and too many minority kids in mental disabilities programs.
Dave MontrealCan - Wizzlewolf it is such a shame though that private industry cannot see beyond the $ and cents and look at the person's abilities rather than their disabilities
wizzlewolf - Yes Betty, here in Florida we have similar problems.
Bluette - I would like to see more inclusion but it is not always suitable for the students or safe for them in a regular large group
Dave MontrealCan - I think it all boils down to money they do not want to spend the money and ensure that everyone is treated with dignity they would rather look at how much it will cost to do that and I believe that life is worth much more than $ and cents
Betty - What I wish would happen is more intervention in the regular classroom BEFORE kids enter special ed.
Bluette - there are many examples of disabled people who work in jobs and are very succesful,
Dave MontrealCan - Bluette I agree there are many blind computer programmers for example
Bluette - I know of a Lawyer with a debilitating disease, his daughter has it too, he is in a wheelchair and has run for public office and is now a judge
Dave MontrealCan - Amy what grade do you teach welcome
Amy - I teach nursery school
Amy - we do have special needs children occasionally
Dave MontrealCan - Amy nice to have you have you ever had a sight impaired or blind child?
Amy - I just started with nursery taught first grade last year as an assistant teacher
Amy - Never sight impaired, no
Dave MontrealCan - Amy where are you located?
Amy - new york
Bluette - I have subbed for a boy who is now 5th grade, one more til he goes to the BIG MS HS
Dave MontrealCan - Amy have you found the other children to be open and accepting of children with special needs most of the time?
Bluette - I am near Syracuse and you AMY
Amy - manhattan
Dave MontrealCan - Hello Pam welcome
Amy - Actually I've never had a special needs child in my class yet. Well, that's not entirely true. Last year we had a boy in first grade who was recovering from a stroke who had special needs. He had a lot of motor issues. Some kids thought he was "retarted" and backed off. Actually he was a very bright boy. I worked with him a lot..
pam/res/sc - How does one help a child whose eyes don't work together?
Amy - He was shy and the kids did back off. I always tried to encourage kids to be friendly with him. He liked ballet and danced in a producation of the Nutcracker. He was very sophisticated in some ways
Dave MontrealCan - Pam hello what grade do you teach welcome
Bluette - are we talking about "lazy" eye, or crossed eyes?
pam/res/sc - I have a CP child that most of the time his eyes will be looking at differnet things.
pam/res/sc - I teach resource K-5
Amy - My mom is in a wheelchair. I grew up surrounded by lots of disabled people who were all very able and productive citizens
pam/res/sc - not sure
Dave MontrealCan - Pam where are you located do you have itinerant services in your area?
pam/res/sc - poor muscle control, I think
pam/res/sc - SouthnCarolina
pam/res/sc - trying to get mom to sign a release of info form for the kiddos dr.
Bluette - CP children have such a wide variety of problems
Dave MontrealCan - Pam do you think the child has a sight impairment let me give you a phone number if this is correct
Dave MontrealCan - Hello Kathie welcome
Kathie - joined the chat and was reading some of the post re: vision
pam/res/sc - just trying to figure out what I can do until and if he can get any other services
Kathie - something to consider is asking for a developmental pediatric optometrist to do an eval
pam/res/sc - not sure if it's actual sight impairment or muscle control
Dave MontrealCan - Kathie hello where are you located welcome
Kathie - my daughter, as well as some of my students have diagnosed with convergence insufficiency
Kathie - I'm located near buffalo, NY and do evals for the most part for 0-5 yrs.
pam/res/sc - trying to figure out if the eye conrol issue is contributing to his lack of reading sucess
Dave MontrealCan - Pam if this is of inspiration for you I am sight impaired myself and made it through the regular school system from Kinder through University and now am self employed
Kathie - one eye would appear to be straight and focused while the other had difficulty focusing as quickly or closely with the other one
pam/res/sc - sounds great...
Kathie - the eyes were not able to focus on the same point
pam/res/sc - I know my kiddo can do...I just want to help him do more
Dave MontrealCan - I had very strong parents who fought for me when I was in elementary school in the 1970's
pam/res/sc - this is my 4th year with him and he's still in 1st grade
Kathie - for example, she couldn't follow a finger coming towards her nose (basically crossing their eyes which is something they should be able to do)
Kathie - some doctors are interested and willing to try vision therapy
Kathie - my daughter was on it for approximately 6 weeks and it corrected her vision
Dave MontrealCan - Hello Emily and Rachel welcome
pam/res/sc - so I'm on the right track trying to get mom to release drs. info....
Kathie - she was reading right after that
pam/res/sc - one problem is $$$ for this parent..
Dave MontrealCan - Pam yes you are is the mom cooperating at all?
Rachel/5 - Hi. I'm pondering, with my kids who are way behind in reading (like 3 grade levels) what to do about literature circles. They need books at their level but then people say ability grouping is wrong. So what do I do?
Kathie - my understanding is that if they are unable to "cross their eyes" chances are they are not able to cross midline - a necessary skill for reading and writing
Dave MontrealCan - Brb
Kathie - the eval for my daughter was paid for by insurance - lke a reg. eye exam
pam/res/sc - very low income and on madicaid
pam/res/sc - they only pay for so much
Kathie - can the nurse at school recommend his vision be checked?
pam/res/sc - oops..medicaid
pam/res/sc - he wears glasses
Kathie - or possibly have the OT screen him and recommend it?
Kathie - based on visual-perception deficits
Bluette - a seriously sight impaired child who is poor should be able to get free services
pam/res/sc - he works with OT, but more with just handwriting
Rachel/5 - does lions club help pay for exams, or do they just collect glasses? maybe if you call them they'd know who might be able to pay. or the school social worker might know?
pam/res/sc - what types of questions should I ask the OT
Dave MontrealCan - Emily and Rachel what grades do you teach welcome
Rachel/5 - fifth
Kathie - i would ask specifically to look at if the child eyes are able to focus on objects at midline close to his face
Dave MontrealCan - Rachel how do you like 5th grade?
Kathie - sometimes the OT can write a letter to medicaid and/or the treating physician
pam/res/sc - okay...that will be a good starting place
Kathie - stating the basis for the recommendation
Rachel/5 - I'm having problems with my hyperactive kids, too. THey have to sit at tables of 4 (we don't have desks). But then they get nothing done and drive the other kids nuts. So sometimes I have them sit at a table alone near a wall just to get something done so they don't flunk everything. But they hate it.
Dave MontrealCan - Rachel are they on medication ?
pam/res/sc - why do they have to sit? give them something more physical to do
Kathie - can you use study carrels?
pam/res/sc - assign them different tasks within the lesson that will allow them to get up and move around....have them be the "dictionary" they have to get the dictionary and look up words that others may need
Rachel5 - well how can they never sit. How do they read and do math?
Rachel5 - I don't know if any of them are on medication
Dave MontrealCan - Rachel are they on medication?
Rachel5 - The school doesn't have study carrels but I like the idea. You know, then you call it an "office" and its not so much a punishment.
Dave MontrealCan - Rachel ok was wondering about that for hyper activity
Kathie - some OT's i work with use inflatable discs for the kids to sit on so they can have the movement and input right in their seats
pam/res/sc - I have one student that I allow to stand at his desk or in a corner of the room... his choice... but he gets his work done
Kathie - for the carrels I've used cardboard bent in thirds
Rachel5 - Oh, I don't think they have official diagnoses, though I don't really know. They just never focus on anything.
Kathie - a cheap solution for the inflatable discs are slightly filled beach balls
Rachel5 - Yeah, I don't mind if they stand. One of the kids likes my swivel chair and once he actually seemed to be concentrating on a book when I let him sit in it.
Dave MontrealCan - Rachel they may have a sugar high if they are eating lots of things with sugar in them
pam/res/sc - that could be a great tool
Rachel5 - Kathie, the cardboard thing, I discussed with a kid but he said he hates those they always fall over, and it's hard when the other 24 kids are in groups to sit alone
Bluette - tomorrow I wil teach in Charge, 7th and 8th graders who are in jeopardy most have serious behaviour or learning problems, self contained class for most of the day
Kathie - sometimes sitting on large therapy balls helps too
pam/res/sc - another thing to consider is how much time are they expected to sit still for
Rachel5 - they are expected to sit still for abotu 30 minutes
Kathie - what about trying "brain gym" with them? some of the activities can actually be done in their chairs
Bluette - there is a TA thank goodness who will be a big help, I have worked with her before
pam/res/sc - for some this may be to long a period to stay focused.... think how you feel after 30 minutes in church or whatever
Rachel5 - what is brain gym?
pam/res/sc - especially if you think the sermon is boring
Kathie - their specific exercises used to promote crossing midline, improving attention, alertness, etc.
Kathie - if you do a search for brain gym you can find some the exercises online
Rachel5 - where do you get info on them? what is crossing midline?
Kathie - crossing midline is a foundational skill that "usually" develops during the first year of life
Kathie - however, many of the kids with LD, ADD, delays, etc have not developed that skill
Bluette - I took Mike to an adaptive gym class, one on one with wonderful activities, he truly enjoyed it, started blowing bubbles, had to do 20 of them, then expansion bands, 5 reps
Dave MontrealCan - Rachel try a search at http://www.google.com
Rachel5 - yesterday in my University class that I'm taking the professor read us a storybook and I was like "Whoa, my attention span is totally gone!" I didn't hear most of it! That was a revelation. I guess it's because I'd been teaching for 8 hours before.
Kathie - these are the kiddos who have terrible hand writing
Kathie - poor reading skills etc.
Rachel5 - how about their spelling?
Kathie - crossing midline is where they physcially cross the vertical center line of their body
Rachel5 - well two of these kids are second language learners so its not as easy to assess their natural language skills
Kathie - using their dominant hand to grab something from the opposite side
Kathie - visually crossing the center of the page
Kathie - writing across the page
pam/res/sc - night all
Dave MontrealCan - Rachel did you get the goolge link?
Dave MontrealCan - Night Pam thank you for comming
Rachel5 - yes, thanks, I visit Google a lot
Rachel5 - I'm sleepy too. Thanks for the thoughts!
Kathie - good luck
Dave MontrealCan - what a wonderful group here tonight thank you fro all being here and making my session so special
Bluette - good night Dave it was most interesting
Dave MontrealCan - Please look for my articles in the teachers net gazette each month everyone
Kathie - good night
Dave MontrealCan - Good night all at this time I would like to thank Teachers' Net for allowing me to host this session it is 10 pm eastern time I am closing the meeting night everyone thank you for comming tonight
Dave MontrealCan - Rachel good luck if you need any help about sigh timpaired students please email me at melanson@teachers.net
