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Janet/AR/host - Welcome to the Substitute Teacher's Meeting!
Diane - Hi Janet. I am a guest teacher, otherwise known as a "sub."
Janet/AR/host - From what state do you sub?
Diane - What are we discussing tonight?
Janet/AR/host - Diane anything that you want pertaining to subbing.
Diane - I'm in Oregon, one of the only places you can actually live moderately well on a guest teacher's pay.
Janet/AR/host - Here, in Arkansas subs that are certified make $49.00 a day.
Diane - I'm interested in finding out what the credentials are for everyone's districts, plus the daily rate and any benefits. In other words, let's unite and improve our situation.
Diane - We have a statewide daily minimum rate of $120.40 this school year. We must be certified teachers.
Janet/AR/host - I am certified in elem. ed/spec. ed/and social studies. I am looking for a full time teaching position.
Diane - There in lies the problem. States are not providing the best education they could in this case. Certified substitutes really make a difference, as far as I can tell from talking with teachers.
Diane - $49 is too low.
Janet/AR/host - Subs are very underpaid. Subbing is harder than if you have the class all the time.
Janet/AR/host - Are you wanting a teaching position?
Diane - Absolutely!
Marcia/Ca - This is my second week subbing...So far a very enlightening experience.
Diane - It does get easier.
Janet/AR/host - Are you a certified teacher, Marcia?
Janet/AR/host - How long has everyone been subbing?
Marcia/Ca - It hasn't been hard, just very different...I am not an outgooing person, so lunches have been listening to others.
Diane - I've been a guest teacher since April of '97.
Linda/2/CA - 30 years--am a reg teacher--not sub
Janet/AR/host - WOW.....Linda give us all some tips.
Diane - Linda, what do you most appreciate in your favorite guest teachers?
Marcia/Ca - Yes, and no!. I have taught prek for 24 years and I am now venturing into the primary grades. I don't have my credential but I have much experiene learned through the school of hard knocks.
Janet/AR/host - I have been subbing for 3 years now. There is a terrible sub shortage here.
Diane - At $49, of course there is!
Linda/2/CA - If they make some attempt to follow the lesson plans--If I know that I am going to be out--I write simplified version with full explanations
Marcia/Ca - Here too!. I am on two different school dist. lists and sometimes both call.
Diane - Linda, how much of the lesson plans do you expect to get implemented?
Linda/2/CA - Tell me about it Janet--where I am at we have 5 subs for a district with over 100 teachers and all of the subs are on the lists for other districts as well
Janet/AR/host - Linda, that is a nice idea! I just go by the teacher lesson plans she has for herself.
Marcia/Ca - What surprises me is the great difference in classes...WHat the teachers demand out of the students.
Janet/AR/host - I think that is why the certified subs do not get interviewed for the full time positions.
Linda/2/CA - Since I simplify them--as much as possible. I don't expect the sub to come in and teach a formal lesson in Lang
Diane - Here in Eugene, OR, the master substitute list contains 280 for 1600 teachers.
Linda/2/CA - Lang Dev--I might have the sub read and story and have the students do response writing instead
Janet/AR/host - Marcia, You got that right. Every teacher is different and has their own way of doing things. So that is hard to deal with.
Diane - Janet, why do guest teachers not get interviewed?
Linda/2/CA - If you looked in my lesson plan book, you probably would not be able to follow them--they are simply a guide--topics and pages
Janet/AR/host - Diane, I think when the district get a good sub they try to keep them there due to the sub shortage.
Diane - So, if I am not skillful at my work, I'll get an interview?
Janet/AR/host - Linda, that is what I go by when I sub. The teachers trust me to follow them and do just fine.
Marcia/Ca - I like a very quiet classroom. Some of the rooms I have been in were so noisy... And they were behaving...on classroom was so quiet you could hear a pin drop. The kids stood and said here when I callled roll. This was a mentor teachers classroom.
Linda/2/CA - Diane--a great many of our subs have been hired in our district--that is part of the reason we have a shortage
Linda/2/CA - I have to say Janet, that I have had some truely awful subs
Marcia/Ca - that's what I am counting on.....
Diane - What made them awful?
Janet/AR/host - Linda, It is hard for some to just come into someone's room and take over. The students pray on the subs a lot.
Linda/2/CA - One who does not follow the lesson plans at all, makes no attempt to keep the kids in control
Diane - And how do you know they were awful?
Linda/2/CA - Diane--that is no reason for the sub to let the students stand on rolling chairs or cut up their journals for confetti--I personally saw this in my own classroom--he did not realize that I was on campus that day
Janet/AR/host - Here is the url to my sub worksheet. It is for Teachers to put in their sub folder or for subs to take with them when they sub. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Academy/5146/sws.html
Diane - Linda, I meant how did you know the guest teacher was awful, not your students!
Diane - I am curious to know how contract teachers get feedback on a guest teacher's performance.
Linda/2/CA - Because I walked into my classroom to get something that I had forgotten, and that is what I saw--the sub was reading a book and the students were running wild
Linda/2/CA - Good point--if you sub--leave a note for the teacher as to what you did and did not do--also DO NOT say the class was good if it was not--leave a list of the names and infractions
Diane - Aside from being in the building and dropping in on the guest teacher, how do contract teachers judge a guest teacher's performance?
Linda/2/CA - By what was or was not accomplished--and watching when they are in other rooms--also the kids will tell the reg teacher about what went on
Diane - Do you also get feedback from staff?
pambre - Linda do teachers really trust what students say about a sub?
Stanley - Linda, NO EXCUSE at all for a sub reading a book on duty, unless it would be to model silent reading for the Ss!
Linda/2/CA - Definitely--we compare notes as to whether or not we felt the sub did a good job
Linda/2/CA - There are always kids who will exaggerate or sometimes outright lie--but you always have kids in your room whom you trust--those are the ones to verify with
Diane - Linda, is it really fair to take the students' word and to judge the whole day by a brief visit? Plenty of times I've had a quiet, productive morning, then a noisy afternoon section. No one was around to see the morning, but the afternoon will condemn me.
Janet/AR/host - Stanley, are you saying a sub should not read to the students at all?
Linda/2/CA - Stanley--we once had a sub who was SLEEPING in the classroom--34 K students with absolutely NO supervision--the principal walked in on her during this time
Janet/AR/host - I totally agree Diane!!
Janet/AR/host - That's terrible! Linda.
Diane - 34 Kinders is too many in one classroom!
Stanley - Diane, I'd really doubt a bad 2nd half would do you in. Kids are more fair than that, I suspect.
Janet/AR/host - Diane, Agree.....way to many!
Linda/2/CA - No longer have that many--only 20
Stanley - Diane, plus most districts AREN'T eager to eliminate the subs they have! :-)
Diane - Around here, we have a surplus. (Oregon)
pambre - I can not imagine 34 k.
Diane - I can imagine 34 Kinders. I once taught 38 first graders. Yikes!
Janet/AR/host - Stanley, you do not think a sub should read to the students a loud?
Linda/2/CA - You are right Stanley--I take most of what they say with a grain of salt--and I have the subs phone # if I need to ask a question
pambre - Diane, how is it that you have surplus. Are there few jobs in business etc. there.
Stanley - Janet, sorry! No, only that a sub shouldn't be ignoring the kids by burying his/her nose in a "personal" book. book.
Diane - I put my phone number on every end of the day report. No one has ever called me in three years.
Linda/2/CA - I usually have my subs read to the students--tomorrow the sub will read "the Little Old Lady Who Wasn't Afraid of Anything"
Janet/AR/host - Stanley, I totally agree with that!
Diane - pambre, guest teachers in Oregon make $120 per day.
Linda/2/CA - Diane--most of our subs do not leave a report--I have to ask the kids what they did when I return
Janet/AR/host - Diane, same here! Does everyone get requested back by teachers?
Stanley - Linda, I'm a multi-district sub in San Diego County.
Linda/2/CA - YES! YES! YES!
pambre - Diane then do you think shortage is solved by increase in pay?
Janet/AR/host - Linda, print out my sub worksheet and leave a note asking them to fill it out.
Linda/2/CA - where is it?
Janet/AR/host - pambre, I do believe that would help here. We make $49.00 a day here.
Stanley - Janet, Read alouds are, in the words of the kids, "the bomb!" I always pack at LEAST 1 with me!
Diane - That's what happens when states have uncertified folks as substitute teachers. Lack of professionalism. Lack of understanding of what teachers want. Am I being too harsh?
Linda/2/CA - I even have a folder full of emergency activities in case I did not leave any plans or they are unable to follow any part of the plans that I left
Janet/AR/host - Diane, no not at all and it is true!
Stanley - Diane, I'm certified, but I don't think certification per se is critical.
pambre - I understand that even Mn. had to give BA degree cert. to sub to fill shortage.
Janet/AR/host - Diane, I cleaned up a room after a sub one day. This sub had K and she left the room in a terrible mess. Another teacher and i cleaned the room and the other teacher told the Principal about it and the Principal called the sub and told her they did not want her back.
Marcia/Ca - more often than not I find the students finish all the work...I have been gathering some games and activities to play. I even learned a new one today ..
Marcia/Ca - In CA it is a B.A. plus passing the notorious CBEST,,that wasn't that hard...if I passed it the first time....
Linda/2/CA - I think that all subs should have an emergency pack--activities to do if the teacher leaves no lesson plans
Stanley - Janet, What the K sub did was POOR! However, isn't that more a lack of common sense rather than a potential issue of certification?
Marcia/Ca - Linda remind me to teach you the new game I learned in Ann's class today. perfect for your friends in 1st.
Janet/AR/host - Linda, all subs should come prepared. One can make their own wordsearhes and puzzles at http://www.puzzlemaker.com
Linda/2/CA - great marcia--always looking for new stuff
Marcia/Ca - I have been surprised at the different skill levels of
Stanley - Linda, I believe there's a current strand on the sub board about to carry in such a pack.
Marcia/Ca - the same grade level students from one part of the city to the other.
Janet/AR/host - Stanley, she was not a certified teacher as a sub. She just did not care how she left the room.
Marcia/Ca - my problem is I can't afford the copy machine..
Linda/2/CA - Did the schools tell you that they would charge you to use their copy machine?
Linda/2/CA - Otherwise--only need to carry one copy with you and use their paper and their machine
Janet/AR/host - Marcia, they do not charge the subs for copy machine use. But most of the time I do not need to use it.
Marcia/Ca - no I didn't ask...I just haven't made any to take..
pambre - Marcia, can you use the schools computer and copy machine?
Stanley - Janet, but don't you feel her obvious lack of caring is unrelated to her lack of certification?
Marcia/Ca - but some teachers are limited in copy use.
Diane/OR - Marcia, I always get permission to make photocopies at the school. Make an initial set of 30, use them up, then replenish your supply before you leave for the day. That gives you the whole day to figure out where the machines are, what codes you need, etc.
Janet/AR/host - Stanley, yes I do!
Marcia/Ca - I don't know... I am so new I am afraid to ask and look green.
Linda/2/CA - So--most principals and the office staff would be understanding--they realize that emergencies happen
pambre - Marcia talk to the principal. I get them to let me use the machines.
Janet/AR/host - I bring in my own paper to use for copying at my full time job. They don't mind as long as I do not use the company paper.
Stanley - Janet, I'd have less anxiety over work if there were no emergency subs here. However, several of the top subs I know are on emergency credentials!
Marcia/Ca - So far I know enough activities to keep everyone busy...
pambre - Janet can you explain how cert. and caring about classroom are related?
Janet/AR/host - I make my own Bingo games as well. I use sight words and math problems.
Linda/2/CA - Yes--I see some cert teachers who have absolutely messy classrooms
Stanley - Marcia, I once had somebody read me off for making ONE copy! (It was of the class roster, a particular fetish of mine.)
Diane/OR - Does anyone know if this is a true statement: "Most school districts in the United States do not require substitute teachers to be credentialed, licensed, teachers."?
Janet/AR/host - pambre, maybe I am miss understanding Stanley's question.
Janet/AR/host - In Arkansas one does not have to be certified.
Diane/OR - Stanley, let's talk fetishes. Mine are: class roster, seating chart, plans written in PEN!
Stanley - Diane/OR, I'd guess that's a fair statement,
Linda/2/CA - Diane--that is about the only kind you can get in CA--districts are hiring all the cred ones because they feel that that is better to raise test scores
sue - I subbed 6th grade today
Marcia/Ca - why the lesson plans in PEN?
Stanley - Linda, PLENTY of credentialed subs in San Diego. Possibly not biling, SPED, Math/Science, but everything else!
Janet/AR/host - sue, how did it go?
pambre - I still can not believe district has me teaching class till semester because of shortage of teachers for BD.
Linda/2/CA - BD?
Stanley - Diane, I make my own copy of the roster, & I can function fine without a seating chart, but ONLY @ Elementary!
Janet/AR/host - I do not see a teacher shortage around here.
Marcia/Ca - no one wants those classes that's why they are available..the same thing here..Those are the last ones to get a teacher.
pambre - Linda BD is behavioal disorder.
Diane/OR - Aside from having no lesson plans, the most annoying thing is to find handwritten plans, in pencil, on a yellow pad. Barely legible.
sue - ok-one girl had in 4th a couple years ago a little smart this afternoon. She was mad because computer teacher gave her detention for gum. She told me she told her only a warning. OI said I need a note. I talked to computer teacher during lunch and she clarified the girl was lying. We both went to make sure she was ibn detention.
Janet/AR/host - Stanley, I never have a seating chart available for me. I usually give the students index cards for them to put their names on and decorate during lunch/attendance count.
Stanley - pambre, at 1 of the sites where I'm a "fixture" there are at LEAST 3 credentialed SPED Ts teaching reg ed! The paperwork is what drives them off!!
Marcia/Ca - I guess I have been lucky so far then...One teacher had a friend drop the lesson plan after the start of school, but there have always been written plans...
Diane/OR - I read the guest teachers in Fresno were bargaining to get a requirement for seating charts to be mandatory.
Linda/2/CA - Diane--usually I type mine on my computer--sometimes FAX them in--students names are on desks and leave adhesive name badges to use
Diane/OR - Linda, you are the teacher we all dream of teaching for.l
Linda/2/CA - Don't teach in Fresno--and have better things to do with my time than continuously update a seating chart
sue - students often try to get out of ASSIGNED SEATS WHEN THEY SEE A SUB
Stanley - Janet, I've done that. However, I can usually get by just knowing how the T numbers the tables.
Janet/AR/host - Linda, I don't particularly care to have a seating chart.
Linda/2/CA - I am a mentor teacher--I have to know these kind of things--try to make it easy for subs
Marcia/Ca - I make the seating chart first thing when I get there...
Linda/2/CA - just for fun--see how good a seating chart is when you have 3 sets of identical twins
Janet/AR/host - Teachers here in Arkansas are great to the subs so far to me they are.
Linda/2/CA - all boys!!!
Diane/OR - Linda, that's interesting. Why do you think that keeping an up to date seating chart a waste of time? I always use them. I make them if there is not one available. It is the easiest way to learn names at the beginning of the day, a way to get order during that crucial first ten minutes in a new class.
Janet/AR/host - Do any of you keep a sub journal?
Stanley - Linda, I just finished a 9 day job where I made a seating chart on the classrm computer. Very, VERY easy to change that way!
pambre - Seating charts are really helpfull in middle school.
Linda/2/CA - because I am constanly moving children and they are seldom in their desks--stations, computers, etc
Diane/OR - Janet, I do. My entries are less frequent now. But during that first year, I wrote almost every day. I could really see my improvement as a teacher when I read over.
Janet/AR/host - Linda, I totally agree with you on the seating chart issue.
sue - my mind is enough memory of subbing-keep all days and who tsught for and what school in 2 year planner
pambre - What's a sub journal?
Stanley - Janet, no on the journal, though I sometimes to my note to the T on a computer so I have a copy. What do you put in your journal??
Diane/OR - Janet, of course you agree with Linda. You don't feel you need seating charts. I can't function without one.
Janet/AR/host - Diane, true you are! It really helps. I also take a camera and take pics of the classroom set up. Especially if it is one I like.
sue - I write days in planner etc. payroll purposes
Marcia/Ca - I have been saving a few ideas for centers and classroom set up...but .....
Janet/AR/host - Pambre, it is just a log of what all went on the day one subs. Special things of interest to you.
Marcia/Ca - Oppps!I have the hardest time remembering names..I finally get it by the end of the day and then it's the end...
Janet/AR/host - pambre, like a diary.
Stanley - I've really messed up by not keeping better track of neat stuff I've seen!
sue - I would have a gigantic book by now
Janet/AR/host - I usually fill up one notebook a year.
sue - no way remembering all studentsss namess after sub very long and go different places
pambre - I would have a huge book by now but find I remember the really important things.
Janet/AR/host - Diane, everyone is different. It just does not matter if I have a seating chart or not. Sorry.
sue - I always leave note for the teacher
Stanley - Marcia, I'm with you on the names. But I've found calling out the table # is ALMOST as effective.
Janet/AR/host - sue, I do, too.
pambre - After enough years you know students names and faces.
Diane/OR - Janet, it's just that in the morning, making a seating chart is not something I want to spend my time on. My time would be better spent locating materials and reading student texts and reading the plans for a second time.
sue - They always remember you also
Janet/AR/host - I want to thank everyone for attending the meeting and hope you all come back next month.
Marcia/Ca - yes but often there is one student at that table that is a problemmm I hate to punish the whole table..and at the primary level,,,it is not fair.
Stanley - Notes are important. Mine, however, tend to be too verbose, so I'm learning to pare them down.
Diane/OR - Stanley, judging by the few examples I've seen of your writing, I can only imagine. I also had to learn how to be just brief enough to get across the information the teachers really want.
Stanley - Marcia, I find just calling out the table # usually avoids the need for punishment.
Janet/AR/host - Stanley, I do that all the time. I now sort of make lists instead of long post in my sub journal.
Janet/AR/host - Thanks everyone for a great meeting.
Janet/AR/host - bye bye!
