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kthynoll - Thanks Kathleen, my web site is: http://hometown.aol.com/kthynoll
Kathleen - Teachers.Net welcomes Kathy Noll, author of Taking the Bully By the Horns.
kthynoll - Hello everyone.
Kathleen - In order to make this session as productive as possible, some questions were pre-submitted to Ms. Noll, allowing her to type responses in advance. She will respond to participants' questions later in the session.Kathleen - Kathy, why was your book, Taking the Bully By the Horns, written?
kthynoll - There is a great need for information on bullies now as a lot of children are having problems. I know this because I receive a lot of mail asking for help from parents, children and educators. Also, our book was written right before all the school shootings and bomb threats began so there is a definite NEED for it.Kathleen - How did Dr. Jay Carter become your co-author?
kthynoll - My book, "Taking the Bully by the Horns" is the children's version of Dr. Jay Carter's best-selling book, "Nasty People." Dr. Carter asked me to write this book because he had liked my short stories that I wrote for children. He had placed an ad in the newspaper for a co-author and said he picked me over 50 other authors who submitted writing samples because he felt I had a way with talking to kids.Kathleen - How does his influence affect the book?
kthynoll - Jay Carter is a psychologist and owner of the Center for Self-esteem where he counsels. Our book, "Taking the Bully by the Horns" is largely about self-esteem and self-help because of his influence. The book not only teaches kids how to handle bullies, but also shows kids how they can improve their self-esteem and feel good about themselves. This will help them grow into healthy, strong adults.Kathleen - Who is the book intended to help?
kthynoll - Educators are helped by using "Taking the Bully by the Horns" to control their class bullies and also to help their class victims. Parents are helped by reading the book to their children or having them read it themselves. And children/young adults are helped - both victims AND bullies. The victims will learn how to handle bullies and where to get help. The bullies will learn how their negative actions are affecting people and how to change their behavior. Both are helped with self-esteem as well which is very important when dealing with these issues.Kathleen - How can we order your book?
kthynoll - There is info. available at my web site: http://hometown.aol.com/kthynoll or send $12.95 plus $2.00 S/H to: Kathy Noll, 3300 Chestnut St., Reading, PA 19605 Thank you.Kathleen - Define "bullying;" what does it consist of?
kthynoll - Bullying consists of ongoing threats, physical attacks, words, gestures, or social exclusion directed at a student or students by a student or group of students who are older, bigger, or more powerful. Besides physical bullying, there is also verbal bullying and mental bullying. The bully's pattern of verbal abuse might include: teasing, swearing, put downs, gossiping, twisting your words around, judging you unfairly, passing blame, bossing, embarrassing you in front of a group, making you cry. The bully's pattern of mental abuse includes: twisting your words around, judging you unfairly, missing the point, passing blame, bossing, making you self-conscious, embarrassing you, making you cry, confusing you, and making you feel small so he/she can feel big.Kathleen - What are the statistics on children being bullied?
kthynoll - According to the US Dept. of Justice: 1 out of 4 children are being bullied. 83% fear harassment in the bathroom. Over 100,000 kids have carried guns to school. More statistics are available at my web site: http://hometown.aol.com/kthynollKathleen - If a child is hit, should he/she strike back to defend him/herself?
kthynoll - In my book, "Taking the Bully by the Horns" we call this the "bully cycle." Bullies create more bullies. This is not good. The cycle needs to stop somewhere. If the child had tried confronting the bully or talking out the situation peacefully to no avail and was backed up against a wall so that he/she couldn't walk or run away and actually needed to defend himself/herself, that is a different story. But when we're talking about teasing or verbal abuse, tell your child, "You don't need to listen to that. You're better than that. Just walk away."Kathleen - What sort of feedback have you gotten from those who have read your book?
kthynoll - Those who have shared my book with their children/students tell me the children feel stronger after reading my book. They also understand bullying behavior better, and have improved their self-esteem. One boy touched me when he told me he was handicapped and read my book Christmas day when he received it. He didn't put it down until he was finished and said it was the best book he ever read and that it made him feel a lot better about himself.Kathleen - How are schools using your book?
kthynoll - Schools/Teachers need to be aware of conflicts and to not be afraid to get involved. Start your own "peace" programs. One example would be students in Hillsboro H.S. in Nashville, Tenn., who created the "I will pledge" and urge fellow students to sign the pledge not to mock or bully others who dress, act, look, or talk differently. Teachers are also using, "Taking the Bully by the Horns" for role playing in the classrooms. Since I believe in my book, and the help it's been giving children, I suggest reading it aloud to the group. The book is written in first person, so you will be addressing them, and speaking directly to them. This way, you can teach them the skills they need to handle bullies and feel good about themselves (self-esteem/life skills). I ask questions in the book, and you can pause to get their opinions. I also added a bit of humor so it will be enjoyable for them AND they will learn something. Then, you could try some role playing, where they take turns acting out situations where they play both bullies and victims. This will show them how it "feels" and give them ideas on what to do to help themselves and others.Kathleen - What information does your web site provide?
kthynoll - Articles, advice and statistics for educators, parents and children. Also, information on Dr. Carter, myself and also on our book, "Taking the Bully by the Horns," including how to order. I am constantly adding more helpful info. as I find/research it: http://hometown.aol.com/kthynollKathleen - How does a bully become a bully?
kthynoll - He (or she) may be angry at problems he's having in his own life and is looking for people to use as punching bags. It could also be a learned behavior from being bullied at home by family members. Another reason we hear a lot about is the influence of violence in the media. But the major reason is that they really have a low self-esteem. They make look high and mighty but that is arrogance. Don't mistake arrogance for a high self-esteem. If someone truly has a good self-esteem they would not feel the need to control others.Dave MontrealCan - Hi Kathy I am Dave in Montreal I was bullied a lot at times i attended regular school as a sight impaired child from K right through University do you touch on the topic of sight impaired children being bullied in the regular classroom?
kthynoll - Hi Dave. Not specifically on sight impaired children but in the book I mention children being picked on because they are different. And there is nothing wrong with being different but since children lack in social skills they will make fun of anything or anyone that is different because they don't understand it. They fear things they don't understand and don't know how to process that. Sorry to hear your story, Dave, but you are not alone.Kathleen - What signs can we look for to know if a child has become a bully?
kthynoll - Damaging property, Setting fires, Torturing animals, Violent rage/outbursts/tantrums, Angry at everyone/everything, Was bullied himself/herself (in my book we call this the "Bully Cycle"), Lack of respect for others, Low self-esteem (Bullies have low self-esteem. Don't mistake arrogance for high self-esteem), A controller, Lack of remorse...MrsG - Hi Kathy I am from Darwin Australia and teach 5 and 6 year olds. In my new class I have a child I taught last year who was always intimidating the new children. Do you have any ideas to work with him, and is your book suitable for 5 and 6 year olds?
kthynoll - Ask him why he is doing what he is doing. Is he angry about something? Ask him how he would like it if other children treated HIM that way. My book can be shared by an adult with younger children. Thanks Mrs. G.Kathleen - What are useful questions you can ask a bully?
kthynoll - What did you do? Why was that a bad thing to do? Who did you hurt? What were you trying to accomplish? Next time you have that goal, how will you meet it without hurting anybody? How will you help the person you hurt? These questions will help them to: Acknowledge their own actions and the consequences they have on themselves and others, develop shame and guilt ("I don't want to go through that again" & "I hurt someone"), change their actions to stay out of trouble, and learn to trust and form relationships with helping adults.Alihiam/4/OH - I am in a building that is full of bullys. We have tried many, many approaches to incorporating character edcation, selfesteem classes, etc into our day. But, to no avail, some just don't stop......I have a little girl in my room that is very shy and backward. She often picks her nose (you get the picture), is disheveled, has been sexually abused....she seeks a lot of counseling, and gets lots of help...she just is the center of being made fun of. How do I stop my students from doing this without putting T. as center of attention?
kthynoll - You could help the girl with her social skills or have a talk with her parents about this. Tell your students who are bullying her that they are showing no respect for another individual. That is wrong and their negative actions will have consequences. They need to learn "respect." Good luck AlihiamKathleen - What are the signs to look for to know if a child is a victim of a bully?
kthynoll - A change in behavior, such as suffering a lack of concentration and/or becoming withdrawn, excessively clingy, depressed, fearful, emotionally up and down. Happy at the weekend but not during the week. A drop in performance in school or at work. Physical signs: stomach aches, headaches, sleep difficulties, bruising, torn clothing. Bingeing on food, cigarettes, alcohol.Alihiam/4/OH - Thanks, I've been doing those same things, they just don't seem to be the answer in this situation. I don't really know that there is any real answer....I'll just keep being persistent. Thanks for your help!
kthynoll - Alihiam, there are many things you can try. Peer mediation, role-playing, talking it out...I offer many different things to try at my web site: http://hometown.aol.com/kthynoll Every case is different and unique so the solutions vary. Thank you.Jennifer_PerthOz - in my last class my lessons were derailed and time lost because of the irrational and loud tantrums from a particular child - reasoning with him just prolonged the time wasted so i stopped arguing with him - but he created dangerous situations by provoking other children to flashpoint as well - what is the best way to regain control of a situation like that?
kthynoll - Jennifer, if trying to reason with him did not work, how about a time out? A trip the principal's office to call his parents so he can tell them himself how he's been behaving?
Jennifer_PerthOz - with our school discipline policy i was only able to send him to same year level teachers and they refused because of his disruptive influence - parents refuse to have any help from school psychologist - and the principal got so tired of his visits to the office she implied that it was my classroom control that was at fault - I will share your book with his teacher for this year - and my new class - thanks kathy
kthynoll - Thank you, Jennifer. Good luck : )Kathleen - Kathy is there something more you wish to say about what kids can do to deal with bullies?
kthynoll - Ignore them. Bullies feel the need to "control." They want to get a reaction out of you. If they don't get this, it won't be any fun for them and they'll become bored and move on.Addie /MO - what advice is appropriate for the others in the class with the bully? how can they best deal with the bully?
kthynoll - Hi Addie. They can best deal with the bully by ignoring him. Take away his power so he stops "showing off" for them. Also, if the others are bystanders to a bullying incident, they need to know that they should report this so as to help the victims.Kathleen - What about a child "confronting" a bully?
kthynoll - We suggest confronting the bully only if the bully is not physically violent. This is only suggested if the bullying is verbal. Therefore the bully should be confronted and questioned as to why he is doing this. "Why are you saying these things to me?" "Why are you trying to hurt me; I've never done anything to you." If the bully sees his "victim" is actually a respectable thinking, feeling human being, he may not think of him anymore as his door mat. The bully doesn't always have a reason for bullying a particular child so when asked why he is doing what he is doing, it may stump him. It may actually make him think. This is just one idea to try. It is also good to stand your ground with a bully. To be strong but kind. You need to show that you respect yourself, you are strong, and are not interested in playing the bully's games. The bully is more prone to go for those who look weak, have poor social skills, hold their heads down, speak without confidence etc....the bully sees them as easier to control.Dave MontrealCan - Kathy I give workshops and sensitization training to elementary teachers about mainstreaming and integrating sight impaired children into the regular classroom I often talk about bullying and the consequences it has on the sight impaired child do you have any suggestions of what I should cover in these workshops for teachers on bullying as pretains to a sight impaired child? Thank you
kthynoll - Make sure, Dave, the teachers are aware of any "bully" problems in their schools/classrooms and to be prepared what to do if a bullying incident should occur. They should make it known to their students that bullying behavior will not be tolerated. Again, there are many bully programs out there that are working for schools. Many I have listed at my site: http://hometown.aol.com/kthynollKathleen - What can parents do if they think their child is being bullied?
kthynoll - What can parents do? You *know* there is a problem. The first step is to get your child to admit there is a problem. He/she may be too embarrassed or scared, and might deny it. They need to know they can trust you and look to you for help. (Encourage them) First give them this option: They might want to settle the situation themselves before getting you involved (you calling the school or bully's parents). You might try giving them some ideas. For example: If your child is getting bullied because of poor social skills - his shoes are always untied, he walks with his head down, shoulders slouched, avoids eye contact, shirt half tucked in, unclean hair or body, always biting nails or picking nose - You can help him/her by teaching them better social skills. You also might try a type of role-playing to see how your child acts around other kids. This gives you the opportunity to help your child work out acceptable responses. (especially if he/she is being bullied verbally) Allow your children to confide in you and listen with an open mind. The victims must first admit on their own that there is a problem. Allowing children to handle it themselves will help with their self-esteem. If the bullying is physically dangerous, or the victims want the parents to get involved, the parents should make sure both the school and the parents of the bullies are notified of the situation. They can also provide a safe means of transport to and from school or suggest their child walk in a group, never alone.Paulie - I too have been told my classroom management plan which I have used (adjusted each year) for 14 years is causing the poor behavior in my classroom. I am at a loss as what to do with my bullies. I have ignored, sent to office, given time outs, talked to them etc. but it is to no avail. I want to know how I can help these kids and my class get back some respect. Thank you.
kthynoll - Paulie, one teacher I know also wanted to teach respect to his sstudents and so about 12 years ago started a program where he teaches the kids responsibility. They are given positive activities to fill their time such as volunteering at school functions. He has reformed many bullies.
Paulie - It is a given to get the book -- I need instant help/advice before I go crazy . . . these kids (4th gr0 have had these problems since K and i get the blame. I have a program like that -- we do things to help others and my main rule has to do with RESPECT! I agree with Mrs. G -- our room acts like hers and 19 of my kids are out of control. When ignored they do outlandish things.MrsG - When my class and myself ignore the bully that is when the real problem starts. He will go into screaming tantrums and start destroying the classroom, and need physical restraining to protect the other children. The principal is busy and never gets here in time or she just buries her head and says she cant get down. Any suggestions for sorting out this explostion. I also have the problem that if I leave my class to escort him out of the room the rest of the class (5 and 6 year olds) are left unattended.
kthynoll - Mrs. G. have you talked to his parents about this? Have you been firm with him? Tell him that is "enough" (evil eye) You will NOT tolerate it. Tell him you'll have him sent home for his parents to deal with him. Perhaps he needs to be put into a special school.
MrsG - Kathy we don't have special schools here, inclusion all the way, and his parents feel he is being bullied and not the bullier.Kathleen - Kathy, Any other ideas of anti-bully programs that have been put into action, the program you mentioned to Paulie?
kthynoll - Tell them to treat others the way they want to be treated.
kthynoll - Many schools admit that the lockers are the most common place that bullying takes place. Teachers could take turns standing by these lockers during class changes. Another great idea schools are using is to have teachers hold up pictures of kids faces while asking the students, "How does this person feel?" This promotes a discussion aimed at helping kids to identify and describe emotions. And for teens, pictures of conflicts or stressful situations can be used to promote discussion & ideas for resolution. (more)Kathleen - Any other ideas of anti-bully programs that have been put into action
kthynoll - Brainstorm with students a list of fact-based questions they have about bullying. Students might want to know, for example, the percentage of students who are bullied, the percentage of suicides that are blamed on bullying, the number of incidents of school violence that are the result of bullying, the percentage of bullies who commit violent crimes as adults, the percentage of schools that have anti-bully programs, and so on. Select five to ten of the most important questions, arrange students in pairs or small groups, and ask each group to research print or online resources to find the answer to its assigned question. Combine the questions into a quiz, either online or in print, and invite students to take the quiz. I will continue to add more ideas to my web site as to what other schools are doing to stop bullies: http://hometown.aol.com/kthynoll
kthynoll - The schools can also pass out questionnaires, and do surveys or polls to find out what students and parents think about what is happening and what they would like to see done. Some teachers have told me that their schools put up a peace flag outside on days when there is no conflict in the school. This promotes a pride in the school, and teaches them that even one person's actions can have consequences that affect everyone. Other schools are using posters, and having the students wear certain colors on certain days.
kthynoll - Here are some ideas what my local schools are doing: Our local schools participated in Berks County's Annual Week Without Violence. One program included, "Hands Around Violence." Students made paper cut outs of their hand prints and wrote nonviolent messages on them. For example, "I will not use my hands or words for hurting." The "Pledge Hands" will serve as a visual reminder that together they can make a difference. Other activities included a white out, where students wore as much white as possible to symbolize peace, a unity day, where students wore their school colors, and a smile day, where each student received a smile card and handed that card over to the first person to smile at them.Kathleen - How are schools using "peer mediation" to combat bullying?
kthynoll - In mediation, trained students help their classmates identify the problems behind the conflicts and to find solutions. Peer mediation is not about finding who is right or wrong. Instead, students are encouraged to move beyond the immediate conflict and learn how to get along with each other - an important skill in today's world. Peer mediators ask the disputing students to tell their stories and ask questions for clarification. The mediators help the students identify ways to solve the conflict. Mediation Steps: Agree upon the ground rules. Each student tells his/her story. Verify the stories. Discuss the stories. Generate solutions. Discuss solutions. Select a solution. Sign a contract. Participants should be willing to: Solve the problem. Tell the truth. Listen without interrupting. Be respectful. Take responsibility for carrying out the agreement. Keep the situation confidential.Kathleen - Paulie, that might work for your group, but Mrs. G.'s kids are probably too young.
Addie /MO - if the bully is physical, how do the students ignore him/her? i had this situation last year and the children tried to ignore and didnt tattle, etc. then an incident (physical) was brought to my attn that i could not ignore. so i isolated the "bully" and set very structured procedures for her being out of her seat. the day that the incident i couldnt ignore came to light, she was absent. we had a class meeting about how to help her and the kids told me alot of things that she had done to them in the past that i was unaware of. i felt terrible about the situation, for the bully and for the other kids. keeping her more restricted helped me manage the situation better and "protect" the rest of my class, but i am not sure it was the best solution. any comments?
kthynoll - Sounds like you did well Addie. Good thing the kids opened up to you. No, we don't recommend ignoring the bully if it's physical. That is only suggested for teasing. With violent behavior, definitely the parents need to be involved. If property is damaged or the threat of physical violence and nothing is done about the and the parents refuse to get involved, file a police report.Dave MontrealCan - kathy an idea i had was to have the bully be blindfolded and be forced to walk around the school or to try on simmulator glasses and force them to walk around the school in the shoes of the sight impaired individual and then ask them after how would you like to be treated like that and see how they would answer that is this a good idea?
kthynoll - Dave, that is a GREAT idea. Kids really need to be shown things to understand them.kthynoll - More ideas on what we ALL can do to prevent bullying: It's all about talking it out: Child to Child (Peer Mediation), Teacher to Parent (PTO's, PTA's), Teacher to Teacher (in service days), Parent to Child (at home). There should be town meetings involving the parents, students, and entire school faculty to discuss Conflict Resolution. The teachers should also allow the students to give "their" ideas on how they would like situations handled. For younger students, role playing of "victims" and "bullies" in the classroom will help them understand the cause and effect - how it feels. Another idea for younger kids getting picked on could be to have an older student assigned as a type of mentor that he could talk to, and who would step in to settle a conflict or dispute. Groups have also been created where victims and their parents can meet with other victims and discuss solutions. It's comforting to know you're not alone, and friendships can be made there.
Kathleen - Get your PTO to invest in copies of Taking the Bully By the Horns
Kathleen - What is the difference between the boy bully and the girl bully?
kthynoll - They are the same in many ways. However girls are prone to specifically bully through gossip, ostracizing and forming "cliques." Girls and boys both use teasing and verbal abuse; however, the boys are more prone to use physical violence. 80% of the time an argument with a bully will end up in a physical fight.
kthynoll - Interesting note: according to the Dept. of Justice there are currently more bullies that are girls than boys.Kathleen - Kathy, is there anything else you'd like to add?
kthynoll - The best way t approach kids who have been victimized: Don't question victims intently or ask anything that might make them feel that they have done something wrong. Broach the subject obliquely, giving them the option to talk about it or not. Let them know that you are willing to listen at any time. When they start to talk, listen carefully to what they have to say. Once they begin to discuss the bullying, it may seem to be all they can talk about. Be patient and let them go on - it's better for them to let it all out than to bottle it up. Don't over-react - victims need rational advice and help, not emotional overload. Believe the victim and not any authority figure who may dismiss the claims of bullying simply as "part of growing up" or "part of the rough and tumble of life." No one should have to put up with bullying. Ask victims if they have any suggestions about changing the situation. Seek advice from an individual or a support group with experience in this area. Keep an eye on the victim. If they threaten suicide, take this very seriously and obtain professional help immediately.kthynoll - Parents really need to get more involved in their children's lives. That way they will be more sensitive to problems occurring. Promote honesty. Ask questions. Listen with an open mind and focus on understanding. Allow children to express how they feel, and treat a child's feelings with respect. Set a good example by showing them a healthy temperament. Settle conflicts by talking things out peacefully. Congratulate or reward them when you see them using these positive skills to settle a difference. Teach them to identify "the problem", and focus on the problem, "not" attacking "the person." Tell them conflicts are a way of life, but violence doesn't have to be. And finally, teaching them to take responsibility for their own actions will make for a healthier child, a healthier self-esteem, and there will be no need for any "bullies" or "victims" in the world.
Kathleen - Thank you Kathy Noll and all who participated tonight discussing this very important topic.
MrsG - yes, thanks
kthynoll - One more important thing: You never tell the victim "it's their fault" when a bully bullies them. The bully is the one with the problem. The victim needs to know he's OK and did not cause this. However there are certain kids who are more likely to be bullied. For example: those with poor social skills. You could reduce your chances of being bullied by walking straight and tall, shoulders back/head held high, making eye contact, speaking loudly and clearly, assuming an air of confidence with yourself and your surroundings.
Dave MontrealCan - thank you very much kathy
kthynoll - You're welcome. Thanks to all who hung around. It was a lot of info. and I hope you found something in it that will help you and affect those around you in a positive way.
Paulie - Thanks for trying
Kathleen - I wish we could help Paulie with her problem
kthynoll - Goodnight. Take care everyone : )
Kathleen - Goodnight, Kathy!
