I didn't mean to be judgmental there with the prediction in the previous
post. This problem with talking and noise is a process I've notice from
myself many times in the past. I can relate to the situation and many
years ago I came to the conclusion that I needed to keep the class at a
whisper or even perfectly quiet to get the most done. This works better
for me than the alternative. If they are free to talk, they start
competing for the available sound space in the room. I'll explain this
below.

I don't teach science but I do teach a lab of sorts. I teach band. The
thing I would say here is that kids will always take advantage of the
talking thing. In a band class, we have 65-120 kids in front of us and
if we allow any talking, it gets out of hand quickly. I am just
suggesting that you keep a high expectation backed by a reasonable
consequence. If you do this, you'll eliminate the problem.

Here's the real problem with the talking. When one person starts to
speak loudly or laughs loudly, there is competition for the ability to
hear. When there is competition for sound, voices increase so that they
are heard. The radio sounds good but will create more competiton for
sound space. They may talk louder. Then again, it may calm them down.
Then again, it may be a distraction. Where do you go when you want to
work and think about paperwork or email? A quiet office free from
distraction.

Just sit back sometime after you get them quiet and notice how this
works. If you leave them long enough, they will be shouting at each
other to compete with the noise in the room. Most young kids below the
age of 18 cannot communicate in a room with maturity. You need some
process and expectation to follow that allows them to communicate
without noise competition. Sometimes just explaining what I mention
above will help them understand what is happening and why you want them
quiet.

The best thing you can do for them is create the parameters to follow
and allow for an atmosphere where you don't need to resort to
detentions. Detentions will likely backfire. Creating a consequence
that fits the crime is a better choice. My opinion is that keeping them
at a whisper creates an atmosphere when they have the following benefits:

1. Deeper thought can take place in a quiet space
2. Sound competition is eliminated
3. Stress will diminish (yours and theirs)
4. You will be the dominant voice in the room when you speak or need to
instruct.
5. Having a reasonable consequence allows them to all continue in the
educational opportunity.

I hope anything I've said has helped. I may not have said it well in
the previous post.

Steve

On 10/24/09, JM wrote:
> Thanks for the feedback, but, with all due respect, I have never
> exploded with my kids. I HAVE given them the lecture on behavior,
> but the problem is that, unlike, say, seatwork, I don't expect labs
> to be ultra-quiet. In my mind, they shouldn't be. So, the problem
> really is one of teaching them what the proper volume level should
> be....somewhere above a whisper, but less than loud.
>
> I LOVE the idea of using music...I saw my kids' Montessori
> kindergarten teacher use this technique. Her rule was that, if the
> kids couldn't hear the music, then they were talking too loudly.
> You've never seen a quieter kindergarten class in your life.
>
> I actually thought of trying this with my kids, and mentioned it to
> my Principal, but he was ADAMANTLY against the idea, because, he
> says, it is distracting to auditory learners (playing music in the
> background). So I can't really go against his direction....
>
> Steve, did you teach a science course with labs? I'm just curious
> if you used the strategy you're recommending (i.e. having the
> disruptive kids take notes...) I have given kids detentions for
> bad behavior, but maybe I just need to be more consistent?
>
> The thing is, the way my room is set up, I don't really have a way
> to separate the bad behavior kids from the lab groups. I just
> don't have the room.
>
> - JM
>
>
> On 10/22/09, Steve wrote:
>>
>> I think that I can predict something with a reasonable amount of
>> accuracy. You've tried asking them to get quiet only to allow the
>> noise to return until you get angry and explode. You get visibly
>> aggravated and then go into a lecture about behavior. You repeat
>> this process and the student don't take you seriously. Am I
> right?
>>
>> The problem is solved by calming yourself down and getting
>> assertive with your expectations. Put a smile on your face, tell
>> they how it's going to be and then do it. You can accomplish this
>> easily and without emotion. You can provide a better atmosphere
>> for the students to learn and they will take you seriously. Don't
>> give them control of the situation.
>>
>> Set a strict policy on speaking above a whisper and then stick to
>> it. Make the policy your main agenda for the class. Let the
>> students know that they can either work quietly or be separated to
>> the edge of the room to take notes on what the others are doing.
>> The notes then go home and are returned in the form of a 3 page
>> paper describing the lab, signed by the parent. Only give them
>> partial credit. Make it their choice through their behavior. If
>> they continue disrupting class when you separate them, send them
>> on to the principal for disrespectful behavior. Don't mess with
>> poor behavior. If you do, it will rule your class and you won't
>> get anything done. If your students are some of the brighter
>> students in the school, they will do what you ask and avoid the
>> alternative.
>>
>> For those who repeat the problem, call or email the parent and
>> stress that your expectations are not optional and that Johnny is
>> risking his grade when he refused to meet this reasonable
>> expectation. Be nice and show value for the student. No
>> detentions necessary.
>>
>> I promise you that two students with this plan will cure the
>> problem and the rest of the students will respect you for it.
>> Your word now means something and when you ask for them to get
>> quiet, they will. Keep this policy in place and your problem is
>> solved each time a student needs a reminder. The students that
>> you separate will still be there to learn and a partial grade for
>> one day will not destroy their GPA.
>>
>> One key to making this work well is to stay on top of the noise
>> level 100% of the time and stick to your word. Don't ever allow
>> the majority of the students to break the rule or you're right
>> back where you started. Make your expectation your focus or it
>> won't be an expectation. If you need to remind them with a
>> warning, follow through with the separation on the next student to
>> act up. This puts you in control of the situation and keeps the
>> problem out of the principal's office. The students are focused
>> and you are doing what you are supposed to do-teach.
>>
>> Steve

Share This Post | Report This Post

Next Post >>

Posts on this thread, including this one