Re: Ticked off
Posted by Blake T. on 3/11/08

You might want to look into some form of anger management/therapy. Your current
state can't be to healthy for you or those around you. Please tell me you do not
work directly with students?


On 3/11/08, Ticked off wrote:
> On 3/11/08, You are wrong on your info. Experience is the answer. wrote:
>> Not sure where you taught in GA, or where you got your "facts" but here is
>> the accurate information for Gwinnett:
>>
>> - We received a 30&37; pay raise coming from a strong union state in the
>> Midwest.
>
> Not Michigan! Which you might notice, this is the MICHIGAN chat-board. Which
> state? The midwest is a big place. There isn't a "strong union state" that
> has its average teacher pay ranked #39, which was what you said. I get that
> information from the NEA's survey of teacher salaries.
>
>>
>> - Our benefits are the same with the exception of our kids ortho is paid
>> here, and prescriptions ar $30/month for non-generics.
>
> Your benefits are not the same as mine. I've looked over your benefits on the
> Gwinnet Georgia website. I have a PPO with a $10 copay for both my wife and
> myself. Everything else is 100 percent covered, no out of pocket. NOTHING
> comes out of my paycheck for the plan. You don't have that, I've checked.
> For a plan as good as mine, you'd have quite a chunk come out of your pay.
>>
>> - My former district, in our union state, prided itself on the fact that it
>> hadn't built a new elementary school in over 100 years (Just additions).
>> Gwinnett has built 32 in the last four years. (So much for the better
>> resources.) How do you think these schools, and the new 1600 teachers every
>> year, are paid for if you don't have the resources?
>
> And this affects me how? First off Michigan doesn't have school districts
> nearly as big as Georgia does. You seem to divide by county. Macomb county,
> where I work has a couple dozen districts, so its highly unlikely one district
> would ever HAVE 32 schools, much less build so many in 4 years. I'm looking
> for resources to go to ME and my classroom, and of course my paycheck and
> benefits, not building a vast array of schools.
>
> Secondly, I personally don't want to work in a booming, expanding school
> district. Yeah, there are a bunch of new buildings, great! There are also a
> bunch of new teachers and administrators. The "veteran" teacher in the
> building could have 5 years on and the administrators don't know what they're
> doing. This is how it is in Las Vegas, and friends of mine hate teaching out
> there for just that reason!
>
> I'm looking out for me and my career. I want to work with seasoned
> professionals who are competent. I want there to be a slow trickle of new
> teachers who can be mentored by a large body of competent, long-term
> teachers. Just me...
>>
>> -Gwinnett over hired by 200 teachers mainly due to the economy and housing
>> slump. Fortunately, all 200 were still employed by the district as they had
>> signed contracts, and will be given the opportunitty to sign again this year.
>
> Don't care...
>
>> -Our taxes in the Midwest were $4,000. On a more expensive house in GA our
>> taxes are $1700.
>
> OK, but I still make WAY more money than a teacher in that district. I make
> almost $80K where I would make $50K with the same experience. I'm not a math
> teacher, but I don't have to be to figure out that $30 more in salary is
> better than saving $2300 in taxes.
>
>>
>> -Thanks to the Hope Scholarship, we will save over $100,000 sending our
>> three kids to college tuition free. Again, so much for the better resources.
>>
> I don't have kids now anyway, so again... don't care. Even if I did, I'd
> still be better off because over the long haul, the $30K more per year that I
> make would easily outpace that $100,000.
>
>> - Finally, you have little or no knowledge of working within union
>> leadership. I have worked with both with the Teamsters (UPS), and NEA
>> during my 20+ year career. I have seen things 99&37; of the general
> membership
>> has never seen, and I am disgusted with myself for being part of that. The
>> last straw was allowing a self-admitted pedophile keep his job and
>> eventually become union president. This was just one of hundreds of deals
>> we made that I am not proud of. This is not isolated union activity, it is
>> stnadard operating procedure. We moved to Georgia following that incident.
>
> I can't say anything about the Teamsters or UPS. I am not interested in what
> package handlers or truck drivers do or don't do. I really don't care about
> the whole pedophile thing because that has nothing to do with my paycheck or
> benefits! I make more money than you and have better benefits. Thats whats
> important to me at the end of the day!
>
> BTW, thats what union leadership is supposed to do my friend! They're
> supposed to take care of the dirty work so the rest of us just pay our dues
> and cash our checks. This is why union officers get paid salaries and have
> release time to take care of this. If you don't like it, fine you left.
> Great! Doesn't sound like your union got you much anyway, since you're so
> sure you make more in a RTW state.
>
> Fact is, a great many of those Michigan teachers who went down to your GA
> district would move back in a second if they got offered a Michigan job
> because pay, benefits, and TENURE are so much better up here. You can talk
> about some obscure pedophile case all you want. I can tell my boss to stick
> it if he wants me to pursue some hairbrained strategy that'll be ridiculed in
> 3 years. You can't. I can't really be fired, as long as I do my job. You
> can. You can claim they're great in GA, but they're not!
>
>>
>>
>> As with every state, there are good and bad places to teach. Making
>> sterotypical statements about an area or it's residents, especially when you
>> are short on facts, does not enhance your professional status. It does make
>> you seem small,and ignorant.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 3/10/08, Marie wrote:
>>> taught in GA for 12 years, probably longer than you've lived there.
>>> Unions states have better pay, benefits, resources and working
>>> conditions. This is something you cannot dispute, they are facts. I've
>>> never taught in Gwinnett County like Missing MI has but things are better
>>> here as far as benefits and working conditions. Just because you built a
>>> bunch of new schools doesn't mean you have a good district it just means
>>> you have an influx of people coming to that area, that's all it means.
>>> And didn't Gwinnett lay off teachers because they hired too many? I'd
>>> rather be living in GA right now but you cannot dispute that working
>>> conditions are better here. And not every county pays what your county
>>> pays. You could teach in other worse places, like the Carolina's but if
>>> you are comparing GA to MI, there is no comparison, working here is better
>>> than working there. The only bad thing, you have to pay a lot of $$ in
>>> union dues. But you have job security so there ya go.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 3/10/08, Try again to get it right please. wrote:
>>>> I'll ask the same question again that you seem to avoid.
>>>> Exactly how many years have you taught in Georgia/South since you are
>>>> such a fountain of knowledge on the subject???
>>>>
>>>> Yes, that is what I thought, you haven't. Let me help dispel your
>>>> ignorance. Stupidity is not a positive attribute.
>>>>
>>>> -We hired 1600 teachers in our district last year due to increasing
>>>> enrollments(6,000 new students/year, guess a lot of families like it
>>>> here). Our teacher retention rate exceeds 94 percent. I would hazard a
>>>> guess our DISTRICT hired more techers than the STATE of Michigan last
>>>> year.
>>>>
>>>> -We've built 32 new schools in our district in the last four years. All
>>>> were paid for prior to construction, no bonds, referendums, etc.
>>>>
>>>> -You have the option to join unions here in Georgia including the NEA.
>>>>
>>>> -Newsweek ranked the top 500 high schools in the nation. Our district
>>>> had 6 on the list. That was more than the STATE of Michigan.
>>>>
>>>> -My son's three AP courses are taught by three Phd's. His high school
>>>> has over a dozen. How many do you have???
>>>>
>>>> -Our pay scale is $40,000 to $85,000, and the cost of living is half of
>>>> what it is in Michigan.
>>>>
>>>> -CNN, Fortune Magazine, and Better Living Magazine, ranked this area as
>>>> number four on it's "Top Ten Best Places to live in the U.S."
>>>>
>>>> -No snow, beautiful islands on the coast,mountains, history, etc.
>>>>
>>>> Yes,it was a terrible mistake for the hundreds of Michigan teachers who
>>>> have to suffer under these conditions. Now don't you feel kind of
>>>> silly?? That's ok, we have room for you too!! That's part of the
>>>> Southern Hospitality!!
>>>>
>>>> Oops, Did I forget mention that ALL Georgia graduating seniors with a
>>>> 3.00 gpa can go college tuition free??
>>>>
>>>> What a terrible place to live.lol
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 3/09/08, ticked off in Michigan wrote:
>>>>> On 3/09/08, trey wrote:
>>>>>> Your defense of Missing
>>>>>> Michigan, who has been asked to stay off the Michigan and Georgia
>>>>>> boards by her peers, with your small-minded, angry, disjointed,
>>>>>> ramblings, only makes you appear very much like her.
>>>>>
>>>>> Again, since you've quoted my post at the end of yours, you obviously
>>>>> can't be bothered to look at the name. I'm not "Missing Michigan."
>>>>>
>>>>> I am a teacher in Michigan who doesn't like the "southernization" of
>>>> his
>>>>> state's tenure and union laws. I don't care anything about Georgia,
>>>>> except that some are trying to bring Georgia's mistreatment of teachers
>>>>> to my part of the country. And, I despise the "do it for the children"
>>>>> argument some, usually ineffective teachers make when we try to gain
>>>> the
>>>>> benefits, pay, and treatment we deserve. As I pointed out, students
>>>>> benefit when they have professional teachers who feel valued with good
>>>>> compensation. The usually do not benefit when they have gushing
>>>>> charity-work-types teaching them because while they mean well, they
>>>>> can't teach very well!
>>>>>
>>>>> If this "Missing MI" moved from Michigan to Georgia, he/she made a BAD
>>>>> choice, and it sounds like they know it. However, with the MI economy
>>>>> how it is, they were probably laid-off and had no chance of getting
>>>>> another job in MI, so they made the best of a bad situation. Missing MI
>>>>> might try some of the other areas that treat teachers a bit better.
>>>> New
>>>>> England, NY, and Illinois all have good or decent pay, tenure, etc. I
>>>>> have some friends out there in each of these areas. They aren't "hot to
>>>>> hire" like they are in Georgia, because they can hold onto their
>>>>> teachers and people WANT to teach there, not just settle. However,
>>>>> these areas, for the most part, are better than MI economically and
>>>>> there are SOME jobs, though not enough.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 3/09/08, i will defend missing mi wrote:
>>>>>>> I agree with almost everything Missing MI says....Teachers are made
>>>>>>> to feel that if they are paycheck to paycheck, lunch
>>>>>>> babysitters "that they got what they asked for" by getting into
>>>>>>> this profession. Teachers down South are rarely treated with
>>>>>>> respect. I work at a charter school in MI and mommies don't come
>>>>>>> into help, we have to eat with our kids. I'm sorry but that
>>>>>>> doesn't benefit the kids to have a teacher that hasn't had any
>>>>>>> relief time. Teachers need a break, ask someone "How do you feel
>>>>>>> about having 25 five year olds from 8-3 everyday?" They will get a
>>>>>>> priceless look on their face and probably say "No thanks" so while
>>>>>>> Missing MI complains she has some good points that some people just
>>>>>>> don't understand. We are professionals and why some of you have
>>>>>>> lowered your standards I don't know. To Missing MI: you have valid
>>>>>>> points and I agree whole heartedly with you, but my suggestion,
>>>>>>> when people get on here, don't say "move out of michigan" that
>>>>>>> seems to be your answer for everything, i guess just don't be rude
>>>>>>> and be a little more sensitive to other people's situations.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 3/09/08, Ticked off PROFESSIONAL wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 3/08/08, Teacher wrote:
>>>>>>>>> We can talk about how teachers are
>>>>>>>>> not paid like professionals and all the stuff we have to put up
>>>>>>>>> with all night long....but the reason we choose this job is
>>>>>>>>> because we want to make a difference in the lives of kids.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I absolutely hate this arguement. Its so flawed and full of crap!
>>>>>>>> How dare you presume to know why I, or anyone else, went into
>>>>>>>> teaching.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In no profession is there a universal reason why everyone went
>>>>>>>> into the profession. This includes teaching. Some cops, for
>>>>>>>> instance, went into their field because they had an intrinsic,
>>>>>>>> altruistic motivation to help people and fight crime. Others went
>>>>>>>> in because they like uniforms and think carrying a gun is cool.
>>>>>>>> Now that doesn't mean that the uniform/gun guy isn't a great cop,
>>>>>>>> and that the "help people" guy is off the force in a year.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Its the same thing in our field. Some went in for all the
>>>>>>>> intrinsic, "save-the-world" stuff, and some like me wanted a
>>>>>>>> steady job with decent pay, benefits, retirement, and summers off.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Now guess what?? I'm a freaking great teacher! I've never had
>>>>>>>> anything under an "Excellent" evaluation, even on my first year.
>>>>>>>> I teach sped and have taken kids who at 15 can't read, can't even
>>>>>>>> start the Gates-MacGinitie, and taken them to reading at the 8th
>>>>>>>> grade level by the time they're 18. I've had parents cry in my
>>>>>>>> office in gratitude. Yeah, I've had my failures, but I'd take my
>>>>>>>> 8 years of teaching, stack it up against everyone else, and
>>>>>>>> guarantee you I'm well above average in the "making a difference"
>>>>>>>> catagory.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Guess what? Many of the people who started with me who were going
>>>>>>>> to help every child and save the world are not teaching anymore!
>>>>>>>> They realized they can't save the world in a high school, and that
>>>>>>>> they can't impact every single kid, so they got frustrated and
>>>>>>>> left!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Don't you dare say teachers who have the backbone to demand decent
>>>>>>>> treatment and wages aren't good at their job! Not wanting to
>>>>>>>> watch kids at lunch doesn't make us bad teachers! It makes us bad
>>>>>>>> cafeteria employees, but certainly not bad teachers! My not
>>>>>>>> wanting to watch kids throw fries at each other, FOR NO PAY, does
>>>>>>>> not make me uncaring. It just means I have some self respect for
>>>>>>>> myself and my profession.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In my experience, the bleeding hearts are crying in the teaching
>>>>>>>> lounge because some kid told him/her to F-off, while the more
>>>>>>>> pragmatic of us would brush that off and teach. When people feel
>>>>>>>> valued as professionals, they put forth a good effort and expect
>>>>>>>> fair treatment and compensation back. Thats a good system! When
>>>>>>>> people feel like they're doing charity work, they loose their
>>>>>>>> enthusiasm when they realize the streets aren't paved with gold
>>>>>>>> and eventually quit. You want volunteers teaching kids? People
>>>>>>>> pure of heart? Then have a bunch of mommies come in to donate
>>>>>>>> their time and see how well they teach. See how long they keep
>>>>>>>> coming in too!
>>>>>>>>

Posts on this thread, including this one

• Leaving Michigan, 3/07/08, by Northern Grad.
• Re: Leaving Michigan, 3/07/08, by Chicagomark.
• Re: Leaving Michigan, 3/07/08, by Missing MI.
• Re: Grand Rapids?, 3/08/08, by Torn.
• Re: Missing Michigan, 3/08/08, by Teacher.
• Re: Missing Michigan, 3/08/08, by In Defense.
• Re: Grand Rapids?, 3/08/08, by Grand rapids public has not settled contract yet.
• Re: Missing Michigan, 3/08/08, by You have some shallow standards..
• Re: Missing Michigan, 3/08/08, by CJC.
• Re: Missing Michigan, 3/09/08, by Ticked off PROFESSIONAL.
• Re: Missing Michigan, 3/09/08, by i will defend missing mi.
• Re: Your sterotypes make you look very small!, 3/09/08, by trey.
• Re: Your sterotypes make you look very small!, 3/09/08, by Marie.
• Re: Missing Michigan, 3/09/08, by Ticked off....
• Re: Your sterotypes make you look very small!, 3/09/08, by ticked off in Michigan.
• Re: Your sterotypes make you look very small!, 3/10/08, by Try again to get it right please..
• Re: Your sterotypes make you look very small!, 3/10/08, by Actually I can compare...
• Re: to TICKED OFF!, 3/10/08, by Teacher.
• Re: Your sterotypes make you look very small!, 3/10/08, by Marie.
• Re: Your sterotypes make you look very small!, 3/10/08, by Ticked off!!!.
• Re: Your sterotypes make you look very small!, 3/11/08, by You are wrong on your info. Experience is the answer..
• Re: Your sterotypes make you look very small!, 3/11/08, by Ticked off.
• Re: Ticked off, 3/11/08, by Blake T..
• Re: Your sterotypes make you look very small!, 3/13/08, by goldy.
• Re: The guy from GA is a pain!!, 3/13/08, by Missing MI.
• Re: I love you, Ticked Off!!, 3/13/08, by Missing MI.
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/14/08, by Older Teacher.
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/16/08, by Missing MI.
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/16/08, by You Win.
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/17/08, by ....
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/18/08, by Missing MI.
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/18/08, by ....
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/18/08, by Mark.
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/18/08, by Missing MI.
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/19/08, by ....
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/19/08, by Mark.
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/19/08, by Me.
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/20/08, by ....
• Re: Another Perspective, 3/20/08, by mark.
• Re: Leaving Michigan, 5/06/08, by Michelle.

 
 
 

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