First size. Class sizes will be held to 17 kids per teacher. The class that they would put her in will have only 10 (6-8th gr) total. She is coming from a very small school with only 20 per grade, the public school, also 7- 12, will have 350 per grade. This is all good, but because of its size, it doesn’t offer any extracurricular activities. Right now my daughter is really excited about tennis which she signed up for, and is really upset about giving it up, BUT she is very tiny and unathletic and hates to exercise and we had already made the decision not to spend any really money on supplies till she made it past the first week. So in other words, I don’t want to base the decision on sports which may last only a week or year. She will however truly miss being in the theater and speech clubs.
PROJECT BASED—The school is project based. This idea intrigues my husband and I and makes us nervous. DD is gifted; she has been accelerated three years in math and one year in everything else. The public school says they do acceleration by the teachers giving some type of packet to the GT kids who want it. So far they have not let us see any of these. Nor are the GT kids grouped together in anyway. We are not sure if the project based theme will be good for her. She gets really good grades, but except for in math, DD tends to putz in school, she never gets in any real trouble but doesn’t have a good attitude and is constantly daydreaming, reading or scribbling in a notebook. In 5th and 6th grade, she found out what the minimum was expected for a half way decent grade and did that. This was a drastic achievement over 4th where, trying to pretend she wasn’t smart, she did the bare minimum to pass. My husband and I are worried whether or not she is a good candidate for project based schooling. He is worried because ever since 3rd grade, she has not been self directed at all and that is what this school aims for.
By the way, she will know nobody at the charter school and know only 3 girls at the public. She is not really friends with any of them and didn’t even wave at them when we saw two of them in the mall. Yet one of the major reasons she says she wants to go to public is because she has friends there.
I am terrible confused and we have to make a decision basically by tomorrow, Monday at the absolute latest. There is one other option, the charter school starts Monday, but the public doesn’t start till the 10th. My husband and I thought a trial week might be a good idea.
Please any feedback would be appreciated. What do you know about project based schools? Can you think on any questions to ask tomorrow when I take my husband back to tour the school? And is a trial week a good idea? If so any ideas how I can get my daughter to see it as a unique opportunity rather than losing her last week of vacation.
While a middle schooler should certainly have input into which school is chosen, it would be a very rare one indeed who would have the wisdom and maturity to choose well.
Parents have to make these decisions, not leave the raising of the children entirely up to the children.
That said, there is no real advantage to asking for advice here, as every school, every class, and every child is different. The differences matter in making the choice, and we don't have any of the information needed to help make the decision. The parents may feel that they don't have enough information (and maybe they don't), but they have more than anyone else.
Spending some time at each of the schools to find out how things work there can be valuable, but a lot comes down to the teachers and students who are in the particular classes that the child takes, and that is often impossible to predict.
> My husband and I find ourselves faced with a unexpected > decision, whether to send our daughter to a charter school > or to the local junior high. Today I was driving I n a > part of town I normally am not in. I saw one of the old > Catholic schools with huge banners waving announcing school > tours, grades 6-12, free tuition. Thinking it was a new > school in town, I went in to check it out. It turns out it > was charter school that I thought was located way outside > of town, not only has its location changed it now has > busing, suddenly making it a viable option for us. We now > have to make a quick decision because school starts Monday. > > First size. Class sizes will be held to 17 kids per > teacher. The class that they would put her in will have > only 10 (6-8th gr) total. She is coming from a very small > school with only 20 per grade, the public school, also 7- > 12, will have 350 per grade. This is all good, but because > of its size, it doesn’t offer any extracurricular > activities. Right now my daughter is really excited about > tennis which she signed up for, and is really upset about > giving it up, BUT she is very tiny and unathletic and hates > to exercise and we had already made the decision not to > spend any really money on supplies till she made it past > the first week. So in other words, I don’t want to base > the decision on sports which may last only a week or year. > She will however truly miss being in the theater and speech > clubs. > > PROJECT BASED—The school is project based. This idea > intrigues my husband and I and makes us nervous. DD is > gifted; she has been accelerated three years in math and > one year in everything else. The public school says they > do acceleration by the teachers giving some type of packet > to the GT kids who want it. So far they have not let us > see any of these. Nor are the GT kids grouped together in > anyway. We are not sure if the > project based theme will be good for her. She gets really > good grades, but except for in math, DD tends to putz in > school, she never gets in any real trouble but doesn’t have > a good attitude and is constantly daydreaming, reading or > scribbling in a notebook. In 5th and 6th grade, she found > out what the minimum was expected for a half way decent > grade and did that. This was a drastic achievement over > 4th where, trying to pretend she wasn’t smart, she did the > bare minimum to pass. My husband and I are > worried whether or not she is a good candidate for project > based schooling. He is worried because ever since 3rd > grade, she has not been self directed at all and that is > what this school aims for. > > By the way, she will know nobody at the charter school and > know only 3 girls at the public. She is not really friends > with any of them and didn’t even wave at them when we saw > two of them in the mall. Yet one of the major reasons she > says she wants to go to public is because she has friends > there. > > I am terrible confused and we have to make a decision > basically by tomorrow, Monday at the absolute latest. > There is one other option, the charter school starts > Monday, but the public doesn’t start till the 10th. My > husband and I thought a trial week might be a good idea. > > Please any feedback would be appreciated. What do you > know about project based schools? Can you think on any > questions to ask tomorrow when I take my husband back to > tour the school? And is a trial week a good idea? If so > any ideas how I can get my daughter to see it as a unique > opportunity rather than losing her last week of vacation.
JulianaOn 9/10/09, Mary T wrote: > GT Teacher: > > We live in a world that measures us by our performance. My students > are measured that way, I'm measured that way, and I want my > daughter's school to care about helping her score as high as possible > on high stakes tests. > > I've looked at the data on my students and can see t...See MoreOn 9/10/09, Mary T wrote: > GT Teacher: > > We live in a world that measures us by our performance. My students > are measured that way, I'm measured that way, and I want my > daughter's school to care about helping her score as high as possible > on high stakes tests. > > I've looked at the data on my students and can see that hands down, > they scored worse with me after a year of all-day pull-out than they > did when I pulled them for only their subject and didn't put them in > one large group of reading-gifted, math-gifted, and nonverbal-gifted. > To ignore that because they had fun in my class isn't really helping > them develop their gifts. It's not helping them with their > social-emotional needs when they feel bad after scoring lower than > they had expected; it's not demonstrating to anyone that they've > advanced in math or reading; it's leaving them possibly unprepared > for the next grade's expectations; and it will not foster in them a > sense of "I'm a winner and good at tests," which is a crucial > component when it comes time for scholarship-tied tests such as the > PSAT and the SAT.
Okay, what kinds of differences in scores are we talking about? And what kind of test? What kind of scores do you assume they should be getting, and what kind of scores are they getting? Is it possible that you're seeing score drops that look significant on paper, but that could really be within the range of normal variation, or related much more to the variance in test design than the students' real level of understanding? (I realize you may have thought of all this already, but I'm just trying to brainstorm.) Did students who *weren't* in the gifted program have similar score drops between one year and the next?
> > Okay, what kinds of differences in scores are we talking about? And what > kind of test? What kind of scores do you assume they should be getting, > and what kind of scores are they getting? Is it possible that you're > seeing score drops that look significant on paper, but that could really > be within the range of normal variation, or related much more to the > variance in test design than the students' real level of understanding? > (I realize you may have thought of all this already, but I'm just trying > to brainstorm.) Did students who *weren't* in the gifted program have > similar score drops between one year and the next? >
These are end of the year tests that our state requires. There's a set number of points that tells you year's growth. What I saw with 10 children is that in 9 cases scores dropped. Where before the ten had grown 1.5 years, based on points, last year they fell 1 year. So that's a net gain of a half-year's growth over two years, which is a sad showing. I know it's a shame we have to care so much about test scores. I have tried repeatedly to downplay them, but I know that two years ago, when we made growth, I had worked harder and in a more focused way on upping their skills. When given the freedom to do what I wanted last year, we did powerpoints and writing. The gains from these activities will pop up somewhere in the future I'm sure but in the meantime, down went their scores in what the state wanted them to learn last year.
That's a good point you make about the whole grade's performance. I'll have to go back and study that. I suspect there was a general decline, which would make me feel a tad better. But I'm still thinking a sustained focus, however against my natural inclination, is the way to go.
I have a group of six fourth graders who've shown that they've mastered fourth grade math. Wouldn't it be best to skip them to 5th grade math, rather than offering enrichment only? Are there any down sides to that?
Worry more ab...See MoreOn 9/04/09, NJ wrote: > Thanks for this, Michelle. I do worry about the long view, but as > long as there is clear communication across the grades, it > should be OK. How did these students perform on their > grade-level state tests? Did they have to review any skills prior > to taking the tests? Thanks again!
Worry more about their current needs in math, rather than holding them back because of potential future problems. Be upfront with the parents if you think there may be problems down the road, so that they can prepare (by talking with other schools or arranging for transportation, for example), but don't deny the kids an appropriate education now, because there might be some difficulty doing so in future
When we went to enroll her in 7th grade last night, the principal was concerned about our decision to put her in Algebra. He said her NWEA scores were not as high as those students who are normally placed in the enriched Algebra Class. We asked about her being placed in the regular, non enriched class. He said our choices we either the enriched Pre-Algebra or the enriched Algebra class. Apparently once you are in a "track" you stay in it.
The other classes (English, Soc St. and Science) do not start their enriched sections untill the 2nd quarter, the idea being to get the kids used to junior high first.
Math was actually DD's lowest test area. Her scores were still very high in it (working three grades above) just that her other scores were higher. Math is also not her favorite area, The other three areas are. Even though math was her lowest area, it was the only one that she recieved any acceleration/modification/differentiation in.
My husband and I don't know whether to keep her in the enriched Algebra class or put her in the enriched Pre- Algebra class? I am afraid that if she fails at it and they switch her down in 3-4 weeks, she will be afraid or unwilling to try any of the other enrichment assignments. We haven't seen these enrichment packets, so can not yet judge their value or if they will actually happen. So we are nervous about turning down the one accleleration she has actually been given in exchange for these promised accleration packets. She will refuse to do them if they are additional work not work in lieu of.
I am open to any thoughts or suggestions. School does not start till the 10th, so I still have some time. By the way I am planning on taking DD on Tuesday and seeing if we can view the enriched preAlgebra book, that will at least give us alittle more info. Does anyone have any idea what they are talking about for these enrichment packets?
JanetteI'm certainly not a middle school math teacher, but given what you've told us about your daughter I would put her in the Algebra class, even if she struggles a little. Sounds like the rest of her schedule won't be much of a challenge.
It is so much better that she learn this confidence now, rather than avoid the discomfort of the challenge in a subject that isn't her favorite. That "track" can lead to calculus and physics, while the other may not. She might not ever need calculus and physics, but maybe down the road she will look back and know she could have done it if she had pushed herself, and wonder why she didn't, and what else she might have been able to do.
I don't think frustration with that is likely to spill over into other enrichment areas. I think the key is maintaining a mindset that math can be fun and that it isn't beyond her, rather than letting her gravitate toward favorites.
On 9/03/09, 7th grade parent wrote: > Last year DD was in a small pullout gifted math class. > According to the teacher, they covered Pre-Algebra and the > last two months of the year they were working on Algebra. > > When we went to enroll her in 7th grade last night, the > principal was concerned about our decision to put her in > Algebra. He said her NWEA scores were not as high as those > students who are normally placed in the enriched Algebra > Class. We asked about her being placed in the regular, non > enriched class. He said our choices we either the enriched > Pre-Algebra or the enriched Algebra class. Apparently once > you are in a "track" you stay in it. > > The other classes (English, Soc St. and Science) do not > start their enriched sections untill the 2nd quarter, the > idea being to get the kids used to junior high first. > > Math was actually DD's lowest test area. Her scores were > still very high in it (working three grades above) just > that her other scores were higher. Math is also not her > favorite area, The other three areas are. Even though math > was her lowest area, it was the only one that she recieved > any acceleration/modification/differentiation in. > > My husband and I don't know whether to keep her in the > enriched Algebra class or put her in the enriched Pre- > Algebra class? I am afraid that if she fails at it and > they switch her down in 3-4 weeks, she will be afraid or > unwilling to try any of the other enrichment assignments. > We haven't seen these enrichment packets, so can not yet > judge their value or if they will actually happen. So we > are nervous about turning down the one accleleration she > has actually been given in exchange for these promised > accleration packets. She will refuse to do them if they > are additional work not work in lieu of. > > I am open to any thoughts or suggestions. School does not > start till the 10th, so I still have some time. By the way > I am planning on taking DD on Tuesday and seeing if we can > view the enriched preAlgebra book, that will at least give > us alittle more info. Does anyone have any idea what they > are talking about for these enrichment packets? > > Thank you
The K class has 24 students, with 2 adults for most of the day. There are no direct GT services for kindergarten. The child does have an IEP with a teacher on consult, but since the teacher doesn't teach young children, she's not providing many suggestions, either.
I think that the gap between what we want to create and what we actually create is always going to be there at some level but that with mediums like ink you don't get to hide the process as well, and that it is especially frustrating when developmentally your motor skills aren't quite there yet.
So maybe you can talk about the end product not being that day's finished product but what she'll be able to do six months from now? Maybe you can ask her to suspend judgement, at least partially until a few weeks go by? That or get her a medium where earlier attempts are completely hidden, like those magnetic screens.
And maybe you can talk about learning patience, that patience is something we have to learn about just like we have to learn how to write.
It is a lot harder for me to learn to be patient than it was to learn to write. I'm still learning to be patient.
> On 9/04/09, Donna music/TN wrote: >> Does anyone have any suggestions for helping a GT kinder, >> who is performing at an advanced level on writing and >> drawing tasks, but is getting extremely frustrated due to >> her work not being up to her personal standards? The class >> is doing Kidwriting, and she shuts down the second a letter >> isn't written correctly (IE, the second it doesn't look >> exactly like the one on the wall), a word isn't spelled >> correctly (she will not accept phonetic spelling or a magic >> line-if it doesn't "look right" after she's written it, she >> gets very upset), or when her drawings don't match the >> picture in her mind. She also doesn't want to dictate to an >> adult because "I can do this". Her handwriting is actually >> very good for her age, and her pictures have a lot of >> detail. Her vocabulary and sentence structure are amazing. >> We have tried encouraging her to tell her story into a >> recorder or typing it, but she's very concerned about it not >> being fair. >> >> The K class has 24 students, with 2 adults for most of the >> day. There are no direct GT services for kindergarten. The >> child does have an IEP with a teacher on consult, but since >> the teacher doesn't teach young children, she's not >> providing many suggestions, either. >> >> >>
I am teaching a fourth grade gifted cluster, with several students who are below grade level. I need to create a station for prefixes -ly and -y. Is it appropriate differentiation to have the gifted students work on a variety of suffixes instead of just the ones mandated in the basal?
Minor point: -ly and -y are *suffixes* not *prefixes*. How do you teach a gifted cluster together with several kids below grade level? It seems that both groups must be getting shortchanged on teacher time, since there is so little that would be appropriate for both
...See MoreOn 9/07/09, Rosie wrote: > I am teaching a fourth grade gifted cluster, with several > students who are below grade level. I need to create a > station for prefixes -ly and -y. Is it appropriate > differentiation to have the gifted students work on a > variety of suffixes instead of just the ones mandated in the > basal?
I don't have a good answer, but a very nice lead-in would be this (extremely short, quite funny) Electric Company piece by Tom Lehrer: [link removed]
lease ALL teachers if you have a word document attachment of a lesson plan schdeule that looks very good.please send me it as a email to [email removed]
Thanks! (Never be a copier be your self you will get more places if you do!)
My students will have no time conflicts, as they can attend school 24 hours a day, seven days a week. Transportation also shouldn't be too much of an issue. So, any feedback for ideas for projects, contacts who would be helpful, websites, organizations, etc. is welcome :)
I need to create or find this type of thing for grades 3-6. We are going to try to focus our efforts on science topics in order to supplement some of what is lacking in class due to the NCLB focus on improving reading & math scores. Any help you can give will be greatly appreciated.
On 9/21/09, Caitlin wrote: > I have been put into the Interventions job at my school. > So I mainly work with & schedule the approaching kids for > help in reading & math. But as in so many other schools, I > am also in charge of trying to implement our GT program. I > am attempting to put together a testing/evaluating system > at our school that I can accomplish in between organizing & > teaching the intervention classes. One assessment > measurement that is on our plan is writing samples. Are > there specific kinds of writing samples programs generally > use to evaluate students' abilities? > > I need to create or find this type of thing for grades 3-6. > We are going to try to focus our efforts on science topics > in order to supplement some of what is lacking in class due > to the NCLB focus on improving reading & math scores. Any > help you can give will be greatly appreciated.
Does anyone have info about their state's policy on middle school kids earning credit for taking classes in high school? Several of my students take advanced math at the HS; they're only in 7th grade. The HS principal says they are not earning credit, though. Is that normal? I don't think it makes sense....I'd love to hear others' thoughts.
kelseyOn 9/23/09, Sara wrote: > It doesn't make any sense but in my state at least the laws are > set up to make earning any extra high school credits very hard. > The point of high school for the masses was in its origins in > the Great Depression was to hold kids in school and keep them > out of the job market where they'd compete for th...See MoreOn 9/23/09, Sara wrote: > It doesn't make any sense but in my state at least the laws are > set up to make earning any extra high school credits very hard. > The point of high school for the masses was in its origins in > the Great Depression was to hold kids in school and keep them > out of the job market where they'd compete for the few jobs > there were. > > If our Middle Schoolers take two years of a language in Middle > School, our high school will allow them to move to French 2, > Spanish 2 etc but no high school credit is given and two years > of language at the high school are still required. In fact, here > many diligent students go into their senior year with ALL the > credits they need to graduate but the law mandates a 4th year of > Literature that MUST be taken in the 4th year and Cannot be > taken early or in the summer. > > Does that make sense?? > See Florida for a model program of allowing talented students to > accelerate through their education and even earning college > credits while still secondary students. More states should be > following Florida's lead. > > >> On 9/22/09, elaine wrote: >>> Does anyone have info about their state's policy on middle >>> school kids earning credit for taking classes in high >>> school? Several of my students take advanced math at the >>> HS; they're only in 7th grade. The HS principal says they >>> are not earning credit, though. Is that normal? I don't >>> think it makes sense....I'd love to hear others' thoughts. >> >> Most places I've heard of do not give high school credit for >> middle school students, even if they are in Algebra 2 or >> Calculus. As long as the high school pays for the students to >> take college classes while they are in high school, it isn't a >> big deal. If the high school can't offer them math at their >> level, and the universities require a certain number of years >> of math in high school, it can cause problems
Ok i am a high school student in TX. and i completely disagree with that whole statement. Some students NEED to graduate early, not just because they want to but because they already have a lot of responsiblities. Unlike in your day (im guessing your older with the way you make this all sound) We work a lot harder and learn A LOT more! and some of us have homes that we need to get out of, so yes regularly thats a very good statement you made. But some students do NEED to graduate early. And it would actually help the economy because the more money we have flowing in this nation the better.
While a middle schooler should certainly have input into which school is chosen, it would be a very rare one indeed who would have the wisdom and maturity to choose well.
Parents have to make these decisions, not leave the raising...See More