Benefits

Join Teachers.Net

Chatboards

Recent Groups

Teachers Abroad

MEMBERS

18 Members

+ Join Group

Pinned Posts

ALLAll Teachers

Teachers.Net LIVE CHAT Support group - Tues eve!

Featured Jobs

Full-timeMontessori Teacher

Maple Ridge, British Columbia, Canada

TemporaryTeachers, rural schools

Peace River North School District

Full-timeHead Teacher: 2nd/3rd Grades – Mills College Children’s School

Mills College

Teaching Jobs on Teachers.Net

Featured Job special only $39!

https://teachers.net/jobs

Become a Teachers.Net sponsor!

Teachers Abroad Chatboard

Benefits

by Randall

Jan 2, 2011

I am interested in teaching overseas. For the last year and a half, I have been looking on-line for information on "Benefits" these schools offer. I find a bit of this and a smattering of that. Is there one place to look for the "Benefit Packages" these overseas schools offer? Do you advise a prospect contact a school directly asking for the "complete benefit package? Thanks for any help!

Comment

(26)

report post

view previous comments

Dave -> Mary It's actually easier to obtain test materials and sample kits overseas. Just about every publisher in Tests and Measures, and measurements yearbook has a distributor/publisher in the regional area (U.K. for europe, and H.K. for Asia). Secondly, from a practical standpoint most international schools being private don't spend a lot on psychometrics. ...See MoreIt's actually easier to obtain test materials and sample kits overseas. Just about every publisher in Tests and Measures, and measurements yearbook has a distributor/publisher in the regional area (U.K. for europe, and H.K. for Asia). Secondly, from a practical standpoint most international schools being private don't spend a lot on psychometrics. They usually have a sample kit, and they photo copy what they need, with the School Psy./Counselor hand scoring them. You have probabley noticed that most international schools post or advertise their Counselor/Psyc. position as a combined position. The reality is they just don't do a lot of testing. Most admins are familiar with I.Q. tests as measures of cognitive ability so you'll see the Wunderlich or the Stanford-Binnett (and its likely to be an old sample kit). You'll see the Strong Inventory (if its upper secondary), and probabley one of the depression/emotional disturbance assessments, thats about it. Most of a School Psy's duties will be those of a Counselor.

On 1/04/11, Mary wrote: > I am not sure whether you want my opinion, but I think if you are > READY to get your application out there, it is worth the $200 for SA > and the $25 for International Schools Review. Even if you are not > ready, it is worth the $25 for ISR. > > As for DoDDS vs International Schools and the support issue, I am > coming from a family standpoint and not as a single adult. The > military has the evacuation protocol, supports for finding housing, > etc. However, I understand that there are some very supportive > international schools as well. > > in my field as a school psychologist, I think that ethically, I > should be working with someone at least within the same system who > can order the testing materials. I can do the the assessments, > consultation, etc., but, only those with PhDs in psychology can order > the materials. If an international school system already has this > part worked out, I would be interested, but I don't want to apply for > a position where I cannot work to my potential and using old > materials and not being able order testing protocols would not work > for me. > > I have continued to see international schools posting vacancies on > the NASP website, so I don't think I will need tojoing Search > Associates, but it seems to be worth it for teachers. > > On 1/03/11, Randall wrote: >> So having Dave and Debbie and Thomas chime in.... the answer is >> pay the money for the information?? >> >> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Debbie wrote: >>> No problem. Hope you two had a great holiday. >>> >>> On 1/03/11, Debbie wrote: >>>> Hubby brought up going overseas again and wants to check out >>>> Beijing or Shanghai. We have things going on that have made >>>> us hesitate. I cannot give any details and the concern is >>>> still there in the back of my mind. My biggest concern is >>>> the medical. We just need to really talk about it and see >>>> where we go from here. It is nothing extreme, just a concern. >>>> >>>> >>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>> I agree, that's why I'd never teach in the US again. As >>>>> I've said before in >>>>> this forum, I dont think I could anyway. It's been long >>>>> enough that I'm not nearly up on my state regulation, >>>>> laws, assessments and programs that I'd know what I was >>>>> doing. I haven't had to really enforce a classroom >>>>> management plan in a long time. Not to mention >>>>> everything else with NCLB. I could probabley handle a >>>>> private IB school in the states, but they usually pay a >>>>> lot less then public schools and well the economy and >>>>> cost of living aren't that great. >>>>> >>>>> I live and teach in Rome. I get to drink wine at lunch >>>>> on campus. I'm dating a scandalously young woman (she's >>>>> in her 20's me in my 30's). The food is AMAZING, the >>>>> people casual and cosmopolitan with an air of >>>>> sophistication. Life here is more about enjoying the >>>>> time we have... slowly, not climbing the ladder, or >>>>> seeing who has the most money and "stuff". >>>>> The night life is just exciting and sexy enough to >>>>> break the conundrum with work. I get to live in a city >>>>> that "IS" history. The bells of the Vatican, >>>>> the view of the Colosseum. As a foreigner I get a lot >>>>> of slack. No one expects you to know everything or even >>>>> a fraction of what the locals do, so I dont have to >>>>> bother with a lot of the details. >>>>> >>>>> You know its like that in just about everywhere that I >>>>> have taught. Singapore I spent on the beach. China I >>>>> spent talking to people and making friends. Thailand I >>>>> spent being a hedonist. S. Korea was making money. >>>>> Japan was about respecting myself and others. Hong Kong >>>>> was shopping. Malaysia was about faith and the human >>>>> spirit in me (I went to Malaysia after Thailand), and >>>>> those are just the places I've taught. Why would I give >>>>> that up to go back to the states? Whats so great about >>>>> the states? Freedom, freedom to do what? Freedom to go >>>>> to Walmart and buy stuff made in Taiwan with my credit >>>>> card? Freedom of religion/speech? I lived in China and >>>>> never had anyone tell me I couldn't say anything or >>>>> keep me from going to Mass, though I'm a polite person >>>>> anyway. Democracy, as in picking between two candiates >>>>> that are both rich guys. Freedom to go to any doctor I >>>>> want (but can't afford to). Dont get me wrong I would >>>>> never want to not be an american, but personally I'd >>>>> prefer taking the status that comes with it and leaving >>>>> the fluff and red tape behind. Quite simply I want to >>>>> know the simple comfort of pleasure, and not just be >>>>> entertained. >>>>> >>>>> On the DOD forum I always hear people say "I >>>>> wouldn't consider a position overseas if it wasn't a >>>>> DoDDS position, because of the support". Support >>>>> for what I always think to myself? It's really just >>>>> they want to be overseas, but they want it just like a >>>>> being a tourist, they want the "americanized" >>>>> version. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>> Good point. However, being a stateside teacher, >>>>>> teaching is no longer fun. Thank you NCLB!!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>> Sure I considered it, then rejected the idea. Not >>>>>>> to be glib, but time is very important to me. I >>>>>>> like my 3 months off during the summer, my 3 weeks >>>>>>> at christmas, my week at thanksgiving, spring >>>>>>> break. Done by 4, and only 6 hours of actual >>>>>>> teaching work a day. Lastly, and this will sound >>>>>>> silly to anyone who isn't in the profession, but I >>>>>>> get to play all day. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>> Have you ever considered nonteaching jobs with >>>>>>>> DOD? When we were stationed in Germany, years >>>>>>>> ago, I knew several civilian employees who had >>>>>>>> full benefits (GS-11 positions) but were not >>>>>>>> teachers. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>>> I use too actually, but in the international >>>>>>>>> education market its a much shorter path to the >>>>>>>>> good money, and perks at the K-12 level. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>>> I'm proud of you Dave. Why aren't you >>>>>>>>>> teaching at the college level? You obviously >>>>>>>>>> enjoy academia. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Yeah I got it. Well I'm putting them on my >>>>>>>>>>> credit card, and I'll pay them off over the >>>>>>>>>>> summer which is when I'm testing. I already >>>>>>>>>>> have 16 certifications. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> "From a pragmatic view, it's a very >>>>>>>>>>>> inexpensive (both in time and money) >>>>>>>>>>>> means of building a resume (at least >>>>>>>>>>>> compared to other things." >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Well, more perfidious than pragmatic. How >>>>>>>>>>>> are you going to pay for this next round >>>>>>>>>>>> of certifications, Dave? And are these >>>>>>>>>>>> certifications just on loan since they >>>>>>>>>>>> are not really yet paid for? (get it, >>>>>>>>>>>> Dave?...on loan?) >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Thomas wrote: I >>>>>>>>>>>>>> enjoy introducing >>>>>>>>>>>>> people to the idea/career path of >>>>>>>>>>>>> international education as well. It's >>>>>>>>>>>>> just if I call it a hooy I cant take a >>>>>>>>>>>>> tax write off on it. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Well if I hadn't been collecting >>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications, I wouldn't have had the >>>>>>>>>>>>> job I have here in Italy (they were >>>>>>>>>>>>> very attracted to someone with such a >>>>>>>>>>>>> versatile skill set). From a pragmatic >>>>>>>>>>>>> view, it's a very inexpensive (both in >>>>>>>>>>>>> time and money) means of building a >>>>>>>>>>>>> resume (at least compared to other >>>>>>>>>>>>> things. I have a B.A. with three >>>>>>>>>>>>> minors, three masters degrees, a >>>>>>>>>>>>> doctorate, an IB teaching award >>>>>>>>>>>>> (certificate). What else is there to >>>>>>>>>>>>> do? Publish? Learn some languages? >>>>>>>>>>>>> Aside from more certifications I could >>>>>>>>>>>>> add AP certifications, but outside >>>>>>>>>>>>> "american schools" IB is more >>>>>>>>>>>>> popular. Adding a teaching >>>>>>>>>>>>> certification is pretty cheap and takes >>>>>>>>>>>>> half a day (each). >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> The dead languages are dead for a >>>>>>>>>>>>> reason. Though my Italian is starting >>>>>>>>>>>>> to develop. I have a working grasp of 3 >>>>>>>>>>>>> languages now (in addition to english), >>>>>>>>>>>>> french, mandarin, and italian. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I could NEVER teach dance. Art and >>>>>>>>>>>>> Theater are a so-so for me. I was >>>>>>>>>>>>> afraid that's what you were going to >>>>>>>>>>>>> suggest. Do you really think the Gifted >>>>>>>>>>>>> and Talented would add anything? I was >>>>>>>>>>>>> looking last night over the IB Dip. hex >>>>>>>>>>>>> and adding art and theater would really >>>>>>>>>>>>> help me fill out the fine arts category >>>>>>>>>>>>> (Im already certified in music and >>>>>>>>>>>>> speech). My problem would be what would >>>>>>>>>>>>> I do if I was asked to teach it? >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> My certifications are out of Texas and >>>>>>>>>>>>> California. What I do is take the tests >>>>>>>>>>>>> in Texas (which cost $120 each) and >>>>>>>>>>>>> then pay $77 to add them to my texas >>>>>>>>>>>>> certificate (its one fee no matter how >>>>>>>>>>>>> many certifications you add). It cost >>>>>>>>>>>>> the same amount to renew your >>>>>>>>>>>>> certificate every 5 years. Then when I >>>>>>>>>>>>> have a years worth (about 6 >>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications) I transfer them to >>>>>>>>>>>>> California and that costs about $57 >>>>>>>>>>>>> (again, its one fee no matter how many >>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications you add). You can take >>>>>>>>>>>>> Texas online tests anytime, and they >>>>>>>>>>>>> have 4 paper based testing dates a >>>>>>>>>>>>> year. You can take 2 tests per day. >>>>>>>>>>>>> California no longer requires CPE >>>>>>>>>>>>> units. Texas requires 150 hours every 5 >>>>>>>>>>>>> years. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, D. Thomas wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, obviously overseas teaching is >>>>>>>>>>>>>> my career/lifestyle (dare I say >>>>>>>>>>>>>> calling). The talking/posting about >>>>>>>>>>>>>> it, reading about etc is the hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>> part (although you could also say >>>>>>>>>>>>>> it's in my best interest to stay >>>>>>>>>>>>>> current on the topic). I really do >>>>>>>>>>>>>> enjoy getting other people excited >>>>>>>>>>>>>> about the idea though. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I could ask why you feel the need add >>>>>>>>>>>>>> any more certifications, but that >>>>>>>>>>>>>> would be crazy talk. You obviously >>>>>>>>>>>>>> collect certifications and lay awake >>>>>>>>>>>>>> nights dreading the thought that you >>>>>>>>>>>>>> could miss out on a job you want >>>>>>>>>>>>>> because you were not cross certified >>>>>>>>>>>>>> in underwater basket weaving and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Greco/Roman wrestling. Hey! Speaking >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of Greco/Roman, is it too late to get >>>>>>>>>>>>>> started on a whole dead language >>>>>>>>>>>>>> motif? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Seriously though, I do think you >>>>>>>>>>>>>> could be on to something with the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Arts, Dance, Theater and Gifted >>>>>>>>>>>>>> combo. You would certainly be adding >>>>>>>>>>>>>> an artsy, high brow component to your >>>>>>>>>>>>>> portfolio and appealing to some of >>>>>>>>>>>>>> those super-elite schools we talk >>>>>>>>>>>>>> about. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> We've often talked about adding >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications in our home state >>>>>>>>>>>>>> since it's all about testing, but >>>>>>>>>>>>>> have never had the timing work out >>>>>>>>>>>>>> right. Btw, how much does it cost you >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to renew/keep current all of those >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Thomas 2nd >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> response & problem >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: I didn't say it was you, but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I still have the taste of wine in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my nose. Honestly, I feel with you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they should give you a coffee mug. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well since we are both >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> international teachers who have >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> been for a number of years and we >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> make our livings at it, can we >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> really call it a "hobby"? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On another note I have a question >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for you, because its hard to find >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people to pick their brains on this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> who have the background and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> experience. Im registering to add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> another 2 teaching certification >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over the summer, and having 16 of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them, I'm running out of things to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> take. So heres the combinations >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Group A: Art, Theater, Dance, or >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gifted and Talented >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Group B: Agricultural Science, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Technology Education, Marketing >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can take 2 tests from group A, OR >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1 test from group A and 1 test from >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> group B. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My problem is this so far: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1) Marketing: Im already certified >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in Business Education, and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> marketing doesnt add a whole lot >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> since international schools dont >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even know there's a seperate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certification for it, so I dont >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> know if it would really add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2) Technology Education: Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certified in Technology >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> APPLICATIONS and Computer Science. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tech Ed. is more like >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "shop" electronics, wood >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> working, machine shop, automotive. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Again no utility internationally. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3) Agricultural Science: Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a fully certified science teacher >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Bio, chem, physics, earth science) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and again internationally there is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> no demand or utility for Agi. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> science. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 4) Art, Dance, Theater. I could do >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them (the tests) but I have no >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> interest in teaching them and my >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> concern is that someone might ask >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me to teach them and the thing is I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cant draw (or paint), dance, or act >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to save my life (The tests are all >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> theory, multi choice). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 5) The Gifted and Talented seems >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like a no brainer, but Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IB certified and it doesn't qualify >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me to teach AP, so again I dont see >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it adding very much. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My instinct is to go with the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gifted and Talented and the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marketing, but my brain is saying >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that Art, and Theater would make me >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more marketable (I'm pretty good at >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3-d art, stained glass is a hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of mine. I minored in theater as an >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> undergrad. Dance is my biggest fear >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in the world). My teacher friend >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> here in the US thinks that I should >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do the Tech Ed or Ag Science as it >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rounds out my science >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> qualifications (even though I can >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> take only one of them). What are >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your impressions??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, D. Thomas wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HEY! Shills get paid and SA has >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> never given me a dime or even a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> free membership (or even a coffee >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mug). I am not really impressed >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with anything about SA other than >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the detailed database, which is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hard to beat. I still like >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> looking at it to keep up with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> current trends, packages etc (and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm really nosy and the subject >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of int'l teaching is like a hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I guess). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And even I don't usually provide a direct link. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/02/11, Dave -> Randall wrote: Most >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools don't disclose their >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> compensation package to people >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> who aren't candidates (called >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> being short listed). Some >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools (normally DOS or >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "American" schools) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do post their full compensation >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> package online. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I hate to shill for them >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (because another person on this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> board does it so well) but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Search Associates (often simply >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> called SA) has a very >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> comprehensive database of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools full compensation >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> package. It costs $200 to join >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for three years and that's IF >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they accept you as a candidate. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Their website is: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [link removed]!

Jan 5, 2011

report post

D. Thomas The catch-22 is that the schools most likely to have pure or mostly pure Psych. positions are the larger more attractive schools (ISB: Chinese and Thai Editions, ESF, ASIJ etc) BUT they will also be the positions with the most competition and hardest to actually get.

On 1/05/11, Dave -> Mary wrote: > It's actually easier to obtain te...See MoreThe catch-22 is that the schools most likely to have pure or mostly pure Psych. positions are the larger more attractive schools (ISB: Chinese and Thai Editions, ESF, ASIJ etc) BUT they will also be the positions with the most competition and hardest to actually get.

On 1/05/11, Dave -> Mary wrote: > It's actually easier to obtain test materials and sample kits overseas. > Just about every publisher in Tests and Measures, and measurements > yearbook has a distributor/publisher in the regional area (U.K. for > europe, and H.K. for Asia). Secondly, from a practical standpoint most > international schools being private don't spend a lot on psychometrics. > They usually have a sample kit, and they photo copy what they need, with > the School Psy./Counselor hand scoring them. You have probabley noticed > that most international schools post or advertise their Counselor/Psyc. > position as a combined position. The reality is they just don't do a lot > of testing. Most admins are familiar with I.Q. tests as measures of > cognitive ability so you'll see the Wunderlich or the Stanford-Binnett > (and its likely to be an old sample kit). You'll see the Strong Inventory > (if its upper secondary), and probabley one of the depression/emotional > disturbance assessments, thats about it. Most of a School Psy's duties > will be those of a Counselor. > > On 1/04/11, Mary wrote: >> I am not sure whether you want my opinion, but I think if you are >> READY to get your application out there, it is worth the $200 for SA >> and the $25 for International Schools Review. Even if you are not >> ready, it is worth the $25 for ISR. >> >> As for DoDDS vs International Schools and the support issue, I am >> coming from a family standpoint and not as a single adult. The >> military has the evacuation protocol, supports for finding housing, >> etc. However, I understand that there are some very supportive >> international schools as well. >> >> in my field as a school psychologist, I think that ethically, I >> should be working with someone at least within the same system who >> can order the testing materials. I can do the the assessments, >> consultation, etc., but, only those with PhDs in psychology can order >> the materials. If an international school system already has this >> part worked out, I would be interested, but I don't want to apply for >> a position where I cannot work to my potential and using old >> materials and not being able order testing protocols would not work >> for me. >> >> I have continued to see international schools posting vacancies on >> the NASP website, so I don't think I will need tojoing Search >> Associates, but it seems to be worth it for teachers. >> >> On 1/03/11, Randall wrote: >>> So having Dave and Debbie and Thomas chime in.... the answer is >>> pay the money for the information?? >>> >>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Debbie wrote: >>>> No problem. Hope you two had a great holiday. >>>> >>>> On 1/03/11, Debbie wrote: >>>>> Hubby brought up going overseas again and wants to check out >>>>> Beijing or Shanghai. We have things going on that have made >>>>> us hesitate. I cannot give any details and the concern is >>>>> still there in the back of my mind. My biggest concern is >>>>> the medical. We just need to really talk about it and see >>>>> where we go from here. It is nothing extreme, just a concern. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>> I agree, that's why I'd never teach in the US again. As >>>>>> I've said before in >>>>>> this forum, I dont think I could anyway. It's been long >>>>>> enough that I'm not nearly up on my state regulation, >>>>>> laws, assessments and programs that I'd know what I was >>>>>> doing. I haven't had to really enforce a classroom >>>>>> management plan in a long time. Not to mention >>>>>> everything else with NCLB. I could probabley handle a >>>>>> private IB school in the states, but they usually pay a >>>>>> lot less then public schools and well the economy and >>>>>> cost of living aren't that great. >>>>>> >>>>>> I live and teach in Rome. I get to drink wine at lunch >>>>>> on campus. I'm dating a scandalously young woman (she's >>>>>> in her 20's me in my 30's). The food is AMAZING, the >>>>>> people casual and cosmopolitan with an air of >>>>>> sophistication. Life here is more about enjoying the >>>>>> time we have... slowly, not climbing the ladder, or >>>>>> seeing who has the most money and "stuff". >>>>>> The night life is just exciting and sexy enough to >>>>>> break the conundrum with work. I get to live in a city >>>>>> that "IS" history. The bells of the Vatican, >>>>>> the view of the Colosseum. As a foreigner I get a lot >>>>>> of slack. No one expects you to know everything or even >>>>>> a fraction of what the locals do, so I dont have to >>>>>> bother with a lot of the details. >>>>>> >>>>>> You know its like that in just about everywhere that I >>>>>> have taught. Singapore I spent on the beach. China I >>>>>> spent talking to people and making friends. Thailand I >>>>>> spent being a hedonist. S. Korea was making money. >>>>>> Japan was about respecting myself and others. Hong Kong >>>>>> was shopping. Malaysia was about faith and the human >>>>>> spirit in me (I went to Malaysia after Thailand), and >>>>>> those are just the places I've taught. Why would I give >>>>>> that up to go back to the states? Whats so great about >>>>>> the states? Freedom, freedom to do what? Freedom to go >>>>>> to Walmart and buy stuff made in Taiwan with my credit >>>>>> card? Freedom of religion/speech? I lived in China and >>>>>> never had anyone tell me I couldn't say anything or >>>>>> keep me from going to Mass, though I'm a polite person >>>>>> anyway. Democracy, as in picking between two candiates >>>>>> that are both rich guys. Freedom to go to any doctor I >>>>>> want (but can't afford to). Dont get me wrong I would >>>>>> never want to not be an american, but personally I'd >>>>>> prefer taking the status that comes with it and leaving >>>>>> the fluff and red tape behind. Quite simply I want to >>>>>> know the simple comfort of pleasure, and not just be >>>>>> entertained. >>>>>> >>>>>> On the DOD forum I always hear people say "I >>>>>> wouldn't consider a position overseas if it wasn't a >>>>>> DoDDS position, because of the support". Support >>>>>> for what I always think to myself? It's really just >>>>>> they want to be overseas, but they want it just like a >>>>>> being a tourist, they want the "americanized" >>>>>> version. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>> Good point. However, being a stateside teacher, >>>>>>> teaching is no longer fun. Thank you NCLB!!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>> Sure I considered it, then rejected the idea. Not >>>>>>>> to be glib, but time is very important to me. I >>>>>>>> like my 3 months off during the summer, my 3 weeks >>>>>>>> at christmas, my week at thanksgiving, spring >>>>>>>> break. Done by 4, and only 6 hours of actual >>>>>>>> teaching work a day. Lastly, and this will sound >>>>>>>> silly to anyone who isn't in the profession, but I >>>>>>>> get to play all day. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>> Have you ever considered nonteaching jobs with >>>>>>>>> DOD? When we were stationed in Germany, years >>>>>>>>> ago, I knew several civilian employees who had >>>>>>>>> full benefits (GS-11 positions) but were not >>>>>>>>> teachers. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>>>> I use too actually, but in the international >>>>>>>>>> education market its a much shorter path to the >>>>>>>>>> good money, and perks at the K-12 level. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> I'm proud of you Dave. Why aren't you >>>>>>>>>>> teaching at the college level? You obviously >>>>>>>>>>> enjoy academia. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> Yeah I got it. Well I'm putting them on my >>>>>>>>>>>> credit card, and I'll pay them off over the >>>>>>>>>>>> summer which is when I'm testing. I already >>>>>>>>>>>> have 16 certifications. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> "From a pragmatic view, it's a very >>>>>>>>>>>>> inexpensive (both in time and money) >>>>>>>>>>>>> means of building a resume (at least >>>>>>>>>>>>> compared to other things." >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, more perfidious than pragmatic. How >>>>>>>>>>>>> are you going to pay for this next round >>>>>>>>>>>>> of certifications, Dave? And are these >>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications just on loan since they >>>>>>>>>>>>> are not really yet paid for? (get it, >>>>>>>>>>>>> Dave?...on loan?) >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Thomas wrote: I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> enjoy introducing >>>>>>>>>>>>>> people to the idea/career path of >>>>>>>>>>>>>> international education as well. It's >>>>>>>>>>>>>> just if I call it a hooy I cant take a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> tax write off on it. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well if I hadn't been collecting >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications, I wouldn't have had the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> job I have here in Italy (they were >>>>>>>>>>>>>> very attracted to someone with such a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> versatile skill set). From a pragmatic >>>>>>>>>>>>>> view, it's a very inexpensive (both in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> time and money) means of building a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> resume (at least compared to other >>>>>>>>>>>>>> things. I have a B.A. with three >>>>>>>>>>>>>> minors, three masters degrees, a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> doctorate, an IB teaching award >>>>>>>>>>>>>> (certificate). What else is there to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> do? Publish? Learn some languages? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Aside from more certifications I could >>>>>>>>>>>>>> add AP certifications, but outside >>>>>>>>>>>>>> "american schools" IB is more >>>>>>>>>>>>>> popular. Adding a teaching >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certification is pretty cheap and takes >>>>>>>>>>>>>> half a day (each). >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The dead languages are dead for a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> reason. Though my Italian is starting >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to develop. I have a working grasp of 3 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> languages now (in addition to english), >>>>>>>>>>>>>> french, mandarin, and italian. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I could NEVER teach dance. Art and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Theater are a so-so for me. I was >>>>>>>>>>>>>> afraid that's what you were going to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> suggest. Do you really think the Gifted >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and Talented would add anything? I was >>>>>>>>>>>>>> looking last night over the IB Dip. hex >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and adding art and theater would really >>>>>>>>>>>>>> help me fill out the fine arts category >>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Im already certified in music and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> speech). My problem would be what would >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I do if I was asked to teach it? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> My certifications are out of Texas and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> California. What I do is take the tests >>>>>>>>>>>>>> in Texas (which cost $120 each) and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> then pay $77 to add them to my texas >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certificate (its one fee no matter how >>>>>>>>>>>>>> many certifications you add). It cost >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the same amount to renew your >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certificate every 5 years. Then when I >>>>>>>>>>>>>> have a years worth (about 6 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications) I transfer them to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> California and that costs about $57 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> (again, its one fee no matter how many >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications you add). You can take >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Texas online tests anytime, and they >>>>>>>>>>>>>> have 4 paper based testing dates a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> year. You can take 2 tests per day. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> California no longer requires CPE >>>>>>>>>>>>>> units. Texas requires 150 hours every 5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> years. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, D. Thomas wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, obviously overseas teaching is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my career/lifestyle (dare I say >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> calling). The talking/posting about >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it, reading about etc is the hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> part (although you could also say >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it's in my best interest to stay >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> current on the topic). I really do >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> enjoy getting other people excited >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about the idea though. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I could ask why you feel the need add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any more certifications, but that >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> would be crazy talk. You obviously >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> collect certifications and lay awake >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nights dreading the thought that you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could miss out on a job you want >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because you were not cross certified >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in underwater basket weaving and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Greco/Roman wrestling. Hey! Speaking >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of Greco/Roman, is it too late to get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> started on a whole dead language >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> motif? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Seriously though, I do think you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could be on to something with the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Arts, Dance, Theater and Gifted >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> combo. You would certainly be adding >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> an artsy, high brow component to your >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> portfolio and appealing to some of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> those super-elite schools we talk >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We've often talked about adding >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications in our home state >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> since it's all about testing, but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have never had the timing work out >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> right. Btw, how much does it cost you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to renew/keep current all of those >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Thomas 2nd >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> response & problem >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: I didn't say it was you, but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I still have the taste of wine in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my nose. Honestly, I feel with you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they should give you a coffee mug. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well since we are both >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> international teachers who have >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> been for a number of years and we >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> make our livings at it, can we >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> really call it a "hobby"? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On another note I have a question >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for you, because its hard to find >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people to pick their brains on this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> who have the background and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> experience. Im registering to add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> another 2 teaching certification >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over the summer, and having 16 of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them, I'm running out of things to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> take. So heres the combinations >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Group A: Art, Theater, Dance, or >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gifted and Talented >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Group B: Agricultural Science, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Technology Education, Marketing >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can take 2 tests from group A, OR >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1 test from group A and 1 test from >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> group B. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My problem is this so far: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1) Marketing: Im already certified >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in Business Education, and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> marketing doesnt add a whole lot >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> since international schools dont >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even know there's a seperate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certification for it, so I dont >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> know if it would really add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2) Technology Education: Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certified in Technology >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> APPLICATIONS and Computer Science. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tech Ed. is more like >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "shop" electronics, wood >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> working, machine shop, automotive. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Again no utility internationally. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3) Agricultural Science: Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a fully certified science teacher >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Bio, chem, physics, earth science) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and again internationally there is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> no demand or utility for Agi. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> science. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 4) Art, Dance, Theater. I could do >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them (the tests) but I have no >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> interest in teaching them and my >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> concern is that someone might ask >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me to teach them and the thing is I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cant draw (or paint), dance, or act >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to save my life (The tests are all >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> theory, multi choice). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 5) The Gifted and Talented seems >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like a no brainer, but Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IB certified and it doesn't qualify >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me to teach AP, so again I dont see >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it adding very much. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My instinct is to go with the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gifted and Talented and the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marketing, but my brain is saying >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that Art, and Theater would make me >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more marketable (I'm pretty good at >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3-d art, stained glass is a hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of mine. I minored in theater as an >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> undergrad. Dance is my biggest fear >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in the world). My teacher friend >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> here in the US thinks that I should >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do the Tech Ed or Ag Science as it >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rounds out my science >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> qualifications (even though I can >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> take only one of them). What are >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your impressions??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, D. Thomas wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HEY! Shills get paid and SA has >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> never given me a dime or even a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> free membership (or even a coffee >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mug). I am not really impressed >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with anything about SA other than >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the detailed database, which is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hard to beat. I still like >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> looking at it to keep up with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> current trends, packages etc (and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm really nosy and the subject >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of int'l teaching is like a hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I guess). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And even I don't usually provide a direct link. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/02/11, Dave -> Randall wrote: Most >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools don't disclose their >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> compensation package to people >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> who aren't candidates (called >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> being short listed). Some >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools (normally DOS or >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "American" schools) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do post their full compensation >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> package online. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I hate to shill for them >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (because another person on this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> board does it so well) but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Search Associates (often simply >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> called SA) has a very >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> comprehensive database of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools full compensation >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> package. It costs $200 to join >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for three years and that's IF >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they accept you as a candidate. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Their website is: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [link removed]!

Jan 5, 2011

report post

Dave Except even the pure Psyc positions I've seen (and its not many, just OFS in Singapore) still dont do a lot of psychometrics. In the states a district might have 2 at most. International schools will have 1 and even if it doesnt say that "pure" psyc's job is still going to be mostly counseling ...

and evenOn 1/05/11, D. Thomas wrote: >...See MoreExcept even the pure Psyc positions I've seen (and its not many, just OFS in Singapore) still dont do a lot of psychometrics. In the states a district might have 2 at most. International schools will have 1 and even if it doesnt say that "pure" psyc's job is still going to be mostly counseling ...

and evenOn 1/05/11, D. Thomas wrote: > The catch-22 is that the schools most likely to have pure or mostly pure > Psych. positions are the larger more attractive schools (ISB: Chinese and > Thai Editions, ESF, ASIJ etc) BUT they will also be the positions with the > most competition and hardest to actually get. > > On 1/05/11, Dave -> Mary wrote: >> It's actually easier to obtain test materials and sample kits overseas. >> Just about every publisher in Tests and Measures, and measurements >> yearbook has a distributor/publisher in the regional area (U.K. for >> europe, and H.K. for Asia). Secondly, from a practical standpoint most >> international schools being private don't spend a lot on psychometrics. >> They usually have a sample kit, and they photo copy what they need, with >> the School Psy./Counselor hand scoring them. You have probabley noticed >> that most international schools post or advertise their Counselor/Psyc. >> position as a combined position. The reality is they just don't do a lot >> of testing. Most admins are familiar with I.Q. tests as measures of >> cognitive ability so you'll see the Wunderlich or the Stanford-Binnett >> (and its likely to be an old sample kit). You'll see the Strong Inventory >> (if its upper secondary), and probabley one of the depression/emotional >> disturbance assessments, thats about it. Most of a School Psy's duties >> will be those of a Counselor. >> >> On 1/04/11, Mary wrote: >>> I am not sure whether you want my opinion, but I think if you are >>> READY to get your application out there, it is worth the $200 for SA >>> and the $25 for International Schools Review. Even if you are not >>> ready, it is worth the $25 for ISR. >>> >>> As for DoDDS vs International Schools and the support issue, I am >>> coming from a family standpoint and not as a single adult. The >>> military has the evacuation protocol, supports for finding housing, >>> etc. However, I understand that there are some very supportive >>> international schools as well. >>> >>> in my field as a school psychologist, I think that ethically, I >>> should be working with someone at least within the same system who >>> can order the testing materials. I can do the the assessments, >>> consultation, etc., but, only those with PhDs in psychology can order >>> the materials. If an international school system already has this >>> part worked out, I would be interested, but I don't want to apply for >>> a position where I cannot work to my potential and using old >>> materials and not being able order testing protocols would not work >>> for me. >>> >>> I have continued to see international schools posting vacancies on >>> the NASP website, so I don't think I will need tojoing Search >>> Associates, but it seems to be worth it for teachers. >>> >>> On 1/03/11, Randall wrote: >>>> So having Dave and Debbie and Thomas chime in.... the answer is >>>> pay the money for the information?? >>>> >>>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Debbie wrote: >>>>> No problem. Hope you two had a great holiday. >>>>> >>>>> On 1/03/11, Debbie wrote: >>>>>> Hubby brought up going overseas again and wants to check out >>>>>> Beijing or Shanghai. We have things going on that have made >>>>>> us hesitate. I cannot give any details and the concern is >>>>>> still there in the back of my mind. My biggest concern is >>>>>> the medical. We just need to really talk about it and see >>>>>> where we go from here. It is nothing extreme, just a concern. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>> I agree, that's why I'd never teach in the US again. As >>>>>>> I've said before in >>>>>>> this forum, I dont think I could anyway. It's been long >>>>>>> enough that I'm not nearly up on my state regulation, >>>>>>> laws, assessments and programs that I'd know what I was >>>>>>> doing. I haven't had to really enforce a classroom >>>>>>> management plan in a long time. Not to mention >>>>>>> everything else with NCLB. I could probabley handle a >>>>>>> private IB school in the states, but they usually pay a >>>>>>> lot less then public schools and well the economy and >>>>>>> cost of living aren't that great. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I live and teach in Rome. I get to drink wine at lunch >>>>>>> on campus. I'm dating a scandalously young woman (she's >>>>>>> in her 20's me in my 30's). The food is AMAZING, the >>>>>>> people casual and cosmopolitan with an air of >>>>>>> sophistication. Life here is more about enjoying the >>>>>>> time we have... slowly, not climbing the ladder, or >>>>>>> seeing who has the most money and "stuff". >>>>>>> The night life is just exciting and sexy enough to >>>>>>> break the conundrum with work. I get to live in a city >>>>>>> that "IS" history. The bells of the Vatican, >>>>>>> the view of the Colosseum. As a foreigner I get a lot >>>>>>> of slack. No one expects you to know everything or even >>>>>>> a fraction of what the locals do, so I dont have to >>>>>>> bother with a lot of the details. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You know its like that in just about everywhere that I >>>>>>> have taught. Singapore I spent on the beach. China I >>>>>>> spent talking to people and making friends. Thailand I >>>>>>> spent being a hedonist. S. Korea was making money. >>>>>>> Japan was about respecting myself and others. Hong Kong >>>>>>> was shopping. Malaysia was about faith and the human >>>>>>> spirit in me (I went to Malaysia after Thailand), and >>>>>>> those are just the places I've taught. Why would I give >>>>>>> that up to go back to the states? Whats so great about >>>>>>> the states? Freedom, freedom to do what? Freedom to go >>>>>>> to Walmart and buy stuff made in Taiwan with my credit >>>>>>> card? Freedom of religion/speech? I lived in China and >>>>>>> never had anyone tell me I couldn't say anything or >>>>>>> keep me from going to Mass, though I'm a polite person >>>>>>> anyway. Democracy, as in picking between two candiates >>>>>>> that are both rich guys. Freedom to go to any doctor I >>>>>>> want (but can't afford to). Dont get me wrong I would >>>>>>> never want to not be an american, but personally I'd >>>>>>> prefer taking the status that comes with it and leaving >>>>>>> the fluff and red tape behind. Quite simply I want to >>>>>>> know the simple comfort of pleasure, and not just be >>>>>>> entertained. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On the DOD forum I always hear people say "I >>>>>>> wouldn't consider a position overseas if it wasn't a >>>>>>> DoDDS position, because of the support". Support >>>>>>> for what I always think to myself? It's really just >>>>>>> they want to be overseas, but they want it just like a >>>>>>> being a tourist, they want the "americanized" >>>>>>> version. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>> Good point. However, being a stateside teacher, >>>>>>>> teaching is no longer fun. Thank you NCLB!!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>>> Sure I considered it, then rejected the idea. Not >>>>>>>>> to be glib, but time is very important to me. I >>>>>>>>> like my 3 months off during the summer, my 3 weeks >>>>>>>>> at christmas, my week at thanksgiving, spring >>>>>>>>> break. Done by 4, and only 6 hours of actual >>>>>>>>> teaching work a day. Lastly, and this will sound >>>>>>>>> silly to anyone who isn't in the profession, but I >>>>>>>>> get to play all day. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Have you ever considered nonteaching jobs with >>>>>>>>>> DOD? When we were stationed in Germany, years >>>>>>>>>> ago, I knew several civilian employees who had >>>>>>>>>> full benefits (GS-11 positions) but were not >>>>>>>>>> teachers. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> I use too actually, but in the international >>>>>>>>>>> education market its a much shorter path to the >>>>>>>>>>> good money, and perks at the K-12 level. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> I'm proud of you Dave. Why aren't you >>>>>>>>>>>> teaching at the college level? You obviously >>>>>>>>>>>> enjoy academia. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> Yeah I got it. Well I'm putting them on my >>>>>>>>>>>>> credit card, and I'll pay them off over the >>>>>>>>>>>>> summer which is when I'm testing. I already >>>>>>>>>>>>> have 16 certifications. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> "From a pragmatic view, it's a very >>>>>>>>>>>>>> inexpensive (both in time and money) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> means of building a resume (at least >>>>>>>>>>>>>> compared to other things." >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, more perfidious than pragmatic. How >>>>>>>>>>>>>> are you going to pay for this next round >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of certifications, Dave? And are these >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications just on loan since they >>>>>>>>>>>>>> are not really yet paid for? (get it, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dave?...on loan?) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Thomas wrote: I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> enjoy introducing >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people to the idea/career path of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> international education as well. It's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> just if I call it a hooy I cant take a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tax write off on it. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well if I hadn't been collecting >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications, I wouldn't have had the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> job I have here in Italy (they were >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> very attracted to someone with such a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> versatile skill set). From a pragmatic >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> view, it's a very inexpensive (both in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> time and money) means of building a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> resume (at least compared to other >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> things. I have a B.A. with three >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> minors, three masters degrees, a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doctorate, an IB teaching award >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (certificate). What else is there to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do? Publish? Learn some languages? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Aside from more certifications I could >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> add AP certifications, but outside >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "american schools" IB is more >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> popular. Adding a teaching >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certification is pretty cheap and takes >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> half a day (each). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The dead languages are dead for a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reason. Though my Italian is starting >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to develop. I have a working grasp of 3 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> languages now (in addition to english), >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> french, mandarin, and italian. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I could NEVER teach dance. Art and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Theater are a so-so for me. I was >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> afraid that's what you were going to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> suggest. Do you really think the Gifted >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and Talented would add anything? I was >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> looking last night over the IB Dip. hex >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and adding art and theater would really >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> help me fill out the fine arts category >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Im already certified in music and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> speech). My problem would be what would >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I do if I was asked to teach it? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My certifications are out of Texas and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> California. What I do is take the tests >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in Texas (which cost $120 each) and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> then pay $77 to add them to my texas >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certificate (its one fee no matter how >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> many certifications you add). It cost >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the same amount to renew your >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certificate every 5 years. Then when I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have a years worth (about 6 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications) I transfer them to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> California and that costs about $57 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (again, its one fee no matter how many >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications you add). You can take >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Texas online tests anytime, and they >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have 4 paper based testing dates a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> year. You can take 2 tests per day. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> California no longer requires CPE >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> units. Texas requires 150 hours every 5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> years. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, D. Thomas wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, obviously overseas teaching is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my career/lifestyle (dare I say >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> calling). The talking/posting about >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it, reading about etc is the hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> part (although you could also say >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it's in my best interest to stay >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> current on the topic). I really do >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> enjoy getting other people excited >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about the idea though. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I could ask why you feel the need add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any more certifications, but that >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> would be crazy talk. You obviously >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> collect certifications and lay awake >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nights dreading the thought that you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could miss out on a job you want >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because you were not cross certified >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in underwater basket weaving and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Greco/Roman wrestling. Hey! Speaking >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of Greco/Roman, is it too late to get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> started on a whole dead language >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> motif? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Seriously though, I do think you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could be on to something with the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Arts, Dance, Theater and Gifted >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> combo. You would certainly be adding >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> an artsy, high brow component to your >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> portfolio and appealing to some of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> those super-elite schools we talk >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We've often talked about adding >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications in our home state >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> since it's all about testing, but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have never had the timing work out >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> right. Btw, how much does it cost you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to renew/keep current all of those >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Thomas 2nd >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> response & problem >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: I didn't say it was you, but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I still have the taste of wine in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my nose. Honestly, I feel with you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they should give you a coffee mug. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well since we are both >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> international teachers who have >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> been for a number of years and we >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> make our livings at it, can we >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> really call it a "hobby"? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On another note I have a question >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for you, because its hard to find >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people to pick their brains on this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> who have the background and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> experience. Im registering to add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> another 2 teaching certification >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over the summer, and having 16 of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them, I'm running out of things to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> take. So heres the combinations >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Group A: Art, Theater, Dance, or >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gifted and Talented >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Group B: Agricultural Science, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Technology Education, Marketing >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can take 2 tests from group A, OR >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1 test from group A and 1 test from >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> group B. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My problem is this so far: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1) Marketing: Im already certified >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in Business Education, and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> marketing doesnt add a whole lot >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> since international schools dont >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even know there's a seperate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certification for it, so I dont >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> know if it would really add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2) Technology Education: Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certified in Technology >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> APPLICATIONS and Computer Science. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tech Ed. is more like >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "shop" electronics, wood >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> working, machine shop, automotive. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Again no utility internationally. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3) Agricultural Science: Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a fully certified science teacher >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Bio, chem, physics, earth science) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and again internationally there is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> no demand or utility for Agi. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> science. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 4) Art, Dance, Theater. I could do >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them (the tests) but I have no >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> interest in teaching them and my >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> concern is that someone might ask >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me to teach them and the thing is I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cant draw (or paint), dance, or act >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to save my life (The tests are all >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> theory, multi choice). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 5) The Gifted and Talented seems >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like a no brainer, but Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IB certified and it doesn't qualify >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me to teach AP, so again I dont see >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it adding very much. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My instinct is to go with the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gifted and Talented and the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marketing, but my brain is saying >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that Art, and Theater would make me >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more marketable (I'm pretty good at >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3-d art, stained glass is a hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of mine. I minored in theater as an >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> undergrad. Dance is my biggest fear >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in the world). My teacher friend >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> here in the US thinks that I should >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do the Tech Ed or Ag Science as it >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rounds out my science >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> qualifications (even though I can >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> take only one of them). What are >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your impressions??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, D. Thomas wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HEY! Shills get paid and SA has >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> never given me a dime or even a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> free membership (or even a coffee >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mug). I am not really impressed >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with anything about SA other than >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the detailed database, which is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hard to beat. I still like >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> looking at it to keep up with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> current trends, packages etc (and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm really nosy and the subject >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of int'l teaching is like a hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I guess). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And even I don't usually provide a direct link. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/02/11, Dave -> Randall wrote: Most >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools don't disclose their >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> compensation package to people >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> who aren't candidates (called >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> being short listed). Some >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools (normally DOS or >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "American" schools) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do post their full compensation >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> package online. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I hate to shill for them >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (because another person on this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> board does it so well) but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Search Associates (often simply >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> called SA) has a very >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> comprehensive database of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools full compensation >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> package. It costs $200 to join >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for three years and that's IF >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they accept you as a candidate. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Their website is: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [link removed]!

Jan 5, 2011

report post

Mary So, copy rights don't apply?

On 1/05/11, Dave -> Mary wrote: > It's actually easier to obtain test materials and sample kits overseas. > Just about every publisher in Tests and Measures, and measurements > yearbook has a distributor/publisher in the regional area (U.K. for > europe, and H.K. for Asia). Secondly, from a pract...See MoreSo, copy rights don't apply?

On 1/05/11, Dave -> Mary wrote: > It's actually easier to obtain test materials and sample kits overseas. > Just about every publisher in Tests and Measures, and measurements > yearbook has a distributor/publisher in the regional area (U.K. for > europe, and H.K. for Asia). Secondly, from a practical standpoint most > international schools being private don't spend a lot on psychometrics. > They usually have a sample kit, and they photo copy what they need, with > the School Psy./Counselor hand scoring them. You have probabley noticed > that most international schools post or advertise their Counselor/Psyc. > position as a combined position. The reality is they just don't do a lot > of testing. Most admins are familiar with I.Q. tests as measures of > cognitive ability so you'll see the Wunderlich or the Stanford-Binnett > (and its likely to be an old sample kit). You'll see the Strong Inventory > (if its upper secondary), and probabley one of the depression/emotional > disturbance assessments, thats about it. Most of a School Psy's duties > will be those of a Counselor. > > On 1/04/11, Mary wrote: >> I am not sure whether you want my opinion, but I think if you are >> READY to get your application out there, it is worth the $200 for SA >> and the $25 for International Schools Review. Even if you are not >> ready, it is worth the $25 for ISR. >> >> As for DoDDS vs International Schools and the support issue, I am >> coming from a family standpoint and not as a single adult. The >> military has the evacuation protocol, supports for finding housing, >> etc. However, I understand that there are some very supportive >> international schools as well. >> >> in my field as a school psychologist, I think that ethically, I >> should be working with someone at least within the same system who >> can order the testing materials. I can do the the assessments, >> consultation, etc., but, only those with PhDs in psychology can order >> the materials. If an international school system already has this >> part worked out, I would be interested, but I don't want to apply for >> a position where I cannot work to my potential and using old >> materials and not being able order testing protocols would not work >> for me. >> >> I have continued to see international schools posting vacancies on >> the NASP website, so I don't think I will need tojoing Search >> Associates, but it seems to be worth it for teachers. >> >> On 1/03/11, Randall wrote: >>> So having Dave and Debbie and Thomas chime in.... the answer is >>> pay the money for the information?? >>> >>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Debbie wrote: >>>> No problem. Hope you two had a great holiday. >>>> >>>> On 1/03/11, Debbie wrote: >>>>> Hubby brought up going overseas again and wants to check out >>>>> Beijing or Shanghai. We have things going on that have made >>>>> us hesitate. I cannot give any details and the concern is >>>>> still there in the back of my mind. My biggest concern is >>>>> the medical. We just need to really talk about it and see >>>>> where we go from here. It is nothing extreme, just a concern. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>> I agree, that's why I'd never teach in the US again. As >>>>>> I've said before in >>>>>> this forum, I dont think I could anyway. It's been long >>>>>> enough that I'm not nearly up on my state regulation, >>>>>> laws, assessments and programs that I'd know what I was >>>>>> doing. I haven't had to really enforce a classroom >>>>>> management plan in a long time. Not to mention >>>>>> everything else with NCLB. I could probabley handle a >>>>>> private IB school in the states, but they usually pay a >>>>>> lot less then public schools and well the economy and >>>>>> cost of living aren't that great. >>>>>> >>>>>> I live and teach in Rome. I get to drink wine at lunch >>>>>> on campus. I'm dating a scandalously young woman (she's >>>>>> in her 20's me in my 30's). The food is AMAZING, the >>>>>> people casual and cosmopolitan with an air of >>>>>> sophistication. Life here is more about enjoying the >>>>>> time we have... slowly, not climbing the ladder, or >>>>>> seeing who has the most money and "stuff". >>>>>> The night life is just exciting and sexy enough to >>>>>> break the conundrum with work. I get to live in a city >>>>>> that "IS" history. The bells of the Vatican, >>>>>> the view of the Colosseum. As a foreigner I get a lot >>>>>> of slack. No one expects you to know everything or even >>>>>> a fraction of what the locals do, so I dont have to >>>>>> bother with a lot of the details. >>>>>> >>>>>> You know its like that in just about everywhere that I >>>>>> have taught. Singapore I spent on the beach. China I >>>>>> spent talking to people and making friends. Thailand I >>>>>> spent being a hedonist. S. Korea was making money. >>>>>> Japan was about respecting myself and others. Hong Kong >>>>>> was shopping. Malaysia was about faith and the human >>>>>> spirit in me (I went to Malaysia after Thailand), and >>>>>> those are just the places I've taught. Why would I give >>>>>> that up to go back to the states? Whats so great about >>>>>> the states? Freedom, freedom to do what? Freedom to go >>>>>> to Walmart and buy stuff made in Taiwan with my credit >>>>>> card? Freedom of religion/speech? I lived in China and >>>>>> never had anyone tell me I couldn't say anything or >>>>>> keep me from going to Mass, though I'm a polite person >>>>>> anyway. Democracy, as in picking between two candiates >>>>>> that are both rich guys. Freedom to go to any doctor I >>>>>> want (but can't afford to). Dont get me wrong I would >>>>>> never want to not be an american, but personally I'd >>>>>> prefer taking the status that comes with it and leaving >>>>>> the fluff and red tape behind. Quite simply I want to >>>>>> know the simple comfort of pleasure, and not just be >>>>>> entertained. >>>>>> >>>>>> On the DOD forum I always hear people say "I >>>>>> wouldn't consider a position overseas if it wasn't a >>>>>> DoDDS position, because of the support". Support >>>>>> for what I always think to myself? It's really just >>>>>> they want to be overseas, but they want it just like a >>>>>> being a tourist, they want the "americanized" >>>>>> version. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>> Good point. However, being a stateside teacher, >>>>>>> teaching is no longer fun. Thank you NCLB!!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>> Sure I considered it, then rejected the idea. Not >>>>>>>> to be glib, but time is very important to me. I >>>>>>>> like my 3 months off during the summer, my 3 weeks >>>>>>>> at christmas, my week at thanksgiving, spring >>>>>>>> break. Done by 4, and only 6 hours of actual >>>>>>>> teaching work a day. Lastly, and this will sound >>>>>>>> silly to anyone who isn't in the profession, but I >>>>>>>> get to play all day. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>> Have you ever considered nonteaching jobs with >>>>>>>>> DOD? When we were stationed in Germany, years >>>>>>>>> ago, I knew several civilian employees who had >>>>>>>>> full benefits (GS-11 positions) but were not >>>>>>>>> teachers. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>>>> I use too actually, but in the international >>>>>>>>>> education market its a much shorter path to the >>>>>>>>>> good money, and perks at the K-12 level. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> I'm proud of you Dave. Why aren't you >>>>>>>>>>> teaching at the college level? You obviously >>>>>>>>>>> enjoy academia. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> Yeah I got it. Well I'm putting them on my >>>>>>>>>>>> credit card, and I'll pay them off over the >>>>>>>>>>>> summer which is when I'm testing. I already >>>>>>>>>>>> have 16 certifications. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> "From a pragmatic view, it's a very >>>>>>>>>>>>> inexpensive (both in time and money) >>>>>>>>>>>>> means of building a resume (at least >>>>>>>>>>>>> compared to other things." >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, more perfidious than pragmatic. How >>>>>>>>>>>>> are you going to pay for this next round >>>>>>>>>>>>> of certifications, Dave? And are these >>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications just on loan since they >>>>>>>>>>>>> are not really yet paid for? (get it, >>>>>>>>>>>>> Dave?...on loan?) >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Thomas wrote: I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> enjoy introducing >>>>>>>>>>>>>> people to the idea/career path of >>>>>>>>>>>>>> international education as well. It's >>>>>>>>>>>>>> just if I call it a hooy I cant take a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> tax write off on it. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well if I hadn't been collecting >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications, I wouldn't have had the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> job I have here in Italy (they were >>>>>>>>>>>>>> very attracted to someone with such a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> versatile skill set). From a pragmatic >>>>>>>>>>>>>> view, it's a very inexpensive (both in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> time and money) means of building a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> resume (at least compared to other >>>>>>>>>>>>>> things. I have a B.A. with three >>>>>>>>>>>>>> minors, three masters degrees, a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> doctorate, an IB teaching award >>>>>>>>>>>>>> (certificate). What else is there to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> do? Publish? Learn some languages? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Aside from more certifications I could >>>>>>>>>>>>>> add AP certifications, but outside >>>>>>>>>>>>>> "american schools" IB is more >>>>>>>>>>>>>> popular. Adding a teaching >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certification is pretty cheap and takes >>>>>>>>>>>>>> half a day (each). >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The dead languages are dead for a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> reason. Though my Italian is starting >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to develop. I have a working grasp of 3 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> languages now (in addition to english), >>>>>>>>>>>>>> french, mandarin, and italian. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I could NEVER teach dance. Art and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Theater are a so-so for me. I was >>>>>>>>>>>>>> afraid that's what you were going to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> suggest. Do you really think the Gifted >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and Talented would add anything? I was >>>>>>>>>>>>>> looking last night over the IB Dip. hex >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and adding art and theater would really >>>>>>>>>>>>>> help me fill out the fine arts category >>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Im already certified in music and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> speech). My problem would be what would >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I do if I was asked to teach it? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> My certifications are out of Texas and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> California. What I do is take the tests >>>>>>>>>>>>>> in Texas (which cost $120 each) and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> then pay $77 to add them to my texas >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certificate (its one fee no matter how >>>>>>>>>>>>>> many certifications you add). It cost >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the same amount to renew your >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certificate every 5 years. Then when I >>>>>>>>>>>>>> have a years worth (about 6 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications) I transfer them to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> California and that costs about $57 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> (again, its one fee no matter how many >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications you add). You can take >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Texas online tests anytime, and they >>>>>>>>>>>>>> have 4 paper based testing dates a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> year. You can take 2 tests per day. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> California no longer requires CPE >>>>>>>>>>>>>> units. Texas requires 150 hours every 5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> years. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, D. Thomas wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, obviously overseas teaching is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my career/lifestyle (dare I say >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> calling). The talking/posting about >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it, reading about etc is the hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> part (although you could also say >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it's in my best interest to stay >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> current on the topic). I really do >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> enjoy getting other people excited >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about the idea though. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I could ask why you feel the need add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any more certifications, but that >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> would be crazy talk. You obviously >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> collect certifications and lay awake >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nights dreading the thought that you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could miss out on a job you want >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because you were not cross certified >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in underwater basket weaving and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Greco/Roman wrestling. Hey! Speaking >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of Greco/Roman, is it too late to get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> started on a whole dead language >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> motif? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Seriously though, I do think you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could be on to something with the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Arts, Dance, Theater and Gifted >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> combo. You would certainly be adding >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> an artsy, high brow component to your >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> portfolio and appealing to some of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> those super-elite schools we talk >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We've often talked about adding >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications in our home state >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> since it's all about testing, but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have never had the timing work out >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> right. Btw, how much does it cost you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to renew/keep current all of those >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Thomas 2nd >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> response & problem >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: I didn't say it was you, but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I still have the taste of wine in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my nose. Honestly, I feel with you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they should give you a coffee mug. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well since we are both >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> international teachers who have >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> been for a number of years and we >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> make our livings at it, can we >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> really call it a "hobby"? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On another note I have a question >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for you, because its hard to find >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people to pick their brains on this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> who have the background and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> experience. Im registering to add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> another 2 teaching certification >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over the summer, and having 16 of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them, I'm running out of things to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> take. So heres the combinations >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Group A: Art, Theater, Dance, or >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gifted and Talented >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Group B: Agricultural Science, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Technology Education, Marketing >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can take 2 tests from group A, OR >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1 test from group A and 1 test from >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> group B. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My problem is this so far: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1) Marketing: Im already certified >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in Business Education, and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> marketing doesnt add a whole lot >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> since international schools dont >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even know there's a seperate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certification for it, so I dont >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> know if it would really add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2) Technology Education: Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certified in Technology >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> APPLICATIONS and Computer Science. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tech Ed. is more like >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "shop" electronics, wood >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> working, machine shop, automotive. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Again no utility internationally. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3) Agricultural Science: Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a fully certified science teacher >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Bio, chem, physics, earth science) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and again internationally there is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> no demand or utility for Agi. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> science. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 4) Art, Dance, Theater. I could do >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them (the tests) but I have no >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> interest in teaching them and my >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> concern is that someone might ask >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me to teach them and the thing is I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cant draw (or paint), dance, or act >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to save my life (The tests are all >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> theory, multi choice). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 5) The Gifted and Talented seems >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like a no brainer, but Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IB certified and it doesn't qualify >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me to teach AP, so again I dont see >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it adding very much. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My instinct is to go with the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gifted and Talented and the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marketing, but my brain is saying >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that Art, and Theater would make me >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more marketable (I'm pretty good at >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3-d art, stained glass is a hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of mine. I minored in theater as an >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> undergrad. Dance is my biggest fear >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in the world). My teacher friend >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> here in the US thinks that I should >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do the Tech Ed or Ag Science as it >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rounds out my science >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> qualifications (even though I can >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> take only one of them). What are >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your impressions??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, D. Thomas wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HEY! Shills get paid and SA has >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> never given me a dime or even a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> free membership (or even a coffee >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mug). I am not really impressed >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with anything about SA other than >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the detailed database, which is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hard to beat. I still like >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> looking at it to keep up with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> current trends, packages etc (and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm really nosy and the subject >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of int'l teaching is like a hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I guess). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And even I don't usually provide a direct link. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/02/11, Dave -> Randall wrote: Most >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools don't disclose their >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> compensation package to people >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> who aren't candidates (called >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> being short listed). Some >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools (normally DOS or >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "American" schools) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do post their full compensation >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> package online. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I hate to shill for them >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (because another person on this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> board does it so well) but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Search Associates (often simply >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> called SA) has a very >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> comprehensive database of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools full compensation >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> package. It costs $200 to join >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for three years and that's IF >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they accept you as a candidate. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Their website is: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [link removed]!

Jan 5, 2011

report post

Dave -> Mary Copyright doesnt mean anything in Asia. In Europe it does but most of the private/international schools just play dumb with it. The school psy/counselor doesnt get much of a budget so they just make do with what they have.

On 1/05/11, Mary wrote: > So, copy rights don't apply? > > On 1/05/11, Dave -> Mary wrote: >> It's ...See MoreCopyright doesnt mean anything in Asia. In Europe it does but most of the private/international schools just play dumb with it. The school psy/counselor doesnt get much of a budget so they just make do with what they have.

On 1/05/11, Mary wrote: > So, copy rights don't apply? > > On 1/05/11, Dave -> Mary wrote: >> It's actually easier to obtain test materials and sample kits overseas. >> Just about every publisher in Tests and Measures, and measurements >> yearbook has a distributor/publisher in the regional area (U.K. for >> europe, and H.K. for Asia). Secondly, from a practical standpoint most >> international schools being private don't spend a lot on psychometrics. >> They usually have a sample kit, and they photo copy what they need, with >> the School Psy./Counselor hand scoring them. You have probabley noticed >> that most international schools post or advertise their Counselor/Psyc. >> position as a combined position. The reality is they just don't do a lot >> of testing. Most admins are familiar with I.Q. tests as measures of >> cognitive ability so you'll see the Wunderlich or the Stanford-Binnett >> (and its likely to be an old sample kit). You'll see the Strong Inventory >> (if its upper secondary), and probabley one of the depression/emotional >> disturbance assessments, thats about it. Most of a School Psy's duties >> will be those of a Counselor. >> >> On 1/04/11, Mary wrote: >>> I am not sure whether you want my opinion, but I think if you are >>> READY to get your application out there, it is worth the $200 for SA >>> and the $25 for International Schools Review. Even if you are not >>> ready, it is worth the $25 for ISR. >>> >>> As for DoDDS vs International Schools and the support issue, I am >>> coming from a family standpoint and not as a single adult. The >>> military has the evacuation protocol, supports for finding housing, >>> etc. However, I understand that there are some very supportive >>> international schools as well. >>> >>> in my field as a school psychologist, I think that ethically, I >>> should be working with someone at least within the same system who >>> can order the testing materials. I can do the the assessments, >>> consultation, etc., but, only those with PhDs in psychology can order >>> the materials. If an international school system already has this >>> part worked out, I would be interested, but I don't want to apply for >>> a position where I cannot work to my potential and using old >>> materials and not being able order testing protocols would not work >>> for me. >>> >>> I have continued to see international schools posting vacancies on >>> the NASP website, so I don't think I will need tojoing Search >>> Associates, but it seems to be worth it for teachers. >>> >>> On 1/03/11, Randall wrote: >>>> So having Dave and Debbie and Thomas chime in.... the answer is >>>> pay the money for the information?? >>>> >>>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Debbie wrote: >>>>> No problem. Hope you two had a great holiday. >>>>> >>>>> On 1/03/11, Debbie wrote: >>>>>> Hubby brought up going overseas again and wants to check out >>>>>> Beijing or Shanghai. We have things going on that have made >>>>>> us hesitate. I cannot give any details and the concern is >>>>>> still there in the back of my mind. My biggest concern is >>>>>> the medical. We just need to really talk about it and see >>>>>> where we go from here. It is nothing extreme, just a concern. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>> I agree, that's why I'd never teach in the US again. As >>>>>>> I've said before in >>>>>>> this forum, I dont think I could anyway. It's been long >>>>>>> enough that I'm not nearly up on my state regulation, >>>>>>> laws, assessments and programs that I'd know what I was >>>>>>> doing. I haven't had to really enforce a classroom >>>>>>> management plan in a long time. Not to mention >>>>>>> everything else with NCLB. I could probabley handle a >>>>>>> private IB school in the states, but they usually pay a >>>>>>> lot less then public schools and well the economy and >>>>>>> cost of living aren't that great. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I live and teach in Rome. I get to drink wine at lunch >>>>>>> on campus. I'm dating a scandalously young woman (she's >>>>>>> in her 20's me in my 30's). The food is AMAZING, the >>>>>>> people casual and cosmopolitan with an air of >>>>>>> sophistication. Life here is more about enjoying the >>>>>>> time we have... slowly, not climbing the ladder, or >>>>>>> seeing who has the most money and "stuff". >>>>>>> The night life is just exciting and sexy enough to >>>>>>> break the conundrum with work. I get to live in a city >>>>>>> that "IS" history. The bells of the Vatican, >>>>>>> the view of the Colosseum. As a foreigner I get a lot >>>>>>> of slack. No one expects you to know everything or even >>>>>>> a fraction of what the locals do, so I dont have to >>>>>>> bother with a lot of the details. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You know its like that in just about everywhere that I >>>>>>> have taught. Singapore I spent on the beach. China I >>>>>>> spent talking to people and making friends. Thailand I >>>>>>> spent being a hedonist. S. Korea was making money. >>>>>>> Japan was about respecting myself and others. Hong Kong >>>>>>> was shopping. Malaysia was about faith and the human >>>>>>> spirit in me (I went to Malaysia after Thailand), and >>>>>>> those are just the places I've taught. Why would I give >>>>>>> that up to go back to the states? Whats so great about >>>>>>> the states? Freedom, freedom to do what? Freedom to go >>>>>>> to Walmart and buy stuff made in Taiwan with my credit >>>>>>> card? Freedom of religion/speech? I lived in China and >>>>>>> never had anyone tell me I couldn't say anything or >>>>>>> keep me from going to Mass, though I'm a polite person >>>>>>> anyway. Democracy, as in picking between two candiates >>>>>>> that are both rich guys. Freedom to go to any doctor I >>>>>>> want (but can't afford to). Dont get me wrong I would >>>>>>> never want to not be an american, but personally I'd >>>>>>> prefer taking the status that comes with it and leaving >>>>>>> the fluff and red tape behind. Quite simply I want to >>>>>>> know the simple comfort of pleasure, and not just be >>>>>>> entertained. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On the DOD forum I always hear people say "I >>>>>>> wouldn't consider a position overseas if it wasn't a >>>>>>> DoDDS position, because of the support". Support >>>>>>> for what I always think to myself? It's really just >>>>>>> they want to be overseas, but they want it just like a >>>>>>> being a tourist, they want the "americanized" >>>>>>> version. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>> Good point. However, being a stateside teacher, >>>>>>>> teaching is no longer fun. Thank you NCLB!!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>>> Sure I considered it, then rejected the idea. Not >>>>>>>>> to be glib, but time is very important to me. I >>>>>>>>> like my 3 months off during the summer, my 3 weeks >>>>>>>>> at christmas, my week at thanksgiving, spring >>>>>>>>> break. Done by 4, and only 6 hours of actual >>>>>>>>> teaching work a day. Lastly, and this will sound >>>>>>>>> silly to anyone who isn't in the profession, but I >>>>>>>>> get to play all day. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Have you ever considered nonteaching jobs with >>>>>>>>>> DOD? When we were stationed in Germany, years >>>>>>>>>> ago, I knew several civilian employees who had >>>>>>>>>> full benefits (GS-11 positions) but were not >>>>>>>>>> teachers. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> I use too actually, but in the international >>>>>>>>>>> education market its a much shorter path to the >>>>>>>>>>> good money, and perks at the K-12 level. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> I'm proud of you Dave. Why aren't you >>>>>>>>>>>> teaching at the college level? You obviously >>>>>>>>>>>> enjoy academia. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> Yeah I got it. Well I'm putting them on my >>>>>>>>>>>>> credit card, and I'll pay them off over the >>>>>>>>>>>>> summer which is when I'm testing. I already >>>>>>>>>>>>> have 16 certifications. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, :) wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> "From a pragmatic view, it's a very >>>>>>>>>>>>>> inexpensive (both in time and money) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> means of building a resume (at least >>>>>>>>>>>>>> compared to other things." >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, more perfidious than pragmatic. How >>>>>>>>>>>>>> are you going to pay for this next round >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of certifications, Dave? And are these >>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications just on loan since they >>>>>>>>>>>>>> are not really yet paid for? (get it, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dave?...on loan?) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Thomas wrote: I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> enjoy introducing >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people to the idea/career path of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> international education as well. It's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> just if I call it a hooy I cant take a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tax write off on it. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well if I hadn't been collecting >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications, I wouldn't have had the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> job I have here in Italy (they were >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> very attracted to someone with such a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> versatile skill set). From a pragmatic >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> view, it's a very inexpensive (both in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> time and money) means of building a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> resume (at least compared to other >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> things. I have a B.A. with three >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> minors, three masters degrees, a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doctorate, an IB teaching award >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (certificate). What else is there to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do? Publish? Learn some languages? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Aside from more certifications I could >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> add AP certifications, but outside >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "american schools" IB is more >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> popular. Adding a teaching >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certification is pretty cheap and takes >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> half a day (each). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The dead languages are dead for a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reason. Though my Italian is starting >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to develop. I have a working grasp of 3 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> languages now (in addition to english), >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> french, mandarin, and italian. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I could NEVER teach dance. Art and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Theater are a so-so for me. I was >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> afraid that's what you were going to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> suggest. Do you really think the Gifted >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and Talented would add anything? I was >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> looking last night over the IB Dip. hex >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and adding art and theater would really >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> help me fill out the fine arts category >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Im already certified in music and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> speech). My problem would be what would >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I do if I was asked to teach it? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My certifications are out of Texas and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> California. What I do is take the tests >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in Texas (which cost $120 each) and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> then pay $77 to add them to my texas >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certificate (its one fee no matter how >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> many certifications you add). It cost >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the same amount to renew your >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certificate every 5 years. Then when I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have a years worth (about 6 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications) I transfer them to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> California and that costs about $57 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (again, its one fee no matter how many >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications you add). You can take >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Texas online tests anytime, and they >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have 4 paper based testing dates a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> year. You can take 2 tests per day. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> California no longer requires CPE >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> units. Texas requires 150 hours every 5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> years. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, D. Thomas wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, obviously overseas teaching is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my career/lifestyle (dare I say >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> calling). The talking/posting about >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it, reading about etc is the hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> part (although you could also say >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it's in my best interest to stay >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> current on the topic). I really do >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> enjoy getting other people excited >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about the idea though. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I could ask why you feel the need add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any more certifications, but that >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> would be crazy talk. You obviously >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> collect certifications and lay awake >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nights dreading the thought that you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could miss out on a job you want >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because you were not cross certified >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in underwater basket weaving and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Greco/Roman wrestling. Hey! Speaking >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of Greco/Roman, is it too late to get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> started on a whole dead language >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> motif? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Seriously though, I do think you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could be on to something with the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Arts, Dance, Theater and Gifted >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> combo. You would certainly be adding >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> an artsy, high brow component to your >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> portfolio and appealing to some of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> those super-elite schools we talk >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We've often talked about adding >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications in our home state >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> since it's all about testing, but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have never had the timing work out >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> right. Btw, how much does it cost you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to renew/keep current all of those >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certifications? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, Dave -> Thomas 2nd >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> response & problem >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: I didn't say it was you, but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I still have the taste of wine in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my nose. Honestly, I feel with you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they should give you a coffee mug. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well since we are both >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> international teachers who have >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> been for a number of years and we >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> make our livings at it, can we >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> really call it a "hobby"? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On another note I have a question >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for you, because its hard to find >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people to pick their brains on this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> who have the background and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> experience. Im registering to add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> another 2 teaching certification >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over the summer, and having 16 of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them, I'm running out of things to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> take. So heres the combinations >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Group A: Art, Theater, Dance, or >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gifted and Talented >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Group B: Agricultural Science, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Technology Education, Marketing >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can take 2 tests from group A, OR >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1 test from group A and 1 test from >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> group B. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My problem is this so far: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1) Marketing: Im already certified >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in Business Education, and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> marketing doesnt add a whole lot >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> since international schools dont >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even know there's a seperate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certification for it, so I dont >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> know if it would really add >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2) Technology Education: Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certified in Technology >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> APPLICATIONS and Computer Science. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tech Ed. is more like >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "shop" electronics, wood >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> working, machine shop, automotive. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Again no utility internationally. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3) Agricultural Science: Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a fully certified science teacher >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Bio, chem, physics, earth science) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and again internationally there is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> no demand or utility for Agi. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> science. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 4) Art, Dance, Theater. I could do >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them (the tests) but I have no >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> interest in teaching them and my >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> concern is that someone might ask >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me to teach them and the thing is I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cant draw (or paint), dance, or act >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to save my life (The tests are all >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> theory, multi choice). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 5) The Gifted and Talented seems >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like a no brainer, but Im already >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IB certified and it doesn't qualify >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me to teach AP, so again I dont see >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it adding very much. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My instinct is to go with the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gifted and Talented and the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marketing, but my brain is saying >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that Art, and Theater would make me >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more marketable (I'm pretty good at >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3-d art, stained glass is a hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of mine. I minored in theater as an >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> undergrad. Dance is my biggest fear >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in the world). My teacher friend >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> here in the US thinks that I should >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do the Tech Ed or Ag Science as it >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rounds out my science >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> qualifications (even though I can >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> take only one of them). What are >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your impressions??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/03/11, D. Thomas wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HEY! Shills get paid and SA has >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> never given me a dime or even a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> free membership (or even a coffee >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mug). I am not really impressed >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with anything about SA other than >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the detailed database, which is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hard to beat. I still like >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> looking at it to keep up with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> current trends, packages etc (and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm really nosy and the subject >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of int'l teaching is like a hobby >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I guess). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And even I don't usually provide a direct link. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 1/02/11, Dave -> Randall wrote: Most >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools don't disclose their >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> compensation package to people >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> who aren't candidates (called >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> being short listed). Some >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools (normally DOS or >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "American" schools) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do post their full compensation >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> package online. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I hate to shill for them >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (because another person on this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> board does it so well) but >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Search Associates (often simply >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> called SA) has a very >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> comprehensive database of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> schools full compensation >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> package. It costs $200 to join >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for three years and that's IF >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they accept you as a candidate. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Their website is: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [link removed]!

Jan 6, 2011

report post