Advice for Sensitive Issue

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Montessori Teachers Chatboard

Advice for Sensitive Issue

by MLC

Oct 19, 2011

I have a student in my class who has always been a bit difficult. He spends way too much time at home watching violent tv shows and video games. I've met with mom and dad on several occasions to limit exposure, with minimal results. I received two phone calls today from other parents saying their children are beside themselves b/c of something this boy said. It turns out he told one boy that there are monsters in hell and he's going to go there. He told another boy, who is Indian, that he's not going to heaven b/c he doesn't believe in Jesus. I've left a message on the parents' voicemail and am waiting for their call back. To be honest, I'm not even sure what to say at this point. What would be your next step with this boy? Unfortunately, I feel I'm losing my patience with his negativity, and he is destroying the peacefulness that typically pervades the classroom. Thank you for your time.

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maureen I think CS has given you excellent advice. You didn't say but is this an elementary aged child or a preschool aged child? Is this a public school? Is there anything in your parent handbook regarding this? You said you have always had difficulty with the child...in what way? Is the behavior escalating or is this aggressive verbal talk new? He sounds...See MoreI think CS has given you excellent advice. You didn't say but is this an elementary aged child or a preschool aged child? Is this a public school? Is there anything in your parent handbook regarding this? You said you have always had difficulty with the child...in what way? Is the behavior escalating or is this aggressive verbal talk new? He sounds like he is probably elementary age, right? I say that because how would a preschool aged child know to direct the "hell" comment to a child who is Indian. Of course, there are a lot of Indians who are Christian so he is not as worldly as he tries to come across.

Personally I think this sounds like something different then watching too much tv and playing video games. I wonder if his parents have the biases and are simply carrying those over to their son. I wonder why they even want their son in a Montessori school then? His comments reflect more of one of those fundamentalist Christian groups more then the tv or videos. He has been taught these things directly from a church or parents. Otherwise why would he even care enough to bring the subject up at school?

I believe it is the parents' rights to teach their children any religious beliefs they want. However, when it becomes disrespectful to others like he is doing, then he needs to stop. If the parents are not on board with you on this, the 1,2,3 probation period should be implemented.

I have had little things like this happen but since the children were preschool age, it wasn't difficult to get across to them that saying such things were disrespectful. I did know of a boy who used some pretty distasteful words that the parents did not see anything wrong with him using "because that is how we talk at home". The teacher told them at their called meeting that the rest of the parents of the children in their son's class did not talk like that. If the parents wanted their son to be invited over for playdates and birthday parties, the cussing HAD to stop". It did and the boy made a complete turn around with no relapses. (starting the next day after the meeting)

Good luck. I sure didn't like these kind of situations and dealing with parents who did not fit the Montessori parent model. I got better at screening at initial inquiries and those kinds of problems did not seem to crop up as much. However, if you are in a public Montessori school, you might not have as much flexibility in what you can or can't do. Let us know what happens, ok? maureen

Oct 19, 2011

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MLC Thank you, Ladies. As always, you give great advice.

Believe it or not, I'm referring to a third year primary student. He transferred to us mid-semester last year from another Montessori school. We only accept 4's and 5's if they're coming from another reputable Montessori school. After two interviews, we agreed this family would be great ...See MoreThank you, Ladies. As always, you give great advice.

Believe it or not, I'm referring to a third year primary student. He transferred to us mid-semester last year from another Montessori school. We only accept 4's and 5's if they're coming from another reputable Montessori school. After two interviews, we agreed this family would be great for our program. It turns out this boy is extremely intelligent and a master manipulator (as are his parents).

I finally got ahold of Dad and he completely supported his son, saying he didn't do anything wrong. (?!?!)

The behaviors I've observed in the past were mostly shooting games on the playground and bragging and competitive comments in the classroom. His outwardly violent behaviors have decreased since being in my school, but his underlying negative and defiant behaviors are always present. For some reason, the boys in the classroom practically worship him and try to mimic him always. This is why I am constantly observing him and redirecting him, because I'm afraid he's going to negatively influence the other children.

I pulled the boy aside this week and explained to him why this is a problem. By telling the other boy that if he's bad, he's going to be with the monsters in hell, he has created a lot of anxiety. Now, if the little boy steps on someone's work mat accidentally, I see the panic spread across his face because he thinks he's being "bad". "What is the definition of 'bad'", I asked him.

I've documented most of my observations of him and conversations with mom and dad. We do not have the 1, 2, 3 dismissal process, but I'm thinking of implementing it next year. I don't think it would be fair to the parents to start a new dismissal policy mid-year.

So, I've explained to dad how we feel this instance is completely inappropriate and if it happens again, we'll have to come up with an action plan to resolve this issue. Of course, it's difficult to come up with an action plan when we obviously will not get follow through at home. Dad mentioned that he doesn't see an issue with it because we teach about all religions in our school. I mentioned we teach the history and main components of different religions, we do not tell children what they can and cannot believe.

I guess I'll just keep observing and documenting...

Thanks again.

On 10/19/11, maureen wrote: > I think CS has given you excellent advice. You didn't say but is > this an elementary aged child or a preschool aged child? Is this > a public school? Is there anything in your parent handbook > regarding this? You said you have always had difficulty with the > child...in what way? Is the behavior escalating or is this > aggressive verbal talk new? He sounds like he is probably > elementary age, right? I say that because how would a preschool > aged child know to direct the "hell" comment to a child who is > Indian. Of course, there are a lot of Indians who are Christian > so he is not as worldly as he tries to come across. > > Personally I think this sounds like something different then > watching too much tv and playing video games. I wonder if his > parents have the biases and are simply carrying those over to > their son. I wonder why they even want their son in a Montessori > school then? His comments reflect more of one of those > fundamentalist Christian groups more then the tv or videos. He > has been taught these things directly from a church or parents. > Otherwise why would he even care enough to bring the subject up > at school? > > I believe it is the parents' rights to teach their children any > religious beliefs they want. However, when it becomes > disrespectful to others like he is doing, then he needs to stop. > If the parents are not on board with you on this, the 1,2,3 > probation period should be implemented. > > I have had little things like this happen but since the children > were preschool age, it wasn't difficult to get across to them > that saying such things were disrespectful. I did know of a boy > who used some pretty distasteful words that the parents did not > see anything wrong with him using "because that is how we talk at > home". The teacher told them at their called meeting that the > rest of the parents of the children in their son's class did not > talk like that. If the parents wanted their son to be invited > over for playdates and birthday parties, the cussing HAD to > stop". It did and the boy made a complete turn around with no > relapses. (starting the next day after the meeting) > > Good luck. I sure didn't like these kind of situations and > dealing with parents who did not fit the Montessori parent model. > I got better at screening at initial inquiries and those kinds of > problems did not seem to crop up as much. However, if you are in > a public Montessori school, you might not have as much > flexibility in what you can or can't do. Let us know what > happens, ok? maureen > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Oct 22, 2011

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maureen MLC - thanks for giving more info. You are in a difficult place now after you know where the father stands. You do bring up a good point though that warrants some discussion. It is in regards to your policy to accept new four and five year olds only if they come from "reputable" Montessori schools and are transferring.

You said that he tr...See MoreMLC - thanks for giving more info. You are in a difficult place now after you know where the father stands. You do bring up a good point though that warrants some discussion. It is in regards to your policy to accept new four and five year olds only if they come from "reputable" Montessori schools and are transferring.

You said that he transferred "mid semester" last year. Did they move there from somewhere else, or did they just decide to transfer mid year (without the move) RED FLAG if that is the case. I have learned from experience that I need to consider such things before accepting. I have gotten enough students transferring from another local school over the years, that I have found that just because the other school is "reputable" there is almost always a good reason why the parents want the transfer. Some parents are honest and most worked out many parents in this situation sensed that Montessori philosophy was not what they expected at the other school and were able to make their case plausible. Sometimes though there are "little?" things that are deliberately hidden from the new school.

Did you request the boy's records from his previous school before accepting? I have also learned to trust my gut instincts. We had four very difficult cases that I would never wish for anyone with "transfer" students. In three of those cases, the parents were negative about their remarks about the previous school experience. Guess what they did when they left us? Same thing.

Previous to these quite intense situations, I had always been so trusting and willing to take any child, no matter age, challenges anything, only to find in those particular cases that my trusting nature and belief that Montessori is for every child was challenged. I have had several special needs children with some very challenging behaviors in my classrooms but that was never a problem. I think that might have been the case because the parents were 100% behind me and the school.

However, when the "social" problems were introduced by those four children, and all related to home structure or lack of it and these were older children, it WAS a problem. I began to wish I had some social work background and a good technique and confidence to be able to work with parents in these very unique and difficult situations to guide them to family counselling or whatever it was that was needed. I worked in the same school with a Montessori teacher years ago, who had that background and I always marvelled at her ability to work through those situations with parents who were not "on board". She has been an extremely successful school director for many years now at a very large school.

In my case, my idealism was challenged and I had to really look within myself in order to find ways to work out the problems. I finally came to the conclusion that sometimes I was not able to work my magic and other professionals were needed. I have never turned down an enrollment, but in those four cases, I should have. I am not talking hindsight, but the red flags were there, yet I chose to believe that I could handle it. Before, I always could. Each case was very different from the other, but all were very serious.

I think I might have gone off on a tangent. I just wanted to go over some thoughts I have had about transfers and maybe someone will learn from my experience. I have had so many wonderful "new" four and five year olds who have not even had Montessori experience enter my classrooms over the years. I remember each one and treasure the year or years I had with them and their families. However, when I think of those four students and the negative impact it had on a small school, I have to think that I got in over my head those times. I had chosen to ignore the red flags and I got what happened.

I do hope that you can work out your situation with your little man. It isn't going to be easy, but it's always possible. Thanks for sharing your situation and give us all points to consider.

Oct 23, 2011

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MLC Thanks for your insights, Maureen. This boy tranferred from a different state, but I can see your point with local transfers.

I have also had a few wonderful older students who have enriched the classroom with their new and different way of looking at the materials. However, caution must be exercised when accepting them (so I've recently f...See MoreThanks for your insights, Maureen. This boy tranferred from a different state, but I can see your point with local transfers.

I have also had a few wonderful older students who have enriched the classroom with their new and different way of looking at the materials. However, caution must be exercised when accepting them (so I've recently found out) and maybe several interviews should be conducted with these families.

I'll stay positive and try to find the peacefulness that is in there somewhere!!!

On 10/23/11, maureen wrote: > MLC - thanks for giving more info. You are in a difficult place now > after you know where the father stands. You do bring up a good point > though that warrants some discussion. It is in regards to your policy > to accept new four and five year olds only if they come > from "reputable" Montessori schools and are transferring. > > You said that he transferred "mid semester" last year. Did they move > there from somewhere else, or did they just decide to transfer mid year > (without the move) RED FLAG if that is the case. I have learned from > experience that I need to consider such things before accepting. I have > gotten enough students transferring from another local school over the > years, that I have found that just because the other school > is "reputable" there is almost always a good reason why the parents > want the transfer. Some parents are honest and most worked out many > parents in this situation sensed that Montessori philosophy was not > what they expected at the other school and were able to make their case > plausible. Sometimes though there are "little?" things that are > deliberately hidden from the new school. > > Did you request the boy's records from his previous school before > accepting? I have also learned to trust my gut instincts. We had four > very difficult cases that I would never wish for anyone with "transfer" > students. In three of those cases, the parents were negative about > their remarks about the previous school experience. Guess what they did > when they left us? Same thing. > > Previous to these quite intense situations, I had always been so > trusting and willing to take any child, no matter age, challenges > anything, only to find in those particular cases that my trusting > nature and belief that Montessori is for every child was challenged. I > have had several special needs children with some very challenging > behaviors in my classrooms but that was never a problem. I think that > might have been the case because the parents were 100% behind me and > the school. > > However, when the "social" problems were introduced by those four > children, and all related to home structure or lack of it and these > were older children, it WAS a problem. I began to wish I had some > social work background and a good technique and confidence to be able > to work with parents in these very unique and difficult situations to > guide them to family counselling or whatever it was that was needed. I > worked in the same school with a Montessori teacher years ago, who had > that background and I always marvelled at her ability to work through > those situations with parents who were not "on board". She has been an > extremely successful school director for many years now at a very large > school. > > In my case, my idealism was challenged and I had to really look within > myself in order to find ways to work out the problems. I finally came > to the conclusion that sometimes I was not able to work my magic and > other professionals were needed. I have never turned down an > enrollment, but in those four cases, I should have. I am not talking > hindsight, but the red flags were there, yet I chose to believe that I > could handle it. Before, I always could. Each case was very different > from the other, but all were very serious. > > I think I might have gone off on a tangent. I just wanted to go over > some thoughts I have had about transfers and maybe someone will learn > from my experience. I have had so many wonderful "new" four and five > year olds who have not even had Montessori experience enter my > classrooms over the years. I remember each one and treasure the year or > years I had with them and their families. However, when I think of > those four students and the negative impact it had on a small school, I > have to think that I got in over my head those times. I had chosen to > ignore the red flags and I got what happened. > > I do hope that you can work out your situation with your little man. It > isn't going to be easy, but it's always possible. Thanks for sharing > your situation and give us all points to consider. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Oct 23, 2011

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retired Montessori teacher.... In addition, this child most likely has significant issues; special needs. You may be the "one" that needs to get some of the services he needs set into motion...not an easy task...especially in a small school. Children's behaviors are purpose driven (behaviors do not occur in a vaccum...there is a reason)...sometimes children just need more help t...See More

Nov 2, 2011

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