My advice to Teachers: from a Tour Company owner

by terreeteau

May 21, 2010

I haven't been on this board in awhile but as I read the newer entries I still see the same theme repeated; people are dissatisfied with their educational travel experience. As a company owner, this concerns me. I sincerely believe in the amazing value of these experiences and want to do my part to ensure that teachers and group leaders share this feeling.

Please read my original post below and let me know what you think. THANKS DAVE

Hey,

I stumbled accross this by accident and thought I could perhaps add some insight. I've worked in the student tour industry for some time and have -full disclosure- recently started my own company here in Canada.

Part of my motivation in starting my own company is reflected by the numerous negative experiences recounted on the board.

I agree with the notion that you're always rolling the dice with these types of visits; there are so many variables that can add or detract from the overall enjoyment of the e...See MoreI haven't been on this board in awhile but as I read the newer entries I still see the same theme repeated; people are dissatisfied with their educational travel experience. As a company owner, this concerns me. I sincerely believe in the amazing value of these experiences and want to do my part to ensure that teachers and group leaders share this feeling.

Please read my original post below and let me know what you think. THANKS DAVE

Hey,

I stumbled accross this by accident and thought I could perhaps add some insight. I've worked in the student tour industry for some time and have -full disclosure- recently started my own company here in Canada.

Part of my motivation in starting my own company is reflected by the numerous negative experiences recounted on the board.

I agree with the notion that you're always rolling the dice with these types of visits; there are so many variables that can add or detract from the overall enjoyment of the experience. A bad hotel, guide, meal or bus driver might be enough to have you question repeating the process.

This whole EF vs. Explorica debate can really be boiled down to a question of giant companies. When everything goes well, the customer is happy. As soon as you have a problem, their true colours come through. Now you're dealing with 'fine print' and an endless procession of people that can't (or won't) help you.

Really, the best analogy is that EF and Explorica are fast food: you get a tremendous infrastructure, great prices, incentives and prizes. These companies deal in volume; to the degree that they expect to lose a certain percentage of their clients each year due to negligence.

A smaller student travel provider can offer a more humane approach. For them, client loyalty is paramount. The intent is to forge a long term, mutually-beneficial relationship. For that reason any problems (there will be some!), can be dealt with in a constructive manner and -without an oppressive hierarchy in place- a direct way. For example, my client had some students drop out and made some changes to the original itinerary that increased the price by $20 per person. Rather than go back to the parents for the difference, we met in the middle at a $10 increase. Simple and fair.

The only advice I would give to teachers is to look for a company that specializes in your destination of choice rather than a monolith that tries to be all things to all people. The process is long, challenging and expensive; you deserve a visit that is tailored to your needs.

Any comments are welcome Thanks! DT

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Instructours I agree completely with Dave.

While I am not a tour operator, I design student tours professionally and work with a number of tour operators. All my school clients have been totally dissatisfied with the quality of services from large tour operators- which is why they want someone else to design their educational tours.

I see, f...See MoreI agree completely with Dave.

While I am not a tour operator, I design student tours professionally and work with a number of tour operators. All my school clients have been totally dissatisfied with the quality of services from large tour operators- which is why they want someone else to design their educational tours.

I see, firsthand, how student tour groups are dumped and herded by large companies. I cannot tell you how often I am stopped by teachers and parents, in Washington, DC and New York, and asked for directions, where they can eat, or how to get into places. Hordes of clueless students run wild through the Smithsonian museums without any guidance or focus. These situations are not indicative of trips sponsored through good companies.

As with Dave, I've been following many of the discussions on this board with interest.

I don't agree with the poster who calls himself/herself, 'Observer' that there is only a small percentage of complaints with these large companies. The fact is, good people seldom complain online, so that the number of complaints on these sites reflects a much larger number of dissatisfied customers. After a while, patterns emerge that should not be ignored. (Most of my clients simply dropped the offending company and didn't register with the BBB or online complaint sites so they wouldn't be hassled by the respective companies.)

Many teachers don't realize that there are alternative ways to run a trip because just a few big companies dominate the industry and, as a result, there is not much choice of destination, itinerary, or vendors. In fact, the same, exact, itineraries are utilized by most of the large companies.

Teachers need to be a bit more thoughtful about the choice of the tour company and not rely on glitzy advertising and 'stipends'. These extravagant marketing tools should send up a red flag that more goes into advertising than the tour.

Bigger is not better. I only work through small and mid-sized companies since many, like Dave's company (which I have not worked with), have more practical expertise in the areas, or regions, they are operating because they are owned and run by tour professionals rather than sales people; have lower overhead and less profit margins since they are not supporting a large infrastructure; have better vendors and vendor relationships (hotels, restaurants, motorcoaches, and guides; and care more about the comfort and safety of their groups.

The subject of contracts has also come up in some older posts by teachers. This is one of the most important parts of the process.

Good companies are able to give you a solid quote upfront with nothing additional down the line unless the number of travelers drops (as in the case Dave put forth). Good companies listen to what you want and try to accommodate your needs, especially with securing appointments. Good companies don't have membership fees. Good companies give cash refunds. Good companies are flexible where payments are concerned and don't summarily cancel students 60 days or less before as trip. Good companies put all their promises in writing, and then deliver what they promise. Good companies pay their bills on time (check this out with Dun and Bradstreet. Good companies have excellent company liability insurance and offer travel/medical/cancellation insurance underwritten by a bona fide insurance company which is rated by A.M. Best.(Accept nothing less than a 'A' rating. If it's not rated by A.M. Best, it's not real insurance.)

My advice to any teacher is to surf the internet by putting in search terms that would describe the perfect trip and destination. You'll be surprised at how many smaller companies surface. Check them out against the BBB, contact teachers that have traveled with them, and have a professional go over their contract and insurance.

Good luck!

On 5/21/10, terreeteau wrote: > I haven't been on this board in awhile but as I read the > newer entries I still see the same theme repeated; people > are dissatisfied with their educational travel experience. > As a company owner, this concerns me. I sincerely believe > in the amazing value of these experiences and want to do my > part to ensure that teachers and group leaders share this > feeling. > > Please read my original post below and let me know what you > think. > THANKS > DAVE > > Hey, > > I stumbled accross this by accident and thought I could > perhaps add some insight. > I've worked in the student tour industry for some time and > have -full disclosure- > recently started my own company here in Canada. > > Part of my motivation in starting my own company is > reflected by the numerous > negative experiences recounted on the board. > > I agree with the notion that you're always rolling the dice > with these types of > visits; there are so many variables that can add or detract > from the overall > enjoyment of the experience. A bad hotel, guide, meal or > bus driver might be enough > to have you question repeating the process. > > This whole EF vs. Explorica debate can really be boiled > down to a question of giant > companies. When everything goes well, the customer is > happy. As soon as you have a > problem, their true colours come through. Now you're > dealing with 'fine print' and > an endless procession of people that can't (or won't) help > you. > > Really, the best analogy is that EF and Explorica are fast > food: you get a > tremendous infrastructure, great prices, incentives and > prizes. These companies deal > in volume; to the degree that they expect to lose a certain > percentage of their > clients each year due to negligence. > > A smaller student travel provider can offer a more humane > approach. For them, client > loyalty is paramount. The intent is to forge a long term, > mutually-beneficial > relationship. For that reason any problems (there will be > some!), can be dealt with > in a constructive manner and -without an oppressive > hierarchy in place- a direct > way. For example, my client had some students drop out and > made some changes to the > original itinerary that increased the price by $20 per > person. Rather than go back > to the parents for the difference, we met in the middle at > a $10 increase. Simple > and fair. > > The only advice I would give to teachers is to look for a > company that specializes > in your destination of choice rather than a monolith that > tries to be all things to > all people. The process is long, challenging and expensive; > you deserve a visit that > is tailored to your needs. > > Any comments are welcome > Thanks! > DT > > >

May 25, 2010

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Dick Ok anyone reading this, here is the scoop:

The big tour companies are like Walmart. Yes, there are many disadvantageous to using them, but they have the lowest prices (regardless of teacher kick-backs, etc.). The little mom and pop tour companies are more ideal but much more expensive. This aint rocket science folks. If the students can af...See MoreOk anyone reading this, here is the scoop:

The big tour companies are like Walmart. Yes, there are many disadvantageous to using them, but they have the lowest prices (regardless of teacher kick-backs, etc.). The little mom and pop tour companies are more ideal but much more expensive. This aint rocket science folks. If the students can afford the mom and pop companies (Georgia Hardy in Canada is a perfect example) then by all means use them. Who wouldn't choose a specialty store over Walmart? If the students can barely afford the tours the large companies offer, then the small tour operators are not an option. Do people not see this? It is pretty simple to figure out. You cant have your cake and eat it too.

On 5/25/10, Instructours wrote: > I agree completely with Dave. > > While I am not a tour operator, I design student tours > professionally and work with a number of tour operators. All > my school clients have been totally dissatisfied with the > quality of services from large tour operators- which is why > they want someone else to design their educational tours. > > I see, firsthand, how student tour groups are dumped and > herded by large companies. I cannot tell you how often I am > stopped by teachers and parents, in Washington, DC and New > York, and asked for directions, where they can eat, or how to > get into places. Hordes of clueless students run wild through > the Smithsonian museums without any guidance or focus. These > situations are not indicative of trips sponsored through > good companies. > > As with Dave, I've been following many of the discussions on > this board with interest. > > I don't agree with the poster who calls himself/herself, > 'Observer' that there is only a small percentage of complaints > with these large companies. The fact is, good people seldom > complain online, so that the number of complaints on these > sites reflects a much larger number of dissatisfied customers. > After a while, patterns emerge that should not be ignored. > (Most of my clients simply dropped the offending company and > didn't register with the BBB or online complaint sites so they > wouldn't be hassled by the respective companies.) > > Many teachers don't realize that there are alternative ways to > run a trip because just a few big companies dominate the > industry and, as a result, there is not much choice of > destination, itinerary, or vendors. In fact, the same, exact, > itineraries are utilized by most of the large companies. > > Teachers need to be a bit more thoughtful about the choice of > the tour company and not rely on glitzy advertising and > 'stipends'. These extravagant marketing tools should send up > a red flag that more goes into advertising than the tour. > > Bigger is not better. I only work through small and mid-sized > companies since many, like Dave's company (which I have not > worked with), have more practical expertise in the areas, or > regions, they are operating because they are owned and run by > tour professionals rather than sales people; have lower > overhead and less profit margins since they are not supporting > a large infrastructure; have better vendors and vendor > relationships (hotels, restaurants, motorcoaches, and guides; > and care more about the comfort and safety of their groups. > > The subject of contracts has also come up in some older posts > by teachers. This is one of the most important parts of the > process. > > Good companies are able to give you a solid quote upfront with > nothing additional down the line unless the number of > travelers drops (as in the case Dave put forth). Good > companies listen to what you want and try to accommodate your > needs, especially with securing appointments. Good companies > don't have membership fees. Good companies give cash refunds. > Good companies are flexible where payments are concerned and > don't summarily cancel students 60 days or less before as > trip. Good companies put all their promises in writing, and > then deliver what they promise. Good companies pay their > bills on time (check this out with Dun and Bradstreet. Good > companies have excellent company liability insurance and > offer travel/medical/cancellation insurance underwritten by a > bona fide insurance company which is rated by A.M. > Best.(Accept nothing less than a 'A' rating. If it's not > rated by A.M. Best, it's not real insurance.) > > My advice to any teacher is to surf the internet by putting in > search terms that would describe the perfect trip and > destination. You'll be surprised at how many smaller companies > surface. Check them out against the BBB, contact teachers > that have traveled with them, and have a professional go over > their contract and insurance. > > Good luck! > > > > On 5/21/10, terreeteau wrote: >> I haven't been on this board in awhile but as I read the >> newer entries I still see the same theme repeated; people >> are dissatisfied with their educational travel experience. >> As a company owner, this concerns me. I sincerely believe >> in the amazing value of these experiences and want to do my >> part to ensure that teachers and group leaders share this >> feeling. >> >> Please read my original post below and let me know what you >> think. >> THANKS >> DAVE >> >> Hey, >> >> I stumbled accross this by accident and thought I could >> perhaps add some insight. >> I've worked in the student tour industry for some time and >> have -full disclosure- >> recently started my own company here in Canada. >> >> Part of my motivation in starting my own company is >> reflected by the numerous >> negative experiences recounted on the board. >> >> I agree with the notion that you're always rolling the dice >> with these types of >> visits; there are so many variables that can add or detract >> from the overall >> enjoyment of the experience. A bad hotel, guide, meal or >> bus driver might be enough >> to have you question repeating the process. >> >> This whole EF vs. Explorica debate can really be boiled >> down to a question of giant >> companies. When everything goes well, the customer is >> happy. As soon as you have a >> problem, their true colours come through. Now you're >> dealing with 'fine print' and >> an endless procession of people that can't (or won't) help >> you. >> >> Really, the best analogy is that EF and Explorica are fast >> food: you get a >> tremendous infrastructure, great prices, incentives and >> prizes. These companies deal >> in volume; to the degree that they expect to lose a certain >> percentage of their >> clients each year due to negligence. >> >> A smaller student travel provider can offer a more humane >> approach. For them, client >> loyalty is paramount. The intent is to forge a long term, >> mutually-beneficial >> relationship. For that reason any problems (there will be >> some!), can be dealt with >> in a constructive manner and -without an oppressive >> hierarchy in place- a direct >> way. For example, my client had some students drop out and >> made some changes to the >> original itinerary that increased the price by $20 per >> person. Rather than go back >> to the parents for the difference, we met in the middle at >> a $10 increase. Simple >> and fair. >> >> The only advice I would give to teachers is to look for a >> company that specializes >> in your destination of choice rather than a monolith that >> tries to be all things to >> all people. The process is long, challenging and expensive; >> you deserve a visit that >> is tailored to your needs. >> >> Any comments are welcome >> Thanks! >> DT >> >> >>

Jun 11, 2010

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mslutheran You are quite wrong on this. The 'mom and pop' companies do not have the huge overhead and expenses that the big companies do.

We found that out when we 'shopped' the same itinerary to a number of companies and the large ones could not touch the price we were getting for our trip through our current company. We get better value for our mo...See MoreYou are quite wrong on this. The 'mom and pop' companies do not have the huge overhead and expenses that the big companies do.

We found that out when we 'shopped' the same itinerary to a number of companies and the large ones could not touch the price we were getting for our trip through our current company. We get better value for our money through the smaller companies.

We have also compared our trip against the ones that the local middle and high schools are doing with the large companies and ours is cheaper, has better hotels and restaurants, and more educational activities.

On 6/11/10, Dick wrote: > Ok anyone reading this, here is the scoop: > > The big tour companies are like Walmart. Yes, there are many > disadvantageous to using them, but they have the lowest prices > (regardless of teacher kick-backs, etc.). The little mom and pop > tour companies are more ideal but much more expensive. This aint > rocket science folks. If the students can afford the mom and pop > companies (Georgia Hardy in Canada is a perfect example) then by > all means use them. Who wouldn't choose a specialty store over > Walmart? If the students can barely afford the tours the large > companies offer, then the small tour operators are not an option. > Do people not see this? It is pretty simple to figure out. You > cant have your cake and eat it too. > > > > > > On 5/25/10, Instructours wrote: >> I agree completely with Dave. >> >> While I am not a tour operator, I design student tours >> professionally and work with a number of tour operators. All >> my school clients have been totally dissatisfied with the >> quality of services from large tour operators- which is why >> they want someone else to design their educational tours. >> >> I see, firsthand, how student tour groups are dumped and >> herded by large companies. I cannot tell you how often I am >> stopped by teachers and parents, in Washington, DC and New >> York, and asked for directions, where they can eat, or how to >> get into places. Hordes of clueless students run wild through >> the Smithsonian museums without any guidance or focus. These >> situations are not indicative of trips sponsored through >> good companies. >> >> As with Dave, I've been following many of the discussions on >> this board with interest. >> >> I don't agree with the poster who calls himself/herself, >> 'Observer' that there is only a small percentage of complaints >> with these large companies. The fact is, good people seldom >> complain online, so that the number of complaints on these >> sites reflects a much larger number of dissatisfied customers. >> After a while, patterns emerge that should not be ignored. >> (Most of my clients simply dropped the offending company and >> didn't register with the BBB or online complaint sites so they >> wouldn't be hassled by the respective companies.) >> >> Many teachers don't realize that there are alternative ways to >> run a trip because just a few big companies dominate the >> industry and, as a result, there is not much choice of >> destination, itinerary, or vendors. In fact, the same, exact, >> itineraries are utilized by most of the large companies. >> >> Teachers need to be a bit more thoughtful about the choice of >> the tour company and not rely on glitzy advertising and >> 'stipends'. These extravagant marketing tools should send up >> a red flag that more goes into advertising than the tour. >> >> Bigger is not better. I only work through small and mid-sized >> companies since many, like Dave's company (which I have not >> worked with), have more practical expertise in the areas, or >> regions, they are operating because they are owned and run by >> tour professionals rather than sales people; have lower >> overhead and less profit margins since they are not supporting >> a large infrastructure; have better vendors and vendor >> relationships (hotels, restaurants, motorcoaches, and guides; >> and care more about the comfort and safety of their groups. >> >> The subject of contracts has also come up in some older posts >> by teachers. This is one of the most important parts of the >> process. >> >> Good companies are able to give you a solid quote upfront with >> nothing additional down the line unless the number of >> travelers drops (as in the case Dave put forth). Good >> companies listen to what you want and try to accommodate your >> needs, especially with securing appointments. Good companies >> don't have membership fees. Good companies give cash refunds. >> Good companies are flexible where payments are concerned and >> don't summarily cancel students 60 days or less before as >> trip. Good companies put all their promises in writing, and >> then deliver what they promise. Good companies pay their >> bills on time (check this out with Dun and Bradstreet. Good >> companies have excellent company liability insurance and >> offer travel/medical/cancellation insurance underwritten by a >> bona fide insurance company which is rated by A.M. >> Best.(Accept nothing less than a 'A' rating. If it's not >> rated by A.M. Best, it's not real insurance.) >> >> My advice to any teacher is to surf the internet by putting in >> search terms that would describe the perfect trip and >> destination. You'll be surprised at how many smaller companies >> surface. Check them out against the BBB, contact teachers >> that have traveled with them, and have a professional go over >> their contract and insurance. >> >> Good luck! >> >> >> >> On 5/21/10, terreeteau wrote: >>> I haven't been on this board in awhile but as I read the >>> newer entries I still see the same theme repeated; people >>> are dissatisfied with their educational travel experience. >>> As a company owner, this concerns me. I sincerely believe >>> in the amazing value of these experiences and want to do my >>> part to ensure that teachers and group leaders share this >>> feeling. >>> >>> Please read my original post below and let me know what you >>> think. >>> THANKS >>> DAVE >>> >>> Hey, >>> >>> I stumbled accross this by accident and thought I could >>> perhaps add some insight. >>> I've worked in the student tour industry for some time and >>> have -full disclosure- >>> recently started my own company here in Canada. >>> >>> Part of my motivation in starting my own company is >>> reflected by the numerous >>> negative experiences recounted on the board. >>> >>> I agree with the notion that you're always rolling the dice >>> with these types of >>> visits; there are so many variables that can add or detract >>> from the overall >>> enjoyment of the experience. A bad hotel, guide, meal or >>> bus driver might be enough >>> to have you question repeating the process. >>> >>> This whole EF vs. Explorica debate can really be boiled >>> down to a question of giant >>> companies. When everything goes well, the customer is >>> happy. As soon as you have a >>> problem, their true colours come through. Now you're >>> dealing with 'fine print' and >>> an endless procession of people that can't (or won't) help >>> you. >>> >>> Really, the best analogy is that EF and Explorica are fast >>> food: you get a >>> tremendous infrastructure, great prices, incentives and >>> prizes. These companies deal >>> in volume; to the degree that they expect to lose a certain >>> percentage of their >>> clients each year due to negligence. >>> >>> A smaller student travel provider can offer a more humane >>> approach. For them, client >>> loyalty is paramount. The intent is to forge a long term, >>> mutually-beneficial >>> relationship. For that reason any problems (there will be >>> some!), can be dealt with >>> in a constructive manner and -without an oppressive >>> hierarchy in place- a direct >>> way. For example, my client had some students drop out and >>> made some changes to the >>> original itinerary that increased the price by $20 per >>> person. Rather than go back >>> to the parents for the difference, we met in the middle at >>> a $10 increase. Simple >>> and fair. >>> >>> The only advice I would give to teachers is to look for a >>> company that specializes >>> in your destination of choice rather than a monolith that >>> tries to be all things to >>> all people. The process is long, challenging and expensive; >>> you deserve a visit that >>> is tailored to your needs. >>> >>> Any comments are welcome >>> Thanks! >>> DT >>> >>> >>>

Jun 14, 2010

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Dick Sorry Mr or Mrs Lutheran, but I am not wrong. I have shopped around. There is one company out there, and I wont name names, but all I have to do is send a quote by any other company and they will match it and beat it by $50 per student. I am not here to dis the mom and pop tour operators of the world. May they have lots of success. I am out for the...See MoreSorry Mr or Mrs Lutheran, but I am not wrong. I have shopped around. There is one company out there, and I wont name names, but all I have to do is send a quote by any other company and they will match it and beat it by $50 per student. I am not here to dis the mom and pop tour operators of the world. May they have lots of success. I am out for the BEST and LOWEST price for my students, and that is what I achieve yearly, and we have mighty fine tours. No offense.

On 6/14/10, mslutheran wrote: > You are quite wrong on this. The 'mom and pop' companies do not > have the huge overhead and expenses that the big companies do. > > We found that out when we 'shopped' the same itinerary to a number > of companies and the large ones could not touch the price we were > getting for our trip through our current company. We get better > value for our money through the smaller companies. > > We have also compared our trip against the ones that the local > middle and high schools are doing with the large companies and ours > is cheaper, has better hotels and restaurants, and more educational > activities. > > On 6/11/10, Dick wrote: >> Ok anyone reading this, here is the scoop: >> >> The big tour companies are like Walmart. Yes, there are many >> disadvantageous to using them, but they have the lowest prices >> (regardless of teacher kick-backs, etc.). The little mom and pop >> tour companies are more ideal but much more expensive. This aint >> rocket science folks. If the students can afford the mom and pop >> companies (Georgia Hardy in Canada is a perfect example) then by >> all means use them. Who wouldn't choose a specialty store over >> Walmart? If the students can barely afford the tours the large >> companies offer, then the small tour operators are not an option. >> Do people not see this? It is pretty simple to figure out. You >> cant have your cake and eat it too. >> >> >> >> >> >> On 5/25/10, Instructours wrote: >>> I agree completely with Dave. >>> >>> While I am not a tour operator, I design student tours >>> professionally and work with a number of tour operators. All >>> my school clients have been totally dissatisfied with the >>> quality of services from large tour operators- which is why >>> they want someone else to design their educational tours. >>> >>> I see, firsthand, how student tour groups are dumped and >>> herded by large companies. I cannot tell you how often I am >>> stopped by teachers and parents, in Washington, DC and New >>> York, and asked for directions, where they can eat, or how to >>> get into places. Hordes of clueless students run wild through >>> the Smithsonian museums without any guidance or focus. These >>> situations are not indicative of trips sponsored through >>> good companies. >>> >>> As with Dave, I've been following many of the discussions on >>> this board with interest. >>> >>> I don't agree with the poster who calls himself/herself, >>> 'Observer' that there is only a small percentage of complaints >>> with these large companies. The fact is, good people seldom >>> complain online, so that the number of complaints on these >>> sites reflects a much larger number of dissatisfied customers. >>> After a while, patterns emerge that should not be ignored. >>> (Most of my clients simply dropped the offending company and >>> didn't register with the BBB or online complaint sites so they >>> wouldn't be hassled by the respective companies.) >>> >>> Many teachers don't realize that there are alternative ways to >>> run a trip because just a few big companies dominate the >>> industry and, as a result, there is not much choice of >>> destination, itinerary, or vendors. In fact, the same, exact, >>> itineraries are utilized by most of the large companies. >>> >>> Teachers need to be a bit more thoughtful about the choice of >>> the tour company and not rely on glitzy advertising and >>> 'stipends'. These extravagant marketing tools should send up >>> a red flag that more goes into advertising than the tour. >>> >>> Bigger is not better. I only work through small and mid-sized >>> companies since many, like Dave's company (which I have not >>> worked with), have more practical expertise in the areas, or >>> regions, they are operating because they are owned and run by >>> tour professionals rather than sales people; have lower >>> overhead and less profit margins since they are not supporting >>> a large infrastructure; have better vendors and vendor >>> relationships (hotels, restaurants, motorcoaches, and guides; >>> and care more about the comfort and safety of their groups. >>> >>> The subject of contracts has also come up in some older posts >>> by teachers. This is one of the most important parts of the >>> process. >>> >>> Good companies are able to give you a solid quote upfront with >>> nothing additional down the line unless the number of >>> travelers drops (as in the case Dave put forth). Good >>> companies listen to what you want and try to accommodate your >>> needs, especially with securing appointments. Good companies >>> don't have membership fees. Good companies give cash refunds. >>> Good companies are flexible where payments are concerned and >>> don't summarily cancel students 60 days or less before as >>> trip. Good companies put all their promises in writing, and >>> then deliver what they promise. Good companies pay their >>> bills on time (check this out with Dun and Bradstreet. Good >>> companies have excellent company liability insurance and >>> offer travel/medical/cancellation insurance underwritten by a >>> bona fide insurance company which is rated by A.M. >>> Best.(Accept nothing less than a 'A' rating. If it's not >>> rated by A.M. Best, it's not real insurance.) >>> >>> My advice to any teacher is to surf the internet by putting in >>> search terms that would describe the perfect trip and >>> destination. You'll be surprised at how many smaller companies >>> surface. Check them out against the BBB, contact teachers >>> that have traveled with them, and have a professional go over >>> their contract and insurance. >>> >>> Good luck! >>> >>> >>> >>> On 5/21/10, terreeteau wrote: >>>> I haven't been on this board in awhile but as I read the >>>> newer entries I still see the same theme repeated; people >>>> are dissatisfied with their educational travel experience. >>>> As a company owner, this concerns me. I sincerely believe >>>> in the amazing value of these experiences and want to do my >>>> part to ensure that teachers and group leaders share this >>>> feeling. >>>> >>>> Please read my original post below and let me know what you >>>> think. >>>> THANKS >>>> DAVE >>>> >>>> Hey, >>>> >>>> I stumbled accross this by accident and thought I could >>>> perhaps add some insight. >>>> I've worked in the student tour industry for some time and >>>> have -full disclosure- >>>> recently started my own company here in Canada. >>>> >>>> Part of my motivation in starting my own company is >>>> reflected by the numerous >>>> negative experiences recounted on the board. >>>> >>>> I agree with the notion that you're always rolling the dice >>>> with these types of >>>> visits; there are so many variables that can add or detract >>>> from the overall >>>> enjoyment of the experience. A bad hotel, guide, meal or >>>> bus driver might be enough >>>> to have you question repeating the process. >>>> >>>> This whole EF vs. Explorica debate can really be boiled >>>> down to a question of giant >>>> companies. When everything goes well, the customer is >>>> happy. As soon as you have a >>>> problem, their true colours come through. Now you're >>>> dealing with 'fine print' and >>>> an endless procession of people that can't (or won't) help >>>> you. >>>> >>>> Really, the best analogy is that EF and Explorica are fast >>>> food: you get a >>>> tremendous infrastructure, great prices, incentives and >>>> prizes. These companies deal >>>> in volume; to the degree that they expect to lose a certain >>>> percentage of their >>>> clients each year due to negligence. >>>> >>>> A smaller student travel provider can offer a more humane >>>> approach. For them, client >>>> loyalty is paramount. The intent is to forge a long term, >>>> mutually-beneficial >>>> relationship. For that reason any problems (there will be >>>> some!), can be dealt with >>>> in a constructive manner and -without an oppressive >>>> hierarchy in place- a direct >>>> way. For example, my client had some students drop out and >>>> made some changes to the >>>> original itinerary that increased the price by $20 per >>>> person. Rather than go back >>>> to the parents for the difference, we met in the middle at >>>> a $10 increase. Simple >>>> and fair. >>>> >>>> The only advice I would give to teachers is to look for a >>>> company that specializes >>>> in your destination of choice rather than a monolith that >>>> tries to be all things to >>>> all people. The process is long, challenging and expensive; >>>> you deserve a visit that >>>> is tailored to your needs. >>>> >>>> Any comments are welcome >>>> Thanks! >>>> DT >>>> >>>> >>>>

Jun 24, 2010

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Cari I wish there was a perfect recipe for a perfect student tour every time. It seems each company has its own way of doing things, and it takes a seasoned veteran teacher to cut through all the marketing tactics in order to do the best job for one's students. That said...teachers with little travel experience MUST do their homework. Teachers must do t...See MoreI wish there was a perfect recipe for a perfect student tour every time. It seems each company has its own way of doing things, and it takes a seasoned veteran teacher to cut through all the marketing tactics in order to do the best job for one's students. That said...teachers with little travel experience MUST do their homework. Teachers must do the heavy lifting and commit to a structured, educational, positive trip. Every trip has its disappointments: rain, cold, heat, crowds, long lines, delays, so-so guides, public transportation, lots of stairs and walking. So, you heard it here, teachers....prepare for the disappointments with a positive attitude. Make the best of it. Travel is not as glamorous as you might think...however, it still can be very rewarding if done with a positive attitude. I am not a tour company owner, however, I have been traveling with my French students for over thirty years with these companies: ALSG, EF, ACIS, NETC, Passports, Mariden, and Explorica. As a high schooler, I even remember traveling with Foreign Study League in 1969....anyone old enough to remember that company? All I can say is that it takes more than a good company for a great trip. It takes a patient, mature teacher who is willing to go the extra mile for his/her students.....make sure that students behave, learn the language, get plenty of sleep, act responsibly as teen ambassadors of the U.S.A., and are respectful to the citizens of the host countries. After all, isn't that why we want our studednts to travel?.....so that students learn to understand/appreciate different cultures of the world.

These trips are NOT teacher vacations...they must be looked at as educational, student tours. Successful European trips REQUIRE careful preparation for students, parents, and the chaperones. I start preparing my participants nearly a year in advance in order to ensure a memorable, positive, and fulfilling experience for all. My reputation is on the line, so I am obligated to watch every move a company makes....especially pre-trip. So whichever company you choose to travel with, make sure that you compare, research, and ask LOTS of questions. People are spending a LOT of money for these student tours, and the success of your trip lies with a reputable company, pre-trip preparation, a solid itinerary, and a positive, mature teacher/chaperone. FYI...I carefully screen my students, so that only the best of the best travel with me. Lazy students in the classroom will be lazy abroad...whiners will continue to whine. If they want Disneyworld, then let them go to Epcot. And, remember, experience is the best teacher...so keep traveling--it's a learning process.

On 6/24/10, Dick wrote: > Sorry Mr or Mrs Lutheran, but I am not wrong. I have shopped around. > There is one company out there, and I wont name names, but all I have to > do is send a quote by any other company and they will match it and beat > it by $50 per student. I am not here to dis the mom and pop tour > operators of the world. May they have lots of success. I am out for the > BEST and LOWEST price for my students, and that is what I achieve > yearly, and we have mighty fine tours. No offense. > > > On 6/14/10, mslutheran wrote: >> You are quite wrong on this. The 'mom and pop' companies do not >> have the huge overhead and expenses that the big companies do. >> >> We found that out when we 'shopped' the same itinerary to a number >> of companies and the large ones could not touch the price we were >> getting for our trip through our current company. We get better >> value for our money through the smaller companies. >> >> We have also compared our trip against the ones that the local >> middle and high schools are doing with the large companies and ours >> is cheaper, has better hotels and restaurants, and more educational >> activities. >> >> On 6/11/10, Dick wrote: >>> Ok anyone reading this, here is the scoop: >>> >>> The big tour companies are like Walmart. Yes, there are many >>> disadvantageous to using them, but they have the lowest prices >>> (regardless of teacher kick-backs, etc.). The little mom and pop >>> tour companies are more ideal but much more expensive. This aint >>> rocket science folks. If the students can afford the mom and pop >>> companies (Georgia Hardy in Canada is a perfect example) then by >>> all means use them. Who wouldn't choose a specialty store over >>> Walmart? If the students can barely afford the tours the large >>> companies offer, then the small tour operators are not an option. >>> Do people not see this? It is pretty simple to figure out. You >>> cant have your cake and eat it too. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On 5/25/10, Instructours wrote: >>>> I agree completely with Dave. >>>> >>>> While I am not a tour operator, I design student tours >>>> professionally and work with a number of tour operators. All >>>> my school clients have been totally dissatisfied with the >>>> quality of services from large tour operators- which is why >>>> they want someone else to design their educational tours. >>>> >>>> I see, firsthand, how student tour groups are dumped and >>>> herded by large companies. I cannot tell you how often I am >>>> stopped by teachers and parents, in Washington, DC and New >>>> York, and asked for directions, where they can eat, or how to >>>> get into places. Hordes of clueless students run wild through >>>> the Smithsonian museums without any guidance or focus. These >>>> situations are not indicative of trips sponsored through >>>> good companies. >>>> >>>> As with Dave, I've been following many of the discussions on >>>> this board with interest. >>>> >>>> I don't agree with the poster who calls himself/herself, >>>> 'Observer' that there is only a small percentage of complaints >>>> with these large companies. The fact is, good people seldom >>>> complain online, so that the number of complaints on these >>>> sites reflects a much larger number of dissatisfied customers. >>>> After a while, patterns emerge that should not be ignored. >>>> (Most of my clients simply dropped the offending company and >>>> didn't register with the BBB or online complaint sites so they >>>> wouldn't be hassled by the respective companies.) >>>> >>>> Many teachers don't realize that there are alternative ways to >>>> run a trip because just a few big companies dominate the >>>> industry and, as a result, there is not much choice of >>>> destination, itinerary, or vendors. In fact, the same, exact, >>>> itineraries are utilized by most of the large companies. >>>> >>>> Teachers need to be a bit more thoughtful about the choice of >>>> the tour company and not rely on glitzy advertising and >>>> 'stipends'. These extravagant marketing tools should send up >>>> a red flag that more goes into advertising than the tour. >>>> >>>> Bigger is not better. I only work through small and mid-sized >>>> companies since many, like Dave's company (which I have not >>>> worked with), have more practical expertise in the areas, or >>>> regions, they are operating because they are owned and run by >>>> tour professionals rather than sales people; have lower >>>> overhead and less profit margins since they are not supporting >>>> a large infrastructure; have better vendors and vendor >>>> relationships (hotels, restaurants, motorcoaches, and guides; >>>> and care more about the comfort and safety of their groups. >>>> >>>> The subject of contracts has also come up in some older posts >>>> by teachers. This is one of the most important parts of the >>>> process. >>>> >>>> Good companies are able to give you a solid quote upfront with >>>> nothing additional down the line unless the number of >>>> travelers drops (as in the case Dave put forth). Good >>>> companies listen to what you want and try to accommodate your >>>> needs, especially with securing appointments. Good companies >>>> don't have membership fees. Good companies give cash refunds. >>>> Good companies are flexible where payments are concerned and >>>> don't summarily cancel students 60 days or less before as >>>> trip. Good companies put all their promises in writing, and >>>> then deliver what they promise. Good companies pay their >>>> bills on time (check this out with Dun and Bradstreet. Good >>>> companies have excellent company liability insurance and >>>> offer travel/medical/cancellation insurance underwritten by a >>>> bona fide insurance company which is rated by A.M. >>>> Best.(Accept nothing less than a 'A' rating. If it's not >>>> rated by A.M. Best, it's not real insurance.) >>>> >>>> My advice to any teacher is to surf the internet by putting in >>>> search terms that would describe the perfect trip and >>>> destination. You'll be surprised at how many smaller companies >>>> surface. Check them out against the BBB, contact teachers >>>> that have traveled with them, and have a professional go over >>>> their contract and insurance. >>>> >>>> Good luck! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 5/21/10, terreeteau wrote: >>>>> I haven't been on this board in awhile but as I read the >>>>> newer entries I still see the same theme repeated; people >>>>> are dissatisfied with their educational travel experience. >>>>> As a company owner, this concerns me. I sincerely believe >>>>> in the amazing value of these experiences and want to do my >>>>> part to ensure that teachers and group leaders share this >>>>> feeling. >>>>> >>>>> Please read my original post below and let me know what you >>>>> think. >>>>> THANKS >>>>> DAVE >>>>> >>>>> Hey, >>>>> >>>>> I stumbled accross this by accident and thought I could >>>>> perhaps add some insight. >>>>> I've worked in the student tour industry for some time and >>>>> have -full disclosure- >>>>> recently started my own company here in Canada. >>>>> >>>>> Part of my motivation in starting my own company is >>>>> reflected by the numerous >>>>> negative experiences recounted on the board. >>>>> >>>>> I agree with the notion that you're always rolling the dice >>>>> with these types of >>>>> visits; there are so many variables that can add or detract >>>>> from the overall >>>>> enjoyment of the experience. A bad hotel, guide, meal or >>>>> bus driver might be enough >>>>> to have you question repeating the process. >>>>> >>>>> This whole EF vs. Explorica debate can really be boiled >>>>> down to a question of giant >>>>> companies. When everything goes well, the customer is >>>>> happy. As soon as you have a >>>>> problem, their true colours come through. Now you're >>>>> dealing with 'fine print' and >>>>> an endless procession of people that can't (or won't) help >>>>> you. >>>>> >>>>> Really, the best analogy is that EF and Explorica are fast >>>>> food: you get a >>>>> tremendous infrastructure, great prices, incentives and >>>>> prizes. These companies deal >>>>> in volume; to the degree that they expect to lose a certain >>>>> percentage of their >>>>> clients each year due to negligence. >>>>> >>>>> A smaller student travel provider can offer a more humane >>>>> approach. For them, client >>>>> loyalty is paramount. The intent is to forge a long term, >>>>> mutually-beneficial >>>>> relationship. For that reason any problems (there will be >>>>> some!), can be dealt with >>>>> in a constructive manner and -without an oppressive >>>>> hierarchy in place- a direct >>>>> way. For example, my client had some students drop out and >>>>> made some changes to the >>>>> original itinerary that increased the price by $20 per >>>>> person. Rather than go back >>>>> to the parents for the difference, we met in the middle at >>>>> a $10 increase. Simple >>>>> and fair. >>>>> >>>>> The only advice I would give to teachers is to look for a >>>>> company that specializes >>>>> in your destination of choice rather than a monolith that >>>>> tries to be all things to >>>>> all people. The process is long, challenging and expensive; >>>>> you deserve a visit that >>>>> is tailored to your needs. >>>>> >>>>> Any comments are welcome >>>>> Thanks! >>>>> DT >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>

Oct 26, 2010

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